I purchased a 92 Civic with B18c5 swap with ITR trans. He told me that he thinks one of the rings is bad due to at high rpm small amount of smoke shows. he did rebuild the head with skunk2 valves. He says the valves seals were good because he couldn't move them or something? I've never rebuilt a block or head. Just did swaps. I'm wondering what would I need to purschase for a rebuild? The timing belt kit is fairly new. I want to stay oem.

 

All depends how bad the block and head are. Seem pretty questionable with what has been done.
A compression and leak down test would give you more information about what's actually going wrong.

I would start looking into reputable shops in the area to diagnose the problem, and do the machine work required.

 

Ok. Understood. I'll see if any shops can fit me in and do the test.

Just to think ahead where would a good place for to buy parts for a rebuild? Do they have kits?

 

Bad ring in #2. So weres a good place to buy rebuild for rings? Also along with that, other parts & things to do while rebuild? Just rings and pistons? New to rebuilding like I said previously. I have a friend that's built his before but I rather research on my own because he's usually too busy.

 

HONDA should be your stop for rings and any other needed parts. As far as what should be changed is up to you. Really all the seals and gaskets should be replaced 'while your in there', but if your on a budget the valve seals, head gasket, piston rings (only) and oil pan gasket are about the only things that will 'need' replacement.

 

From what the previous owner says. Only after market parts in the block is rod bolts & b18c Pistons. I'm going to do all the seals/gaskets, rings, & bearings. I called a shop about the bearings & I was told they are color coded so when I find out what color they are then I'll know what ones to order...is this true? also b16 gasket sets are the same right? Good kit brand for that? For bearings I'm going with acl. oem for rings I'm guessing?

 

go to an acura/honda dealership and buy the gasket kits, I would stay with oem for everything

 

Alright. So from what the Previous owner also tells me the Head is rebuilt. Jun 3 cams. Skunk2 Valves. Crower Springs Dual & retainers. So since the Pistons are B18c do oem b18c5 rings & oem gasket/seals & oem rod bearings?

I called a tuner shop about the bearings and I was told the bearings would have a color on them to determine the ones I will need? this is correct right? I Know I asked this in my last reply. Just trying to get a strait answer.

I was also wondering, whats the easiest way to do this all? Remove head & hoses. Can trans stay on? Remove oil pan and what ever else then unbolt the rods?

Also anything on the rods or pistons I should replace? ARP head studs were installed 2k miles ago. I guess the connecting rod bolts are arp also.


So oem parts:
Rings
Gaskets/Seals
Rod bearings

 

Alright. So from what the Previous owner also tells me the Head is rebuilt. Jun 3 cams. Skunk2 Valves. Crower Springs Dual & retainers. So since the Pistons are B18c do oem b18c5 rings & oem gasket/seals & oem rod bearings?

I called a tuner shop about the bearings and I was told the bearings would have a color on them to determine the ones I will need? this is correct right? I Know I asked this in my last reply. Just trying to get a strait answer.

I was also wondering, whats the easiest way to do this all? Remove head & hoses. Can trans stay on? Remove oil pan and what ever else then unbolt the rods?

Also anything on the rods or pistons I should replace? ARP head studs were installed 2k miles ago. I guess the connecting rod bolts are arp also.


So oem parts:
Rings
Gaskets/Seals
Rod bearings

Also, what about LMAs? Aftermarket ones?

 

IF ANYTHING, the only part and ONLY part that NEEDS to be OEM are the bearings, rod bearing and MAIN bearings. Yes they are also color coded, also they crank and rods will have markings on them to help you 'start out' sizing the correct ones. They will always have to be checked and double checked. It would really help you out a TON if you could track down a service manual on one of these engines. GSR would likely do the trick as well.
The only way that building and engine like this should be done is out of the car. Especially if you are spec-ing out new bearings. Trans will need to come off, and head will obviously need to come off as well.
If the rod bolts are arp or aftermarket in brand you can throw the OEM bearings out the window as the rod ends will need resizing when using new bolts. Also I would stay away from ACL or any aftermarket bearings unless you are a professional engine builder and have the needed tools to size these bearings correctly.
As far as comparing the motor to another OEM motor, all the gaskets in the HEAD will match up with b16a/1/2, all the bottom end parts will match up with B18c/1/5.
Again I'll reiterate which OEM parts should be used: All of them.
Honda sells complete gasket kits for this engine. 06110-P73-A03 and 06111-PR4-030, rings, bearings and bolts should all be OEM as well. Valve train/cams are ok being aftermarket, headstuds as well.

 

Would a Machine shop know how to resize my rods? how do i know if i even need to resize my rods? From what i read the rod buttoms become more oblong(unable to see with your own eyes) due to wear on the rods. The machine shop would make them more circlar? I was told the block was all p73 but from what the bottoms of the rods say they are p72. GSR rods same as p73? The pistons are p73-00. Looking at cyl 3 i see/feel just one scratch that i run into. I'm hoping I don't have to bore. The rod bearings have some wear on some parts, others bearly and wear. I'm comparing from what i seen online and videos. The crank, from what i can see looks shinny with no issues. BUT still going to have it looked at by the machine shop.

Curious. How many miles should a oil pump be changed? Previous owner said 8k ago.


I greatly appreciate your feedback!

 

Yes, a reputable shop could resize your rods, but if you plan to retain the use of OEM bearings I would steer you away from this. This will put you at the absolute zero mark on resizing bearings. (remember there are several ways to size out OEM bearings with OEM rods and crank)I wouldn't let your average machine shop size out bearings for this. Especially a Honda bearing, they are very very tight tolerances, not like a chevy V8 most machine shops in the US are used to sizing out. Another note, the rod ends will not become egg-ed out or oblong after normal use, in fact the rods dont really 'wear' at all, thats what the bearing is in place for, if you add an extreme element like lack of lubrication or excessive heat or knock then maybe, but I've never heard of them just 'wearing' oblong. They will become oblong if you use an aftermarket (ARP) rod bolt. The added amount of torque will egg them out.
If the crank looks good then let it eat, I wouldn't bother taking it to them. A visual inspection should suffice. If the journals look good then I think you should be fine.
The ITR rod is stamped with P72, but somewhere on the rod it will have an 'R' stamping.
On the cylinder block, depending on how deep the scratch is they may be able to hone it out. A good machinist can take out .001-.002, keep it round and will still be in spec with OEM ring gap.
If you can run your fingernail across it and it catches after it is honed then you will have an issue.
Cliff notes:
-Leave rods alone, don't resize. If they need resizing, replace with new OEM.
-Use Honda bearings
-Very unlikely you need your rods resized.

During normal use... never... Unless you have an issue with it. I service cars with 200k+ running the original pump. If you are doing a complete rebuild then yes, I say do a new pump. But if it was just replaced, I would clean it up and leave it.

 

Thanks for all your posts so far! Very informative! So I did the tear down of the engine today. Made 2 videos that hopefully can give you an idea what I'm working with. Taking the bare block to the machine shop tomorrow along with the crank to be looked at just in case.

Update: added third video.

 

Ttt

 

A couple of those bearings are in rough shape, and the pistons and cylinder also. I don't think anything short of a proper rebuild and over bore will suffice.

 

Sorry, so a over bore .020 will not work?

This good place to get a type r over sized piston sets?http://www.icbmotorsport.com/intyrpikitb11.html

I'm new to rebuilding. Slowly learning and eager to learn. Currently at the shop I have head for valves to be seated properly, block to be checked honed or over bore to 0.020, crank to be inspected & polished, & flywheel to be ressurfaced.

 

.020 over bore would likely work just fine. Did you confirm those are standard size? Honda did a really nice job on the factory engine, make sure to do your homework.

 

head:
tear down
hot tank
media blast
deck
valve job
reface oem valves (if still useable condition)
valve seals
oem stuff (orfice orings, cam cap o-ring, camshaft oring, dist oring, oem head gasket)
check guide to valve stem clearenace to see if they are within spec or guides are too worn.

block:
tear down
media blast
overbore (81.5mm) itr replica pistons are fine & proven to work just as well as $300 oem pistons. Make sure machinist measures each piston and bore accordingly assigning them a bore.
hot tank
deck
oem stuff (block oil control ring, oil pump oring, coolant pip oring, thermo gasket & thermostate, oil pump, oil pan gasket, water pump, timing belt, pick up gasket)
micropolish crank
recondition big rod ends... i'd install arp hardware for piece of mind
acl bearings
press off oild itr pistons, sell them to someone else
install new pistons on (heat up small end)


$1700-2100 will cover all parts & machining depending on where you get your parts and what your machine shop charges.

aside from machining, engine rebuild process is what will really determin how long it will last.

GL

 

When I took my crank and block in the machinist requested i bring the rest of the block in, rack/cradle/bolts, & piston/rods. He's going to messure for me and let me know. Cyl 3 was the bad cyl out of the whole block. The scratch is pretty noticable. Other then that from what i seen online on other blocks the wear looks normal. To bad i have to overbore



Everything going to be done but didn't know about the Valve guide clearances. Will check that once I get it back. A work buddy installed Skunk2 Valves + Retainer + Springs. He said everything else looked/felt good. Then again he's not a machinist/machanic. I'm assuming he didn't seat the valves correctly. After he rebuilt the head he put about 1k miles on it. Reason why the head was rebuilt due to timing belt breaking and damaging old oem valves. Would the contribute to cyl 3 being damaged? Or other things?

Those are replica ones in that link? I'm going to order those soon then so I can bring them to the machinist, he said he will be able to get to my block in the next 2 weeks due to spring is the busiest season for him. Plus only high recommended machine shop around here. Reconditioning rod ends isn't really needed is it? This engine was only NA. ARP rod bolts arn't reusable? Pressing off old pistons? Are they held in with a snap ring on both sides? I'm going to go with OEM Bearings again. When I order rod bearings do they also come with the other bearings also? In one of those Videos I did ask about those 2 bearings that sit on the side inside the block. Those come with rod bearing set also? 3 of the old b18c pistons are good but 1 of them are damaged on the trans side and timing belt side. Which that 1 isn't sellable/usable right? Rod bearings/Main bearings/Journal bearings - I was told they are color coded? I seen no colors at all so plastigage will help determine right size? The green plastigage right? As for the gaskets and seals, I got a Shopping cart ready to go. Should I go nippon or those Type R ones I put in #16 reply? I called that number in that web address and they say they only sell OEM, no replicas. TYPE-R is my dream engine, but I didn't think it'd take over $1500.00 to rebuild everything. Overtime here I come :D


Should I go Nippon, Shown here http://www.ebay.com/itm/181710915395?item=181710915395&viewitem=&vxp=mtr
or From this website Pistons >> http://www.icbmotorsport.com/intyrpikitb11.html

Rings >> http://www.icbmotorsport.com/jdmdctyrrise1.html


Other questions. When I'm breaking in my new clutch and the engine. How would I drive? Just up to 3k every shift? Never on Highway. Because highway around here is 65mph & i'm around 4500k in 5th gear going 65mph. I know its 500miles to break in.

Greatly appreciate everyone's replies! Means a lot!

 

TTT

 

Ok, could some one show me options for pistons? Those repica ones, Nippon ones? For nippon I'm not sure what ones to get? Ones that say floating and ones that dont?

When getting rod bearings do they come with main bearings? Also are those thrust bearings reusable? Or is there a kit for those? I'm not sure where to look for bearings/main/thrust bearings.

Btw the machine shop finished my head and informed me they replaced all the exhaust guides.

 

Get OEM pistons.
Go with over bore 81.25mm ITR pistons. (I'm hoping he didn't bore your block already)
or oversized P30 pistons.
Bearings will all be purchased individually and should not be reused.
Why did he replace the exhaust guides?

 

OR even these if its already bored. IL4 Performance Pro-Cast Pistons

 

Well the shop told me when they do the honing to try to get that scratch out in Cylinder 3 out but if it doesn't then they will call me to let me know what's the next step. 81.25? I thought next was 81.50? Please direct me to the .25 & .50 ones? Also with rings & wrist pins? And anything else? I ask for help because there are so many choices out there & there could also be sites/products that are a bad choice to go with. Keep in mind I run all stock besides Jun 3 cams(vtec bigger lobes) & p28 chipped type r map. Rev limit set @ 9500 from what previous owner says. Never hit, just around 8000. I told the shop that valves were bent on exhaust side & previous owner replaced the valves. I told them because I read the guides can be damaged from bent valves. They said the intake guides are in spec. The head was also milled & hot tanked & valve job.

 

Per any service manual from Honda if the bore needs to be greater than 81.25mm the block is at discard bore and the block will be replaced. Therefore the biggest OEM Honda piston made is 81.25mm for B16/B18.
Here is a +.25mm overbore Type R pistons, I have ordered from this site before they are legit. JDM Honda P73 Type R Piston Sets 0.25 Over Size
Anything 81.5 is aftermarket. I would stay away from Nippon, most of their stuff seems like it's from 2003 and the quality is not there. The inline4 stuff seems very nice.
You can LITERALLY get any bore piston from 81-86 for a b series.
YOU HAVE TO PICK WHICH ONES YOU WANT or NEED.
Don't be so wishy-washy, it's just a piston, man up and ask the machinist how much needs to be taken out of that cylinder.