Hi All, Thanks in advance for any help!

This is my first post to a car forum, and only my fourth or so to any forum, so I apologize in advance any less than positive consequences of this.

I have a 2005 Civic VP ,(Dx), 1.7L, D17A1 engine. It’s a long irrelevant story how I got into the present situation so for brevity I’ll start where things are:

Four weeks ago I had a used engine installed at a local shop who found the engine for me. They did a good enough job installing it, but I’m not confident in their communication since then. I have no one knowledgeable to ask questions about this, and I’ve tried to figure it out searching Civic forums for relevant information, but I could really use some good opinions.

During my first freeway trip after getting this engine installed I noticed an engine sound difficult to describe after I got off the freeway and would accelerate from a stop. The engine would seem to loose power on acceleration and make the noise hard to describe. It does this now whenever I take a freeway trip. Also, anytime I pop the hood when the car is warmed up and rev the engine (maybe 2400 to 3000 rpm I guess no tachometer) the engine makes a rattling sound coming from the block like a hammer randomly tapping on a piece of steel. Not horribly loud, but certainly audible under the hood. It does not make this noise when cold even at high rpms. I strongly suspect Detonation, but it could be a bearing or something else as far as I know.

I then took the Civic back to the garage who adjusted the valves and replaced the throttle position sensor, which was good to do, but they said they could not hear the sound. Of course the sound was there right away when I got home and pop the hood rev the engine etc. Before I go back in to them I want to have a better idea of my options.

There is a 90 day warranty on the engine, which I suspect only covers the $850 I bought the engine for, I don’t know what is typical for that? So if I got another used engine I would have to pay the $1000 installation fee again bringing the total to about $3000 overall for this situation, and now I’m unconfident about getting another used engine, what if that’s bad too I’m totally you know what then. Yet if I’m lucky I could only maybe get $3000 to $4000 at most if I tried to sell the car as is costing me about $4000 to get a decent replacement. I don’t even know how I could sell this car as is without lying about it.

By the way the rest of the car and transmission are is in A1 condition and not a negative factor of consideration in all this.

I think maybe this used engine was a dud from the start because I found about two quarters size amounts of black sludge plugging the radiator cap, only once so far though just before I became aware of the negative engine sounds. Could this be an oil leak into the cooling system as a consequence of a long standing Detonation issue before I even got this replacement engine I’m wondering? If so I’m skeptical to putting much resources into solving that Detonation problem, because will it still be there after hundreds of dollars spent and back to square one?

The previous engine threw a timing belt, and maybe the lower end is still good as before that, I don’t know if that can be easily and reliably ascertained. If it were ok the head on the one in there now seems ok, and I wonder if I should have them swap that head onto the old block and install that for I guess maybe $1600 total, which might be feasible if I could simultaneously get the warranty refund from the junkyard (giving them only their lower block while keeping the head myself), but if not I would be out that $850 getting back the warranty refund.

I don’t think I like the risk of a remanufactured engine unless I could find one I could be confident in that they did a great job remanufacturing it is a precision process. O’rielly auto has one available for $2800, but how good would that be? Plus the grand to install seems like a big risk to loose on taking.

Or if it is a Detonation problem how long before the engine dies? Should I just drive it hoping I can get my money’s worth about 26,000 to 36,000 miles for me since I might not get much trying to sell the car as is.

Opinions: where do I go from here?

 

dont know much about the differences in the Civic VP( i just bought an LX with blown motor which i swapped) but these motors have knock sensors which should retard timing when detonation occurs , i just wonder if the new used motor had a bad sensor that was not swapped when they changed the motor ,or the sensor was not connected at all (realistically it should set a code if knock sensor is bad ).
does the check engine light work on the dash and does it come on or stay on ? any codes set?

a little pinging might occur if you whack the throttle open quickly from idle as these engines run pretty lean(and your making it go very lean quickly) ,but sustained pinging will do serious damage quickly on these little motors so it wont last long if detonation is bad...

 

Hi spdracrm3, thanks for the reply.

There could be a problem with the knock sensor, or carbon buildup etc. The D17A1 is similar to what is in the Lx I think, only difference is the Lx is probably a D17A2 vtec. After more information tonight I don't think it will be any more reason to find out why it is making noise because the engine probably has serious problems. No codes or MIL light though. Where did you get your motor,and what made you decide it was a good bet to put in out of curiosity spdracrm3?

New information tonight: More black sludge on the radiator cap, and I think the oil level is low. I will confirm that in the morning. In that case I have no doubt the engine has serious problems and must be replaced.

I mended fences with a mechanic friend, and he found a $1900 replacement re manufactured engine from Promar online (anybody have any knowledge of the reliability of this? Or do people think all re manufactured Honda engines are a bad bet?) They have a three year warranty, but again it's not clear if that covers installation, I'll have to call and ask soon this time.

If the junkyard would cover the cost of having to install a motor again, as I think they should, that would make this option even more likely.

My only other option I can think of at this point is to try to trade this in at a dealership for a different car, but I doubt they would give me much, and I would probably have to spend another $5000 to take a risk on a different used car with who knows what potential problems it seems to me. And as I would have to leave the engine in I would not be able to get my $850 back from the junkyard it was purchased from on top of it all.

If I could trust the workmanship of the engine from Promar then I would have a decent car. I would have to be certain that I can get any of the oil sludge flushed out from the transmission cooling lines that got in there from this piece of junk, junk engine though.

 

Update: I took the car in to the garage that installed the engine to demonstrate the sound. It wouldn't do it this time like it would every single other time I pop the hood and rev the engine.

I showed him a small smear of the sludge I found last night on the radiator cap, but he's not certain it is oil. I think he said he doesn't know how oil could get in the cooling, maybe I mis heard him before.

I don't know maybe the high octane fuel I put in last week is "solving" the Detonation issue if there is one for now. He said to put regular gas back in and we'll see. They will look at the car Friday maybe, and check things like the egr, knock senor etc, and look at the sludge in the antifreeze.

I still think the oil level is going down maybe so I'll have to keep a close eye on it.