Hey HT. It's this arsehole again.

I am worried that injecting the meth BEFORE the throttle body would cause it to go through the JRSC blower and cause wear on the turbines.

My JRSC looks to be in almost perfect condition and there is a nice thin oil coating on the turbines of the blower. The internals all look very healthy.

Injecting it before the throttle body would dissolve my nice oil coating on the turbines and do god-knows-what to the rest of the internals. I'm looking to run 50/50 and methanol is a harsh solvent that would strip the oil off the turbines and I'm worried that the water could put me at risk for rust and other accelerated wear on the inside of the blower/manifold.

What does HT think?

Will I be causing accelerated wear on the internals of the JRSC by injecting the 50:50 meth/water BEFORE the throttle body?

The JRSC instructions clearly label a 'water injection port' on the manifold, but I'm worried that the meth won't make it equally into each cylinder if I inject it there. I don't reaaally want to put together a direct port meth injection and have to tap holes in the manifold runners but that's a last resort.

{Yes I am reading the meth thread right now and it's all very helpful but doesn't answer my question.}

 

FWIW this is on a b20v. But I don't think my 'setup' is relevant to answering this question

 

Rotors not turbines

Depending on the volume injected and nozzle design, if it doesn't atomize completely it "might" cause some slight pitting but only when the blower is spinning near max rpm.

I know with pre turbo injection if you don't have proper atomization and aim the nozzle at the center of the wheel that it can cause pitting and blade damage, but that's on thin aluminum spinning 100,000+ rpm

 

Not with the fine mist of those nozzles, the heat in the combustion chamber will atomize so quickly it would never have an effect on those rotors.

He's fine.

 

Rotors, thanks.

It's the small nozzle in the AEM kit I just bought. It says it's rated for 200-350hp (315cc/min}

My calculations say that my jrsc blower will be spinning @ ~15k rpm with my setup (9.8psi}

Yes I am worried about pitting and rust. Worried that my perfect 'coating' on the rotors will be damaged.

 

Are we sure about this, mate?

I should really finish reading the meth thread before replying to these posts but I have so much going on right now it's not even funny.

brb 16 tabs open all related to JRSC.

*mad scientist building frankenstein in his lab crew*

I'm looking into direct port injection and tapping individual nozzles into my intake runners w/a four-way distribution valve to ensure equal distribution from one cylinder to the next.

brb build thread coming once I upload my pics I'll link it here.

 

AND WHOEVER THE ******* IS TRYING TO OUTBID ME ON THE 3.8" JRSC NOSE PULLEY ON EBAY RIGHT NOW I URGE YOU TO STOP BIDDING BECAUSE MY BUDGET FOR THAT LITTLE PIECE OF ROUND METAL IS OVER 9000 AND YOU ARE ONLY MAKING THIS HARD ON YOURSELF!

 

These are my rotors after 4gph...



do yourself a favor and spray in the manifold, spraying into the blower defeats the purpose of having it. Where are you going to put the air inside the rotors if you have to fit water in there when its spinning. Get me?

 

Spawne, everyone, read this

http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.c...icle_info.html

Pre turbo/supercharger doesn't make it move leas air, it makes it move more as it makes the intake air denser and as it compresses the methanol/air mixture expands even more taking all of the heat out of thecharger outlet

 

It will actually increase the efficiency of whatever you put it in front of... the water/methanol molecules are so small they squeeze in between the air molecules and take up almost no space in the pipe

 

Take that AIS link and shove it lol i had it out with that guy over his meth kit that i had to replace damn near every component of. Turbo's work alot differently then superchargers, on a 45 cubic inch blower, water WILL displace air and it does slow the rotors down. It doesn't cool the intake charge down enough to make the air that dense. You gain more power spraying after the blower because its cooling effect is in the combustion chamber, not the intake charge. Stabilizing combustion through the higher octane of the methanol, and the cooling effect of the water is what allows you to run more timing, and allows you to gain power. I learned this first hand with my tests on the drag strip. 15.5 with no meth, 15.6-15.7 running meth before the blower and running higher timing.

 

What kind of jet? A decent jet should allow the meth to vaporize as soon as it exits. Also sizing pre-charger is different then sizing for pre-throttle body

 

What do you mean what kind of jet? They only make one kind, micro droplet jets from devils own. It doesnt vaporize, it mist's, its still mixed with water that doesnt compress. As it passes through the rotors it displaces air in exchange for water filling the small cavity's between the rotors. The weight of how much its drawing in slows the rate at which the blower spins. It doesn't have this effect on turbos though because the compressor operates differently. Even still, over a certain amount and you are essentially flooding the system.

 

A few jets vaporize, depending on inlet pressure

Methanol at the dilution rates we use won't cause aluminum erosion when done right.

The problem with positive displacement superchargers is that they don't spin fast enough compared to turbos/centrifugal superchargers so the mixture might have an issue with pooling/adhering to the rotors, which is evident in your case,

The problem with after the supercharger on jsrc's is there isnt enough distance from jet to intake ports to evenly distribute the mixture

 

A company called i-fog has a system where the jet design actually vaporizes the mixture and they've somehow figures out how to get systems pressures of 1000psi Pre nozzle, don't ask me ho because I don't know. It basically looks like smoke, their system at only 100psi produces a decent smoke like mist

 

I had a 250psi pump on my system which atomized plenty and i was using wide angle foggers behind the JRSC manifold, it covered the entire surface area of the manifold using dual 2gph nozzles the second time around. The vaporizing nozzles are 48 bucks a piece, they sell them at mcmaster carr. lol None of the aluminum was corroded on my blower, but it did strip the teflon coating off in a matter of a few thousand miles.

 

That's weird, why would the coating come off

Link to the nozzles?

 

Wow. This is all good information.

I'm reading that link and still deciding if I should put the nozzle on the back of the JRSC manifold in the 'water injection port' that they point out in the instruction manual or if I should inject BEFORE the throttle body in the intake tube like AEM instruction manual wants me to.

Also considering putting a 4-way valve and drill/tap a nozzle into each individual runner on the manifold but I won't know about that until I get back to my shop and have a look at the manifold.

Thanks and bump for the best choice of the three options ^^^

 

I'm worried about even distribution between cylinders if I just inject in the back of the manifold's 'water injection port'

 

you cant really see them well, and i dont have any other pics of the new setup when it was on the car, but i had my manifold tapped for dual 2gph nozzles, and given that you have a jrsc, i wouldnt go anymore then that. If you did run individual runners, AEM makes nozzles that i believe calidad used in his build that have check valves built in. Dont run more then 1gph on each runner.

 

4759T11 is the part number

http://www.mcmaster.com/#atomizing-nozzles/=l0s5ar

I was told that methanol did not react with teflon, however...it would see that this is not true at all lol.

 

It probably had to do with the velocity of the methanol... if a large quantity is being injected it ,might overwhelm the charger

 

what exactly in your definition would be enough to overwhelm the charger

 

lol --- slow it down?

just playing devils advocate.

I'm also NOT LOOKING TO INCREASE THE DRAG ON MY BLOWER because belt slippage is already a problem with a 3.8 nose pulley and 4-rib belt.

 

why are you changing the nose pulley anyway, why not just get a stepper or a CRV crank pulley?