There is some concern I had about the purchase of a Tig Welder.
Due to the high interest regarding this next big investment towards my Garage, I wanted
to come out here, and obtain information on what will get me a decent tig welder
for performing the following tasks in the future...
- 22-40 Gauge steel
- Turbo Downpipes
- Exhausts
- Dumptubes
- Intercooler Piping
- Roll Cage maybe down the road.

Currently, my garage has a 120 volt. What's this high frequency characteristic that these Tig welders share ?
Do I have to worry about any of that ? Also, I'm interested in the diversion 165, but I heard you can't
really control the amount of heat into your polarity ?

As far as quality, Will this effect the aluminum welds for instance ?

 

TTT. Anybody ? :/ I know someone's got an answer out there.

 

Diversion 165 won't work on 120V, needs 240V. You can't adjust balance or freq with the Diversion, but for a starter machine I highly doubt that's going to hold you back.

The Diversion 180 can do ~120A or so on 120V, but at that price I might start looking at other options.


The Hobart EZ-Tig 165i is exactly like the Diversion 165, but comes with a regular torch and a foot pedal. It's a little bit cheaper as well. I'm pretty much set on getting that when I get into my new house. Might want to look into it.

 

the diversion 165 is the best ac/dc starter welder IMO.


mike

 

Sweet. i'll definitely start looking into the diversion. I just want real high quality welds,
and possibly the best looking welds as well down the road when I start doing
manifolds. That is if I ever get that good enough.

 

Thank you for your positive feedback. In that case, I will choose the Miller diversion 165
as a beginner welder, and continue experimenting with it for attaining proper technique.

As we're speaking, I'm getting familiar with introducing myself to different metals, and
how their properties differ.

It's a lot more fun than automotive!

 

Most people add a $150-180 foot pedal to the Diversion 165 since it comes with only a wacky finger control and a bigger torch.

Did you even read my post where I said the Hobart EZ-Tig 165i is the exact same welder as the Diversion 165 with a foot pedal and smaller torch (easier to handle) at a lower price?

 

Yeah i did, but the only reason I'm refusing the Hobart Purchase is because of the name "Miller."

Then again, I really don't know. I'm going to do more research, and compare the two
welders for their in depth detail.

 

So i did a little bit more research ...

Now I'm a little frustrated after my research.
After going a little bit more in depth into detail, I come across Duty Cycle.

How exactly is duty cycle determined ?

http://www.rodovens.com/welding_articles/tig_welder.htm

I read the article up above, and it indeed clarified a lot of info, but I'm still confused
about how this duty cycle is calculated near a conclusion.

It says duty cycle is the number of minutes a 10 minute Tig Welder can operate,
until it needs an actual break for cool down.

Let's say for example I set the Tig Welder to put out about an 80 AMP current, instead
of 200, and the machine consists of a 30% duty cycle.

Can I weld more than 3 Minutes ? Or do I have to stop at about 3 Minutes to let
it cool down ?

I have the money in hand, I'm just browsing for the best product out there.

 

Miller and Hobart are owned by the same company IIRC

 

that's what I have been told by my instructor and on the forum here. Here's the spec sheet for the diversion 165.
60A @ 100% duty cycle
150A @ 20% duty cycle
165A @ 15% duty cycle
http://www.millerwelds.com/pdf/spec_sheets/AD1-5.pdf

 

They're the exact same machine - just different accessories, and colored sheet metal. But if you've got to have a blue box, your money.


Duty cycle is rated on a 10 min total time. So 165A gets you 1.5 minutes of welding and 8.5 minutes of resting with the machine cooling off. Then 1.5 minutes of welding, 8.5 mins of rest etc.

At 60A you can weld flat out.

 

Sweet. The diversion 180 has a 115v output as well.

What's the maximum amperage you can max out at 115v ?
This depends on the thickness of my previous wire in the house, correct ?

Like how much input amperage I need to run the Diversion 180 at 115v ?
In other words, what amperage circuit breaker for the factory household 120v ?

 

If you're going to buy a welder don't bother with 110, just get a 220 line set up for it.

 

Love the responses, thanks for chiming in all of you! I know these questions have
probably been answered before on more in depth welding forums, but this is why the
fabrication thread is alive!!

Wish it was that easy bro.

I was going to do it that way. Had an electrician come in today to check out the house,
and see what fuse panel the garage runs off of.

At the moment the only problem with the house is trying to find the location of the fuse panel, controlling the lights inside the Garage.

I wanna say...
at about 10-15 feet, the Garage remains independently separated away from the house.
Finding the fuse panel's exact location makes it very difficult.
The fact of the matter is: I rent the house monthly. It's similar to a Duplex in
comparison, and is shared by 3 different families.

Tomorrow in the morning, I am going to contact the home owner to see if installation can
be approved. If not ... :/ then I really don't know what my other remedy is besides
the Diversion 180.

What's so bad about running the 180 off of the 120v outlet anyways ? Besides the fact
that it can not go over 125amps at 35% Duty cycle ? If I'm using it at 70-80 shouldn't I be fine if I'm only doing like body work sheet metal for now ? All I'm trying to do is
some quarter panels on the back of my EK, and I always wanted a Tig Welder.

Maybe I should contact an electrician that owns an actual professional company instead of an
Unknown friend that knows a Guy who I doesn't have any background information
on electrical.

 

Hi , you will never be able to do any reasonable welding on 120v on aluminum over 100amps If all you really want to do is weld bodywork then I think a mig is better

 

Yeah I think you guys are right.

I'm just going to mig weld my current project and finish up the body work on it, and then
when I get a bigger house sometime next year by the end of winter I'll definitely start looking
into the 230v inlet.

Thanks again!

 

my Eastwood 200 came with a 230 plug, but also with a 115 adapter. 230 welds better, but 115 def. still gets the job done

 

Like what exactly do you mean welds better ? Like its better quality ?

 

Understand that the welder is going to be heavily limited by that 110 line, and while I'm sure it'll be ok for doing exhaust piping and maybe even schedule, I am almost positive you will see a much more stable arc with a 220v line. It's a lot less work that the machine has to do. In a pinch 110 works, but no way I would ever want it to be my basis.

I personally use the Diversion 165 myself. It's a great machine and has done me well, will probably keep it around until it finally gives up completely.

 

^Legit stuff!

One last question I had.

Supposedly I encountered an electrician the other day to help me set up a 230v inlet in my
garage. Regarding a circuit breaker, he asked me what amperage that switch should be
classified as ? He noted 80 amps ? But if the machine takes anything over 80 amps,
isn't that circuit breaker going to trigger it'self anytime a current draw of 80 amps
is set ? For example, 130 amps @ AC for Aluminum ?

 

The engine is still stepping up the current in the machine, its not pulling that much from the plug.

I have a 100A service, I've read on here that guys run as low as 30A, but that to me sounds pretty low. 80A would be a pretty safe bet.

 

i just got a everlast 200dx i like it. i learned to weld with on my own. i have never had tig welder for aluminum untill this one. i could not say how it compares to a miller, but my friend that works for race shop says it welds just as good as there miller when he uses my everlast. he told the guys at his work about it they told him a everlast welder was junk you pay for what u get,but he cant tell the differents. but as for using 110 its not worth it.

 

What's up EF9! lol If your budget allows get the miller but dont dismiss the Hobart. I havent used their tig but they make great machines and it's not like the diversion is going to be a step up from it, there basically the same. If I was buying one or the other I would def. save the cash and get the hobart. On 115v my dynasty would run out of steam around 120 amps or so before poping the breaker. You won't be able to do much aluminum with that but there is alot of things you can Tig weld for a car that don't require that much amps. I'm sure you will be real happy with either machine! Cheers!

 

Stick with the miller. Easier to get parts supplies and tech. Information. Used their MIG machine and plasma cutters,never had a problem.