Anyone know if the CR flywheel weighs just as much as a regular AP2 flywheel (~22 lbs)?

 

yes

y wouldnt it b?

 

yup, drive train is the exact same as any other AP2...people just pay 10 grand more for them over other AP2's for the looks...and honestly, the only thing i like from the cr are the seats

 

isnt the suspension bit different?

 

CR has lower ratio steering rack, stiffer suspension, and wider tires (stock) and thats about it. The rest are cosmetic i believe.. So yes, same flywheel.

 

thats not part of the drive train bro

 

- no AC or stereo (can add for $1000.00 extra)
- front and rear spoiler (standared)
- higher spring rates
- stiffer anti roll bars
- quicker steering ratio
- lighter (of course without any AC system and standared cloth seats)
- no soft top (hardtop standared)
- no spare tire (has tire repair kit)

 

basicaly an 00-01ap1 with the ap2 drive train and "functional aero"

 

yeah!

 

I like the shorter steering ratio rack. That's about it.

 

it would be a nice track car if you wanted to keep warranty. I would feel better beating the **** out of it on the track.

 

theres no point on getting one unless ur gona keep it stock. cause whats the point of paying all that extra cash for **** that ur gona throw out anyways. makes more sence to get a high millege ap1 and ull have enough money to do do an f22 swap along with coils and wheels/tires and still have mad money left over

 

i wish they would have made a type r or some other variant...they could have done it

 

stiffer suspension, removable hardtop, and seats were enough for me

 

Just for looks? There's a lot more to the CR than looks.

I disagree. and that "functional aero" really is functional. The spring rates, swaybars, and shock damping is different. It doesn't drive like a 00-01 AP1. It's kind of "close", but not quite.

That comes up often. I have to disagree. Think of the ITR. 25 more hp, reinforced chassis, lighter weight, less standard "luxuries" (A/C and radio delete), no sound deadening, bigger brakes, stiffer suspension, and aero...and a red valve cover(s). Everyone can agree than the ITR was a vast improvement over any stock Integra, I hope.

The CR had lighter weight, A/C and radio delete, stiffer suspension, reinforced chassis, and aero....and all S2000s had a red valve cover. Pretty damn close to "type R" status.

The difference is that CTRs, ITRs and NSX-Rs had a lot of "fat" to trim off and had room for power improvements at reasonable costs. The S2000 is hard edged enough in base trim that there's not much "fat" to remove and increasing power becomes INSANELY expensive.

The other issue is that the S2000 market was very limited to begin with due to the car's character. The people old enough to buy them brand new didn't nessecarily want such a hard edged car. That's why you see so many more corvettes, 350Zs, Mustangs, etc. on the road. They were a higher "percieved" value per dollar. Admittedly, the S2000 didn't look that great on paper. You had to drive it hard and really be in tune with it to realize the value for your dollar. It wasn't BLATANT value, like in say, the 350Z.

S2000s didn't come with heated leather, big displacement, torque, automatic transmissions, defrosting mirrors, or a butler like the other cars did. If Honda were to make a "type R" that was THAT much more hard edged, it would have an even more limited market. Plus adding power (even 10-20more HP than base) would come at a VERY high cost. How much does it cost in the aftermarket (not worrying about emissions, longevity, ease of use, or driveablility) to make power in S2000s?

Your complaint would have then been "who the F wants to buy a $60,000 4 cylinder car that doesn't come with A/C, radio, and only makes 10-20 more HP than base?!".

They could have gone F.I....but again...cost vs. market. They'd have to beef up the driveline, the cooling system, the motor mounts, etc. etc. Remember than an factory car has to meet much more strict criteria than a purpose built personal car.

I think the CR is a pretty big step up in performance from any stock S2000. If you wanted a quick track car with a warranty, the CR is your ticket. If you're modding the car, then the CR's advantages might be limited to the hard top (only an advantage if you don't like soft top convenience), and the "exclusivity".

The same can be said for any type R model. You can mod a Integra GS or GSR or RS to meet or beat the performance of a stock or modded ITR. Same with CTRs, NSX-Rs, Accord Euro Rs, etc.

The CR is genuinely good. Trust me.

 

dude, i already knew everything you just typed, and i believed you are misinformed...for the money, id rather have an AP1, because honestly, the CR is not that much faster on the track, nor does it feel any more responsive than an AP1...ive driven both, and for the price, the CR did not impress me, sorry...and i think they're hideous with that wing, the aero ****, and those ugly *** wheels they put on them...give me the seats and the hardtop and you can keep everything else on that car....and to conclude this long *** rant of mine, honda could have got another 20 hp out if it without breaking the bank...up the compression, tune the fuel and ignition maps, make the exhaust bigger and youre damn near there...but everyone is entitled to their opinions, i just dont think the "added performance" justifies the price being since all they really did was take all the good things about an AP1 and all the good things of an AP2 and put it in one car

 

Upping the compression enough males for more NOx emissions. So would tuning the maps, etc. The car has to pass very strict criteria in all directions for honda to be able to release it as a production car.

The cr "want that different/great" because the stock S2000's performance level was already very high. It's ride quality, NVH, and other "annoyance" factors for the intended demographic were already on the borderline.

Can't improve much on something that's near perfect. I think the CR turned out great.

 

my point is that if ur gona keep the car stock and have the money for one the cr is where its at for a weekend warrior but if ur gona mod it u might as well go with a cheaper ap2 or ap1

 

gonna have to disagree with you there as far as the American market goes (since the CR is the US version of whatever variant in Japan). The S2000 is well under any criteria, it wasn't in the interest of Honda as a company because they felt the S2000 as their flagship RWD car had succeeded IMO. Why would they improve it on the year they were going to end production that year? that's what my take on the "why wasn't the CR gobs better" issue.

 

I can get with that to a certain extent. But to put all the sweet stuff on a base AP2 to make it perform like a CR or better :
a hardtop is an extra $2500-$3000+. A lip is around 400-500. And aftermarket seats range a lot. The cr suspension is around $1k - 1500 with swaybars (afternarket parts are more). Tires are around $600-800 installed.

A used ap2 might only be a few grand less than a CR of the same age. So it might be worth buying a CR to have a better starting point. Plus, you get limited edition status....which is undeniably nice to have.

You could argue that buying an older ap1 might be a cheaper answer...which might be true. But now youre missing the better AP2 drivetrain, as well as the above mentioned stuff. Plus wheels. Plus its usually an older, more beat up car/chassis with shittier financing options.

For a race car, a ratty old ap1 for cheap makes sense. For someone who wants a street car, the CR has its attractions....whether you're modding or not.

 

ok, the lip does absolutely nothing for performance, neither does that wing so theres like a grand right there of unneccesary ****...the hard top is dope and i agree with that point...you can get better tires for cheaper than that so theres wasted money too and like i said before, the wheels are hideous IMO...and finally the "better AP2 drivetrain" is an opinion, personally, no track car should be DBW, period...ill argue that until im blue in the face...im not letting a computer dictate my throttle position, no matter how fast they say the response is

 

The lip and wing add downforce. its been proven, I'm pretty sure.

Plus, by better drivetrain, I meant better gearing, better power, wider powerband, less internal component failure rates (lifters, banjo bolts), better pcv valve design, better response to mods, CAN BUS ECU, marginally stronger diff, better axles, better trans synchros....and whatever else I'm forgetting.

Yeah, its dbw...but you pretty much forget that when driving it. It's pretty seamless.

 

so were agreeing to disagree....the better power thing is definantly not a good point though...same horsepower numbers and like 5 more foot pounds of torque, better powerband, yea i can go with that...but you can be just as fast in an AP1 if you know how to drive it and know where the sweet spot is...but, this is just my opinion and its all relative

 

I can agree to disagree. We can't be friends anymore though. Huge loss on your part.

 

lol