THSCC/ Z Club at Roebling Road
If you chose not to go to RR because it might get wet, you missed a great weekend. And for all of you that thought front wheel drive would struggle, well, you were wrong here too!
The weather was about as good as it gets in GA in September with warm but not terrible temperatures and a slight breeze to keep all but the biggest bugs at bay. Long time racer Mark Senior commented that the track offered up more grip than he recalls in the last two years so that made it even more fun.
My thikning is that Sunday was a bit faster than Saturday because the remnants of rain from Friday remained on track in 4 and at the access road at the apex of 7/8 all weekend. well, at leat until some blond chick scattered it to the 4 winds in turn 4 (thanks R2X!!). She was not the only one to try to expand the width of the track.
First session, on about the 3rd lap Madd Matt went searching for used tires at the tire wall exiting turn 1. All he managed to find was a good seat to watch the rest of the session and some dirt. Nice tracks Matt!
I was there to do class room, do the Time Trial and try to learn the car before ECHC at VIR North. I had just put on coil overs, 400/600 front/ back springs and Koni Sports on the rear. Other than that no major changes! My whole goa lfor the weekend was to figure out how the car would drive so I wouldn't go off at Stevie Wonder in October. The good news is thatthe car was, well fantastic! 225s in front, 205s in back, a little toe out in front and about 0 in back made for a very neutral to a little loose car. While the video tape shows A LOT of counter steering it was mostly due to the 200 different surfaces at RR. The only thing not used to fill holes there was shoe go...which would have offered up more grip!
The high lite of the weekend, other than Rice sowing grass seeds down half the front straight was Duane Taylor in his recently reworked CRX. I believe a lot of folks (read Corvette drivers) were just surprised and pissed off when this little econobox of a car PULLED THEM on the straights. Having a feather weight car with 180 hp at the wheels will do that. I know Duane had to wait patiently many times for those other drivers to check their mirrors, then check them again to see if that CRX was really there! It was but not for long. Duane asked me if he could follow me around one session and my answer was "No, you will blow right by me!". He kindly offered to drag his tow vehicle behind as ballast.
Another major highlite of the weekend was dinner Saturday evening. The old Rice was back! Now, if all you ECHC folks will just let him be at the races and not bother him with trivial rule questions, protests, offers of free beer and women perhaps he will stay with us. To hear him tell his stories about trying to find pit lane at Charlotte had all of us rolling on the floor. I'm sure the food was great but who had time to eat! Rice was certainly in his element and I will personally kick the *** of the first person who changes this!
Rice may post a bit about the events during the trip down. I'll just say that at least his car didn't need any work! His car, with Bowie Gray driving, did post the 3rd fastest time of the time Trial on Saturday. A BMW light weight (a VERY rare car!!) was 1st, Duane as just .2 seconds behind and I managed to grab the 4th fastest time. So, ECHC cars held up their end of the bargain.
The moral of the story, if you are looking for more time on track come join THSCC and the Z Club for our next TT at CMP in October. Its not door to door (we hope) but certainly a more relaxed time to hone those skills!
Ron
[Modified by thecaptain, 10:15 PM 9/23/2002]
The weather was about as good as it gets in GA in September with warm but not terrible temperatures and a slight breeze to keep all but the biggest bugs at bay. Long time racer Mark Senior commented that the track offered up more grip than he recalls in the last two years so that made it even more fun.
My thikning is that Sunday was a bit faster than Saturday because the remnants of rain from Friday remained on track in 4 and at the access road at the apex of 7/8 all weekend. well, at leat until some blond chick scattered it to the 4 winds in turn 4 (thanks R2X!!). She was not the only one to try to expand the width of the track.
First session, on about the 3rd lap Madd Matt went searching for used tires at the tire wall exiting turn 1. All he managed to find was a good seat to watch the rest of the session and some dirt. Nice tracks Matt!
I was there to do class room, do the Time Trial and try to learn the car before ECHC at VIR North. I had just put on coil overs, 400/600 front/ back springs and Koni Sports on the rear. Other than that no major changes! My whole goa lfor the weekend was to figure out how the car would drive so I wouldn't go off at Stevie Wonder in October. The good news is thatthe car was, well fantastic! 225s in front, 205s in back, a little toe out in front and about 0 in back made for a very neutral to a little loose car. While the video tape shows A LOT of counter steering it was mostly due to the 200 different surfaces at RR. The only thing not used to fill holes there was shoe go...which would have offered up more grip!
The high lite of the weekend, other than Rice sowing grass seeds down half the front straight was Duane Taylor in his recently reworked CRX. I believe a lot of folks (read Corvette drivers) were just surprised and pissed off when this little econobox of a car PULLED THEM on the straights. Having a feather weight car with 180 hp at the wheels will do that. I know Duane had to wait patiently many times for those other drivers to check their mirrors, then check them again to see if that CRX was really there! It was but not for long. Duane asked me if he could follow me around one session and my answer was "No, you will blow right by me!". He kindly offered to drag his tow vehicle behind as ballast.
Another major highlite of the weekend was dinner Saturday evening. The old Rice was back! Now, if all you ECHC folks will just let him be at the races and not bother him with trivial rule questions, protests, offers of free beer and women perhaps he will stay with us. To hear him tell his stories about trying to find pit lane at Charlotte had all of us rolling on the floor. I'm sure the food was great but who had time to eat! Rice was certainly in his element and I will personally kick the *** of the first person who changes this!
Rice may post a bit about the events during the trip down. I'll just say that at least his car didn't need any work! His car, with Bowie Gray driving, did post the 3rd fastest time of the time Trial on Saturday. A BMW light weight (a VERY rare car!!) was 1st, Duane as just .2 seconds behind and I managed to grab the 4th fastest time. So, ECHC cars held up their end of the bargain.
The moral of the story, if you are looking for more time on track come join THSCC and the Z Club for our next TT at CMP in October. Its not door to door (we hope) but certainly a more relaxed time to hone those skills!
Ron
[Modified by thecaptain, 10:15 PM 9/23/2002]
at leat until some blond chick scattered it to the 4 winds in turn 4

r2x ~ who's car is brown right now.
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So was your car brown or gold Al?
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Drew - Who will not be surprised (and will actually be impressed) if "Driver: Tinky Winky" shows up on Crack Monkey's car . . .
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From: One by one, the penguins steal my sanity.
It was originally a light metallic brown. Not light enough to be considered gold (which is more yellowish).
Did we hijack this thread or what?
[Modified by Crack Monkey, 2:59 PM 9/23/2002]
Did we hijack this thread or what?
[Modified by Crack Monkey, 2:59 PM 9/23/2002]
Yes, I think so. To get back on the subject, I'd certainly be more interested in some THSCC events at those tracks more convenient to the DC area. I AM interested in paying CMP a visit. (This is probably as far as I would go for a school/time trial from DC.)
Ok... if you want to bring it back on-topic... I give the event
. I had a great time despite the majority of I-95 through SC being concrete...
I'm wishing now that I'd found the energy to get to dinner Saturday.
I would have to say that this (my 5th) was the most uneventful. It ran on-time, and I think we actually may have gotten a little extra time on track... instead of the dreaded shortened sessions. Imagine that
[edit] I'd personally consider that RX7 color "light metallic brown".
[Modified by JeffS, 6:05 PM 9/23/2002]
. I had a great time despite the majority of I-95 through SC being concrete... I'm wishing now that I'd found the energy to get to dinner Saturday.
I would have to say that this (my 5th) was the most uneventful. It ran on-time, and I think we actually may have gotten a little extra time on track... instead of the dreaded shortened sessions. Imagine that
[edit] I'd personally consider that RX7 color "light metallic brown".
[Modified by JeffS, 6:05 PM 9/23/2002]
My own sordid tale follows...
I took Thursday night and Friday morning to get myself packed up, the Integra on the trailer, and my cooler stocked. About 40 minutes into the trip, someone keys up the CB:
"Rice, the right rear tire on your trailer looks a little low."
"Hrm. Keep an eye on that for me, thanks." Note that in the Suburban I couldn't tell.
Later, Ron falls in behind, and looks at the tire - we decided to pull off NOW. As luck would have it we were right on top of a rest area. Found a puncture (in the sidewall - of course) and put the spare on in record time, and we were on our way. New tire: probably $60.
So then about 3 hours into the tow down, I tap the brakes to disengage cruise control, and the speedometer flakes out. This was followed by the Valentine 1 powercycling itself, the gauges going nuts, and the A/C fan slowing down. I key up the CB...
Rice: "Hey Ron, everything electrical on my Suburban is flaking out, any
idea why?"
Ron: "Check your voltmeter, what does it say?"
Rice: "It's, um, pegged all the way on negative."
Ron: "That's really not that good."
So we pull off and again luck into a large gas station with plenty of room for our staggering array of busted vehicles. Some phone calls later we find a place to score a replacement alternator. Ron capably takes the old buster alt off the still-hot truck and Whitney and I go into Santee (getting lost in the process). The guy working the desk (who of course had a mullet and a pack of cheap cigarettes in his shirt pocket) pulls out the alternator he had in stock and it was *clearly* the wrong one. Fortunately he had a heavy duty alternator for my 3/4 ton truck and $200 later, we were off. We also bought a new serpentine belt which of course did not fit.
Running total: $260. A little more than one of my race entry fees. And I have not gotten to the track yet
Finally the longest-ever-trip-to-Roebling was over. Saturday I took the GS-R out on some used 15" Toyos I bought from Bowie Jr, who was codriving the car with me. I brought it in and told him it was "a little looser than usual." Bowie then drove it and I think he described it as "evil" or some such thing. We played with tire pressures in the rear and got the car controllable. Come time for the time trial, we had 4 sessions on the car. It was running like a scalded dog - almost
130mph entering T1. It seems the "Garden Splitter" I made out of landscape materials was working. Perhaps too well. Maybe it's time for a wing to balance out some of that mad downforce.
Bowie was there trying to help me with the mental part of road racing, and it was helping. I had definitely started to find the "on/off" switch I'd been struggling to find. Well, I turned it up a little too high. This would be the first, and last, time I tried T9 without a lift. The minute I turned in, I knew I'd blown it. As the car pushed toward the outside of the corner, I briefly considered side-stepping the gas to regain the car's composure. I also remembered the paint on the wall to my right from people doing this very thing and having the car spin to the inside.
Discretion being the better part of valor, I let the car drive off, and DNF'd in the process. Bowie then got in the car and turned a 1:26.something, 3rd fastest overall on the day. By the day's end we had corded the left front and done significant damage to the right front.
Saturday night a handful of us went to downtown Savannah for dinner. I go to the track a lot, and usually eat mediocre food, so it was nice to catch a really good meal for a change. There we swapped stories of getting "that guy" as an instructor, and I recounted my tale of not being able to find pit-in at Lowes (something that I think nobody noticed that Saturday). Dinner was a definite highlight.
Sunday was its own fiasco with the Suburban, which Matt and I drove back to the hotel. Whitney told me Saturday night that the dome lights were on, so I went out and closed the doors again. They were out and I went to sleep. Sunday morning, after our alarm clock didn't go off, we rushed out of the room to find that the truck wouldn't start. Fortunately a student in an Audi jumped the truck for us and we limped to the track, running late.
Once there, I put two of Bowie's 14" Toyos on the front of the car. It felt AMAZING. The wild oversteer was gone, replaced with perfect tossability. I suspect the higher sidewalls of the 14s were adding some push to counteract the oversteer (though this didn't occur to me at the time). So at Bowie's request, I put the 14s on the back so as not to destroy them. Took the car out in the last white group session and it was almost undrivably loose. After turn-in I had ZERO steering input dialed into the car for the duration of the corner - unless it was
countersteer. Foot to the floor it was all I could do to keep from spinning.
The TT came right after this and I didn't know what to do with this size tire, so I did what we did Saturday and dropped the pressures. This made it even worse - I suspect the sidewall flex that helped on the front was a big problem in the back. Turned a 1:29 struggling the whole time to keep the car pointed in one direction for more than a second at a time. Packed up after the trophy ceremony and made the trip home, glad to have gotten the car home still shaped like an Integra.
All in all a successful weekend. I learned a lot from Bowie and got to practice my "mad drifting skillz" around Roebling Road. The car came back intact, the Suburban still runs (as far as I know) and I have found "the switch." I now need to calibarate the switch.
I also returned to my role as instructor. This was a lot of fun (other than my intercom failing AGAIN
). I had JeffS in his Civic, who was a whole lot of fun to ride with. Nice smooth driver in a fast Honda = fun for both of us. I'd never ridden with Jeff before but whoever had him as a student in the past must have done some things right. My other student was an instructor candidate in, of all things, a full-caged BMW 7 series. I'll leave it at this - that guy is one of the most impressive drivers I've had the privelage of riding with.
Anyone reading this should consider doing the CMP weekend. These are fun, low-key track weekends that are educational and affordable. You might also get to see me and Nicholson have big offs.
Edit: notes on my "students"
[Modified by krshultz, 6:41 PM 9/23/2002]
I took Thursday night and Friday morning to get myself packed up, the Integra on the trailer, and my cooler stocked. About 40 minutes into the trip, someone keys up the CB:
"Rice, the right rear tire on your trailer looks a little low."
"Hrm. Keep an eye on that for me, thanks." Note that in the Suburban I couldn't tell.
Later, Ron falls in behind, and looks at the tire - we decided to pull off NOW. As luck would have it we were right on top of a rest area. Found a puncture (in the sidewall - of course) and put the spare on in record time, and we were on our way. New tire: probably $60.
So then about 3 hours into the tow down, I tap the brakes to disengage cruise control, and the speedometer flakes out. This was followed by the Valentine 1 powercycling itself, the gauges going nuts, and the A/C fan slowing down. I key up the CB...
Rice: "Hey Ron, everything electrical on my Suburban is flaking out, any
idea why?"
Ron: "Check your voltmeter, what does it say?"
Rice: "It's, um, pegged all the way on negative."
Ron: "That's really not that good."
So we pull off and again luck into a large gas station with plenty of room for our staggering array of busted vehicles. Some phone calls later we find a place to score a replacement alternator. Ron capably takes the old buster alt off the still-hot truck and Whitney and I go into Santee (getting lost in the process). The guy working the desk (who of course had a mullet and a pack of cheap cigarettes in his shirt pocket) pulls out the alternator he had in stock and it was *clearly* the wrong one. Fortunately he had a heavy duty alternator for my 3/4 ton truck and $200 later, we were off. We also bought a new serpentine belt which of course did not fit.
Running total: $260. A little more than one of my race entry fees. And I have not gotten to the track yet
Finally the longest-ever-trip-to-Roebling was over. Saturday I took the GS-R out on some used 15" Toyos I bought from Bowie Jr, who was codriving the car with me. I brought it in and told him it was "a little looser than usual." Bowie then drove it and I think he described it as "evil" or some such thing. We played with tire pressures in the rear and got the car controllable. Come time for the time trial, we had 4 sessions on the car. It was running like a scalded dog - almost
130mph entering T1. It seems the "Garden Splitter" I made out of landscape materials was working. Perhaps too well. Maybe it's time for a wing to balance out some of that mad downforce.
Bowie was there trying to help me with the mental part of road racing, and it was helping. I had definitely started to find the "on/off" switch I'd been struggling to find. Well, I turned it up a little too high. This would be the first, and last, time I tried T9 without a lift. The minute I turned in, I knew I'd blown it. As the car pushed toward the outside of the corner, I briefly considered side-stepping the gas to regain the car's composure. I also remembered the paint on the wall to my right from people doing this very thing and having the car spin to the inside.
Discretion being the better part of valor, I let the car drive off, and DNF'd in the process. Bowie then got in the car and turned a 1:26.something, 3rd fastest overall on the day. By the day's end we had corded the left front and done significant damage to the right front.
Saturday night a handful of us went to downtown Savannah for dinner. I go to the track a lot, and usually eat mediocre food, so it was nice to catch a really good meal for a change. There we swapped stories of getting "that guy" as an instructor, and I recounted my tale of not being able to find pit-in at Lowes (something that I think nobody noticed that Saturday). Dinner was a definite highlight.
Sunday was its own fiasco with the Suburban, which Matt and I drove back to the hotel. Whitney told me Saturday night that the dome lights were on, so I went out and closed the doors again. They were out and I went to sleep. Sunday morning, after our alarm clock didn't go off, we rushed out of the room to find that the truck wouldn't start. Fortunately a student in an Audi jumped the truck for us and we limped to the track, running late.
Once there, I put two of Bowie's 14" Toyos on the front of the car. It felt AMAZING. The wild oversteer was gone, replaced with perfect tossability. I suspect the higher sidewalls of the 14s were adding some push to counteract the oversteer (though this didn't occur to me at the time). So at Bowie's request, I put the 14s on the back so as not to destroy them. Took the car out in the last white group session and it was almost undrivably loose. After turn-in I had ZERO steering input dialed into the car for the duration of the corner - unless it was
countersteer. Foot to the floor it was all I could do to keep from spinning.
The TT came right after this and I didn't know what to do with this size tire, so I did what we did Saturday and dropped the pressures. This made it even worse - I suspect the sidewall flex that helped on the front was a big problem in the back. Turned a 1:29 struggling the whole time to keep the car pointed in one direction for more than a second at a time. Packed up after the trophy ceremony and made the trip home, glad to have gotten the car home still shaped like an Integra.
All in all a successful weekend. I learned a lot from Bowie and got to practice my "mad drifting skillz" around Roebling Road. The car came back intact, the Suburban still runs (as far as I know) and I have found "the switch." I now need to calibarate the switch.
I also returned to my role as instructor. This was a lot of fun (other than my intercom failing AGAIN
). I had JeffS in his Civic, who was a whole lot of fun to ride with. Nice smooth driver in a fast Honda = fun for both of us. I'd never ridden with Jeff before but whoever had him as a student in the past must have done some things right. My other student was an instructor candidate in, of all things, a full-caged BMW 7 series. I'll leave it at this - that guy is one of the most impressive drivers I've had the privelage of riding with.Anyone reading this should consider doing the CMP weekend. These are fun, low-key track weekends that are educational and affordable. You might also get to see me and Nicholson have big offs.
Edit: notes on my "students"
[Modified by krshultz, 6:41 PM 9/23/2002]
Yes, I think so. To get back on the subject, I'd certainly be more interested in some THSCC events at those tracks more convenient to the DC area. I AM interested in paying CMP a visit. (This is probably as far as I would go for a school/time trial from DC.)
We are indeed a small club that is basically breaking even on these events. We got bitten in the *** on a VIR North date a couple years back where the typical problem of people waiting until the last minute to register cost us the date. At a certain point a club like ours has to pony up cash, and if we don't have it, we have to punt.
The VIR South date is a great weekend - looking at the south course doesn't do it justice. The south course crossover is my favorite section of track - technical at 9 / 10ths, and ***** at 10 / 10ths. It's great.
--Rice, who thinks he's held the unofficial DSP (and ITS) lap records at VIR-S for 2+ years now...
The VIR South date is a great weekend - looking at the south course doesn't do it justice. The south course crossover is my favorite section of track - technical at 9 / 10ths, and ***** at 10 / 10ths. It's great.
--Rice, who thinks he's held the unofficial DSP (and ITS) lap records at VIR-S for 2+ years now...
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From: One by one, the penguins steal my sanity.
You need to give my Chatterbox a try... it RULES!
You need to give my Chatterbox a try... it RULES!
What brand are you using? Thinking I might pick one up before VIR.
What brand are you using? Thinking I might pick one up before VIR.
IIRC, the model number is HJC-40. So far, it's been well worth it. It's more expensive than the Nady, but I like for my student to be able to hear me consistantly.

edit - if you do a google search on "chatterbox hjc-40", you will find them.
[Modified by r2x, 9:25 AM 9/24/2002]
There's also a HJC-50 which has rechargable batteries. I have that one and I'm pretty happy with it. Stable Energies in NJ has them. They also have a one piece student headset (like a nady basically) that most of the motorcycle shops don't carry
Joel
Joel
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