I was sold EG/DC knuckles back in the day and recently aquired some DA spindles. I put those on but I'm still having caster problems. My front K-member is still still tight. Checked the nuts in front to make sure they're not loose and checked the bolts on the LCA's and those are tight as well. All my bushings are not cracked/worn at all.

But what I think is happening is that I accidentally got the front UCA's mixed up and installed them on the wrong side from when I took everything off the car during my motor swap.. Now my question is, are these marked L and R just like the calipers are? If not, how do I know they're on the wrong side? If anyone can post pictures of their front LCA's so I can have something to match it with see if the bends in them are correct and facing the right way or not, would be very helpful.

 

No one?

 

Update:

I jacked the car up today and compared my upper LCA's to my other 91 civic's lca's. Bends are going the same way in them and everything. I'm stumped

Cemmmon' you suspension guru's I know you have answers!

 

Is caster off equally left to right?

The UCAs should have L or R indicating right or left. If those are correct, and new, make sure the uni-body is not bent or distorted near their mounting points.

Are the knuckles in good shape and on the correct side? Are the bearings and upper and lower ball joints in good shape?

Are you sure that the LCA bushings are in good shape and installed properly?

Are the springs and shocks in good shape and all sitting equal left to right? Don't forget to look in the back end for front end problems...if one rear corner is jacked a little higher than the other, the front end settings will not be equal left to right...you have to look at all four corners.

Do the sway bars move freely? A bind on one side will show up while on the alignment rack. Are the SB endlinks in good working order? Are they stock? If they are not and are adjustable then one or more may be adjusted improperly...or, if the car was every corner weighted you will have some asymetry in the alignment until you sit in the car - assuming you weigh the same as the previous fellow or gal.

Were the control arms installed properly? If they were installed and torqued while the car was in the air, and the wheels hanging, the rubber bushings will be distorted and contain some unwanted rising spring rate...this will show up if you ever corner balance your car. All ' rubber' control arm bushings distort...control arms must be installed, hand tightened if on a lift and then torqued with the FULL weight of the car on the tires. If performed in this fashion, the spring rate in the rubber bushings will be the same ( or nearly so) when the arms move up or down...we don't want a raising rate in one direction. Poly bushings will eventually cause binding problems...hiem joint or rod ends will not bind and these can be torqued while the car is on a lift.

Was the car ever in an accident?

If you can get the car on a lift, measure diagonally from the center of the stud on the left front lower ball joint to a fixed point on the right rear lower shock mount - pick the front of the bolt or the taper facing the back. Measure with great precision. Repeat the the other diagonal...both should be the same.

You have to look at the points of restraint first...those that hold and define geometry. Then move to the sub-frame and or uni-body distortions.

In a universe not far away, an auto body tech was handed a set of Mugen hard rubber bushings to install into a new LCA. The car was in an accident. After driving the car, not mine, it was discovered that the tech never bothered to install the hard rubber bushings. So, one side had stock bushings and one had hard bushings (they were all recently replaced) This was clearly evident in driving and showed up on the alignment rack. The point here is that unless I were a part of that process, no one would have ever known the problem.

You may have to remove everything and perform a rebuild...not fun, but if you have the time you can be very,very thorough! But be methodical...work from the easiest to the most difficult...disconnect the upper and lower ball joints, and the swaybar endlinks at the front and disconnect the lower shockmount and SB endlinks at the rear and test the control arms for freedom of movement...this is but one way to begin.

 

Swapped UCA's would show up with the car having increased positive caster. By itself this can be a good thing, but simply swapping UCA's on a Honda introduces other problems as well.

I do know that EG/DC knuckles are shorter than DA knuckles. On an older Civic or Integra, this would show up as moving the camber angle in the positive direction (shorter knuckle means UCA doesn't angle up as much, which moves the top of the knuckle out). I don't think that should affect caster all that much, certainly nothing visible just by looking at the car/wheel.

 

Then maybe I have the knuckles on the wrong side? That's the only other thing I can think of. I wouldn't think the subframe would shift on its own without hitting anything. Even if it decided to, where would I look?

Yes caster is the same on both sides. Both wheels are pushed towards the rear of the car.

 

Can't have the knuckles on the wrong side, as the tie rods wouldn't connect that way.

 

Ya that was a stupid statement lol. Thought about that on the way to work lol. I'm dumb. Accept my

Any other suggestions?

 

Well, I asked the question without thinking myself...so I started the dumb question highway...duh!

I would check the sub-frame if both sides are set back equally.

 

How would my subframe just magically move after doing my motor swap? Where would the bolts be to look and see if they moved and how would I go about pushing it forward?

 

Sub-frames can be funny animals...I've worked with a few that have absulutely no play and some that do. My most recent, my mini. The front sub-frame is an extremely precise fit...the rear is not and requires a fair amount of work to get right. The most obvious problem here is a binding RSB...but there are others.

If possible, try to get two identical cars on a lift and inspect both before pulling anything apart. You might gather some valuable information this way.

Who installed the sub-frame last?

 

Like I said before. My car didn't have this problem UNTIL AFTER I did my motor swap. Never hit anything or bumped anything. Just randomly happened

 

Then something moved and there are very few elements that can cause the change equally left to right.

Who did the motor swap? Did they have to move the sub-frame to get the engine in place...

 

That should never happen, unless something was tweaked in the past and there were problems getting the rear mount to line up.

 

No it shouldn't and it didn't. Everything lined up perfectly after I figured out my driver side motor mount issue.

 

Well, it's a mystery then. What are the caster angles? Then we can judge how far they are off from stock spec.

Points of restraint: LCA bushings, UCA bushings, upper and lower ball joints, that's it...the spring and shock is a point of restraint on a Mac Strut, however. If those are perfect then the uni-body or sub-frame moved. There is no other explanation...unless the fenders were recently removed and reinstalled slightly off...in which case caster might be fine???

 

I'm going to dig up the alignment specs in the morning. But fenders only came off after the motor swap when I did my wire tuck, so it's not that. But this friday is my next day off and I wanna get under the car and check it out. How will I know if the subframe had moved back or whatnot and how would I go about adjusting it?

Thank you guys for all your time and help! Mucho appreciated.

 

...I think it either is or is not...but I don't have experience with that particular sub-frame. Most front sub-frames have zero tolerance for obvious reasons.

Adjusting...I might suggest a complete removal and inspection of both the sub-frame and the uni-body...keep an eye on any abrased paint or under coating. This should give you some indication that the sub-frame moved. I might also screw each bolt into the uni-body sans sub-frame just to check the integrity of the threads. And!!! Often the bolts are self tapping...this means that when the sub-frame is re-installed it must be flush with the uni-body...self tapping bolts/screws cannot be used to 'draw up' the sub-frame because the weight of the sub-frame will cause the bolt threads to cross inside the uni-body. I learned this the hard way many years ago...it was an anger, teary eye moment...I destroyed nearly a year's worth of work by rushing one of the last install tasks.

Good luck with this!!!