I'm building a splitter for my dc2. I have 2 questions and didn't find answer...

1st- Is the spitter need to be fully parallel to the ground when looked from the side. I'm planning on putting some traction bars up front and I'm not sure to be able to clear it if the splitter need to be parrallel to the ground. It might end up with 2-4° slope... Any prob with that?

2nd- The lip I have right now is a spoon style one and there's gonna be a little gap in the middle between the lip and splitter because of the shape of the splitter... Would this cause an issue? If yes, what kind of issue will this cause?

If it's not clear just let me know please!!

Thanks!

 

question 1: it needs to be as close as possible to being level to the ground. 2 +/- should be fine.

question 2: The point of the splitter is to "split" the air at the front of the car. If there is a gap where the lip and blade meet it wont split and force it up and over the car.

hope the quick and dirty answers work for ya

 

Mr Legoman found a way to get the traction bars to work with the SPMS splitter.
It did involve cutting and welding the traction bars though.
Search Splitter and look for the SPMS thread. Its in there!
Kiwi builds the best splitters, and bracketry!
I can take off mine in mere mins, now with the pci bumper gadget its a one man job.
Search splitters theres much on this subject!
Or visit SPMS website and see their tech on the subject.
Here is the link.
http://specialprojectsms.com/index.php?categoryID=30

Id dump that Spoon lip.. too much money for something that might bite the dust in one of those off road agricultural adventures.

 

On the second point any gap between the lip and the splitter is bad. A primary function of the splitter/air dam combo is maintain a high pressure region of air over the blade, giving you front downforce. Any leakage (for lack of a better term) of air from the region in the centre on top of the splitter to the lower pressure region behind the bumper is bad. Seal up any gaps.

The thread starter states Spoon *style* and since Spoon never made a lip for the 4 headlight DC2 front it is unlikely to be genuine and probably a reasonably cheap and effective means to fill the gap between the stock bumper and the splitter blade.

 

You are correct you dont want any gap between the lip or (airdam) and the splitter.
I have taken my air dam to the extreme and coated it so it is much harder to break, than the usual carbon fiber or fiberglass.
I thoroughly tested it last month at thunderhill having gone off road a tad and only the blade sustained slight damage, while the air damn was completely intact.

 

Ditto all above-
Splitter should be paralel to the ground- As close to the ground as practical.
NO GAP! There should be no gap between the AirDam and the Splitter Blade.
A 1/2" Gap at rest will turn into a 2" gap and no downforce at speed.
Don't fall into the trap of making your Blade stick out too far from the Airdam... 3.5 inches is ample for most Honda's. Any more may give a little more downforce, but it will cause drag, and you will most certainly have to do a balancing act with a rear wing.
Believe me we have tried them all.
Check out my article - www.specialprojectsms.com -Technical

We make an AirDam for both the '94-'97 and the '98-'01 Integra Gauranteed to work.

FWIW

kIWI

 

Re: Traction Bars... Why bother? They won't make any difference, if it's for road racing... And if it's for Drag racing why bother with a splitter?

10c.

Kiwi

 

Traction bars do make a difference in road racing. Don't let the name of the part fool you, it does more than that.

 

Ok, and your practical road racing experience in a DC2 using traction bars, and not using them is?

Kiwi

 

LCA's flex less under hard braking, car felt more stable. Only downside is added weight on the front end (though it is low on the car) and it will cause the car to understeer if alignment settings aren't adjusted.

 

I have seen Kiwi's trophy shelf. If he says why bother with traction bars, I'm with him.

 

By the way the splitter/dam works really good, thanks Jeff. hope to see you soon.

 

I'd rather question and try something for myself than follow someone else. I'm sure he has a good setup without them, but I prefer to have them if the rules allow. An ECHC H1 Champion swears by them so it's not just me.

 

So then what is Honda's difference in thinking between Prelude and older Civics/Tegs radius rod + LCA vs the later Civic/Teg 3 point LCA?
Seems to me the lower torque cars dropped the crossbar/radius rod while higher torque kept it.

 

Aren't the bushing (ES in my case right now) flexing a bit when hard braking, accelerating etc... Also, dosen't the traction bar act a bit like an engine torque damper no? Last thing... I thought that by installing traction bar, I would have the possibility to adjust caster by taking off the Y shape part of the FLCA. Once adjust, I would only have to shim the Y part to set it back in place... Maybe I'm wrong, If yes let me know!!

It's all winter project since the season here in Canada is about to end in a month... So like every winter, I will try to improve the car and I'm looking at my option...

Finally, I went about 50times on your site but never seen any info regarding 94-97 splitter... It's good news you do make one!

 

This seems like a no brainer...Of Course you want to run traction bars...as my good friend Claude always says "You can nevar have enough traction"...and for another thing, splitters are good for everybody...I used to have alot of trouble with wheelspin even in 5th gear at the end of the straitaway but now that I've got a splitter (and traction bars) it's No Problem.

Scott, who has more trophies he shoulda won than most people have actual trophies!

 

That is so Grasshopper... Always question. And then If you still don't want to listen, learn from your mistakes, or just keep on making them...
Your ECHC H1 Champion has never run against one of my cars...

However, We are talking about a DC2 set up, I can't speak for the Prelude... Did Walter win H1?
but I can tell you for sure that the DC2 Front suspension was never meant to accept Traction Bars. They pull on far too much caster when the suspension is in compression, or going through it's arc and they will bind! The only reason they would even look like working is because your rubber bushings will be streched to hell!
I might also point out that the traction bars are mounted to a part of the frame that is designed to hold the radiator support... not the twisting up and down torque of the suspension.
However if you are building a real race car-
Any deflection in the OEM DC2 Upper and Lower Control arms can easily be fixed by using our PCI Bronze Bushing Kit which also includes a Bronze replacement for the compliance Bushing.
The upper control arm bushings can be offset to give heaps of caster, without suspension bind.

I don't know about the Canadian series but I'm pretty sure that Traction bars are Illegal in NASA?

I guess the Trophy shelves do mean something to some people after all?


Kiwi

 

I listen to "Kiwi" and have never ever been steered wrong!
All the products he sells, and produces are thoroughly race tested, and proven on his own cars, and the ones that he sponsors.

I too have seen that trophy shelf and its pretty darn impressive!

Just because... I went out and hugged my race car today.

 

How was he an HC champion when traction bars aren't allowed in Honda Challenge? Guess no one contested it?

 

He didn't use them on his HC car.

I'm not talking about Walter.

Kiwi,

Have you tried the Full-Race bars? If you have, you know that they will not bind when setup properly. If you haven't try them out. Probably won't change your mind, but might open it a little.

As for cars running against each other, I'll have two cars running RTA next season. One East, one West. We can battle it out vicariously until you come out East or I head out West.

P.S. Trophy shelves do matter, I like mine. Though it is too small and I've had to resort to boxing some up. I like the ribbons and plaques hanging on my wall too.

 

traction bars are illegal in NASA, and correct me if I'm wrong but the geometry on the double wish bone suspension would be compromised if you use traction bars. I would think is just an overkill with the design. And for wheelspin down the straight in 5th gear, wth are u running 1000hp and if that is the case you can talk to chris rado, he will tell you how to control it.

And for East coast against West coast, well , bring it on traction bars or not. Maybe that is why there is more trophies on our shelves. West coast that is.

 

question, why does everyone keep saying traction bars are illegal in NASA? i dont think thats something listed in the CCR. i have a HPDE CRX that i run through NASA, it has traction bars, everything was fine, they didnt even check. dont you mean they are illegal in HC? maybe you guys are just trying to differentiate from the SCCA classes, but HC is a NASA class, so... lol. just been bugging me.

and i dont know from experience, since i have a crx (which wont bind with the traction bar, its just replacing stuff thats already there), but ive read that on an EG/DC and up, the traction bar can/will cause binding if all the bushings are replaced with spherical. specifically the compensator bushing because as the suspension compresses, the traction bar will want to pull the wheel forward, but a spherical compensator wont allow the movement, and bind. again, ive read, that having a spherical compensator bushing, will pretty much make a traction bar useless as it performs the same thing.

 

A DE isn't competitive HC racing. HC is always assumed, as DE's are "run what you brung" learning times.

 

It's not the LCA it's the compensator bushing that flexes/gives. (as it's designed too) If your LCA is flexing... well then you have some issues.


You replace those (compensator rubber bushings) with spherical and you are good to go.


"traction bars" are in the OEM design of the EF/DA front double wishbone suspension, except we refer to them as "radius rods".

EG/EK/DC don't have these, it was replaced/redesigned with the compensator arm/bushing.

Traction bars/ radius rods/ compensator arms bushings are all attempting to do the same thing; Limit the for and aft moving of the wheel under braking and acceleration. Because these are **** box honda's designed for commuting/street driving, in stock form the rubber bushings allow for a good bit of play. You add 8 to 12 times the spring rate, sticky R compound tires, and a lowered ride height and those bushings are going to see A LOT of play.

So you address the problem, bushings, don't add a "band-aid" fix.

IMO, YMMV, etc etc etc

 

I would add that in theory, you would want the splitter to be a hair lower in the front than rear (read very slight rake) when the car is at speed. Having the leading edge higher could add lift to the front end.