Hey guys,

Here is the scoop. I went on and got on my first track and finally figured out what I was missing all this time. Anyway my brakes faded to an extent that I had some problems stoping. The set up I have is 95' GSR with stock rotors, Mobile1 Syn Brake Fluid and Hawk HP+ . The heats I participated were consisted of 5 laps each and about for the 3rd lap they were gone. There was still some pedal pressure(wasn't on the floor yet). Can you give me some suggestions what I can do to prevent this happening with the existing setup or if it is too weak what should I get in the near future to prevent this.


Thanx in advance!!

<---Rado, who HATES not having his brakes so he can "dive" on people....

 

Get any kind of real track pad. HP+ do NOT qualify. Hawk Blues, Carbotech P+, Ferodo DS-something, ask Andie @ Cobalt.

 

You have a street mod GS-R? What do you have? Need more info before we can determine what you need. You *might* need to go with a fastbrakes kit or something similar...

 

The brakes are stock besides the pads. Otherwise its JR supercharged with I/H/E and RE730 on 15x6 wheels. On the other side I have another question- do you need a different set of rotors for the track pads or you will be fine with the rotors you daily use? Also can you use the blues for street use?

Thanks in advance!


[Modified by Madracer1, 9:42 AM 9/16/2002]

 

Yes you do.

OMG NO!!! Unless you want to replace your rotors weekly!

Initially, I'm thinking you might need to step up to a big brake kit. Stock brakes will be just fine on the street, but with that much added hp, you need the heat capacity of a big kit IMO.

 

Well, he could use blues on the street, but nobody in their right mind would recommend it.

 

except for chad.....

 

Before stepping up to aftermarket brakes (which I personally think is silly), spend some time building cooling ducts. This is typically the most ignored and potentially most valuable modification that you can make. They are a pain to put together (no handy "kit" out there) but, until you do, you might be kidding yourself where brake performance on the track is concerned...

Kirk

 

If you're gonna do track days with your street car, get a dedicated set of track pads and rotors for the front. I didn't do this when I started, and ended up getting a lot of pad transfer and ruining rotors. Since I got a dedicated set for the track, I've had no problems.

 

I think the decision to have separate sets of rotors when switching compounds is based on two key factors: (1) the level of friction compound film transfer compatibility (or incompatibility, as it were), and (2) the rotor-friendliness of each compound. As an example, for my BMW customers, I run Ferodo DS2500 in the front and the rear for street/auto-x, and for track use, I have them swap the fronts to the DS3000. This "hybrid" setup is both cost effective, as well as performance effective. The DS2500 and DS3000 are both compatible with each other from the perspective of film transfer onto the rotor. Further, since both compounds are very rotor friendly, and leave a smooth finish on the rotor, the (re-)bedding time between compound/pad swaps is dramatically decreased.

I think the decision to go with a BBK should be considered on paper first: (1) what is the "racing weight" of your vehicle, (2) what is the fastest your vehicle will be travelling on a given road course...this allows you to consider the generated kinetic energy relative to an otherwise stock car. In most cases, with proper cooling, a good brake fluid, proper braking technique, and a good compound, the OEM brake hardware is more than sufficient. Testing different pad compounds is cheap...diving into a BBK before trying compounds is expensive.

JMO... -Andie

 

You mentioned get pads and rotors for the front...Does that mean I will be fine witht the HP+'s on the back with the daily driven rotors or that will create uneven braking force making the car unstable for braking. Also does Hawk make Blues for the back or is it just me that I didnt find any??

Thank you all for your advinces!!!

Rado

 

Don't need blues for the back since the front does the vast majority of the stopping. I use cheap Advance Auto Wearever pads in the back. They last ~ 1 year. Lots and lots of GS-R drivers use nothing more than a good street pad in the rear for track use.

If you wnat to try the better pad route first, I suggest you also remove the splash shields behind the rotors. Do NOT use the Hawk Blues on the street, and DO get a separate set of rotors specifically for your track pads. If you want something you can change at home and drive back and forth to/from the track, give me a call at the number in my sig.

Matt

 

I really must stress again that the decision to get a separate set of rotors for your "track" pads depends on two main variables, as I described in a previous post above. It has to do with what you selection of street and track pads are. In most cases, you will need a separate set of rotors (or should get a separate set of rotors, rather), but in some cases, this is simply not necessary. I like to use hybrid setups for customers who use their street car at weekend HPDE's...it saves them money, while still giving them duty-specific performance (street versus track).

-Andie

 

This is somewhat of a proactive answer. While at the HDPE events, concentrate on braking LESS. I know that sounds overly obvious, but if you concentrate on improving your braking technique, it will help with your lap times and it will reduce the cost of brake maintenance.

I ran a CRX in IT in 94 and ALWAYS had brake problems. I was under the impression that it must be the car or pads. As my driving skill increased I found that I had less and less brake problems and as a bonus... my lap times lowered. I now drive a 2700 lb car with brakes not much bigger than the CRX and have not had any problem all season. I am on my second set of pads after 4 weekends at Nelson, 5 weekends at mid ohio and 3 days at Beaverun.

I maintained a fleet of rental rides for TC Kline for a number of years and I always found it curious that some of the rentals could manage to grind the life out of a set a blues in a weekend! Where other drivers (with comparable lap times) would not have the same results.

I am not trying to tell you that you are doing something wrong. Just trying to offer another possible solution.

 

Is there any ill effects of removing the splash gurads on the rotors? Can you safely remove the front and the back ones? I haven't done it yet due to the rummor that is around that in rain the water will cause the rotor to warp very easy cooling it unnaturally(sp). Is there any truth in that?

Thanx again!

Rado

 

um, your wheels get dirty...

here is a good site for brake info:

http://www.turnfast.com/tech_brakes/...alancing.lasso

HTH,

t..

 

Can anyone please give me the right number part for the Hawk Blues for a 95 GSR?

Thanxs again!

Rado

 

Try some stainless steel lines too. I'm surprised no one mentioned that already. That should help.

s

 

not with brake fade. stainless lines improve pedal feel and brake modulation only

 

Madracer1:

For the Hawk Blue in your fitment, the part number is HB245E.631. The list price is $146.90. If you'd like, I can probably price match for you. I have three sets in stock.

Best Regards,

Andie


[Modified by cobalt, 6:19 PM 9/18/2002]

 

Thanks Andie! I will keep that in mind for the next season!! The season is over for me ....except couple of auto-x events....

Thanxs again guys!!!

P.S. Does anyone has any good write-up for making brake ducts on a Teg?(maybe pics??? )


[Modified by Madracer1, 8:42 PM 9/18/2002]