emgjsdk1

got a 98 civic having brake problems, the pedal goes soft but when you pump it a few times while driving it stiffens back up. theres plenty of brake fluid, no collapsed lines, or bent, no leaks, just shitty pedal feeling.
the pedal stays stiff when the engine is off. anybody ran into this before?

emgjsdk1

got a new master cylinder on there and bench bled it and bled the brakes rr, Lf, LR, RF and still have a spongy pedal feel.,,,help

emgjsdk1

help

BryanM.

iTrader: (1)

Read drum brakes?



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itsmejto

Check the vacuum assist line to the manifold and the valve, check it's the right way round.
With a new master you nearly always need to adjust the threaded push rod from the pedal to the master cyl.

If the fluid lines are all bled correctly and no leaks.
Make sure the rear drums (if you have em) are adjusted up correctly

Former User

Despite your bleeding attempts, it seems that air is still trapped in the system.

emgjsdk1

ill try this today and see if i have any luck.

emgjsdk1

re-bled the lines today and got the same result.
how do i adjust the rear drums, i thought they were self adjusting...?

BryanM.

iTrader: (1)

They are supposed to, but everything in there can get rusty and siezed up,
the grease in the adjuster often gets hard and everything is coated in brake dust.
Drum brakes are often neglected for a long time. The pic is a good example.


If you take the drum off, this is what the adjuster looks like.
Turn the wheel down to adjust the shoes outward.

emgjsdk1

isnt there a hole on the back of the drum for a screwdriver?
thats what i was looking for but i didnt take the wheel off i just got underneath to bleed my brakes

BryanM.

iTrader: (1)

Yes, and there is a rubber plug in the hole on the backplate. It can be tricky to adjust them this way.

If I were you I would at least consider pulling the drums off to take
a look at what's going on inside there, unless you've done it recently.

Just a thought.



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emgjsdk1

yep thats what i plan to do today, i havent opened the drums up and i bought the shell a few months ago now.

emgjsdk1

ok so i pulled the drum off the driver side the wheel cylinder wasnt leaking and it was suprisingly clean in there vs. the pic you showed me.
i also re bled the brakes too and i still have a spongy pedal feeling.

EsotericImage

iTrader: (8)

try this order:
driver front
pass rear
pass front
driver rear


Mine did the same thing.. I researched (whats that?) then re-bled in that order, and everything is fine.
one at the pedal, and one at the corner ur bleeding.. Keep pumping untill ALL the air is out..

Mine had a nasty pocket deep in the line. I used 2 containers of brake fluid too!

emgjsdk1

i tried this order yesterday, and used all new brake fluid again and bled until only clean brake fluid came out, and i actually feel like the brakes got worse, i have a guy thats supposed to come out today and check them out.

emgjsdk1

bump

BryanM.

iTrader: (1)

Did you ever adjust those shoes?




So was pedal feel better at some point before?
Does the pedal sink really far?
Stock front brakes?
Are the caliper slide pins moving freely?



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emgjsdk1

i did adjust the shoes 3 turns down per side.
and yes the car would stop with no problems until all this, heres what happened..... i was coming thru town going to the store and the person in front of me stops short because of a stop light so i had to stop short also, and as i went to hit the brakes they went basically to the floor, (maybe within 1 or 2 inches from the floor) and i pumped them fast and down shifted after i realized what was happening. and since that day my brakes havent been the same....
yes they are stock front brakes and yes the caliper pins are moving freely, i re-did my front pads when i got the car, used anti-sceize and brake disk quiet (spray). this is how i was tought to do brakes by a ASE master tech.

emgjsdk1

o and i took the car to a local shop this morning ill post the results after i get the car back.

Vindicator9000

I'd be interested to hear what the problem was.

emgjsdk1

front wheel bearings according to a local alignment/ brake/ diag. shop

Vindicator9000

?!

I don't see how bad wheel bearings could have anything to do with the brake problem.

Strange.

ystop

Yea, never heard of bearings affecting pedal feel. Probably would try to sell you muffler bearings if your car was loud too
I have a '99 and did rear shoes/drums with the same problem. I finally got good pedal and e-brake, but only after I applied e-brake while going in reverse a number of times. Seems that pulling the handle while backing is what made the adjusters move.
Or I'm lucky

emgjsdk1

passenger side wheel bearing was completely destroyed. with the car in the air you could move the wheel freely about a half an inch of nothing but free play. i noticed this while i was bleeding my brakes also that when i was doing the front passenger side while the pedal was being pumped my wheel was going in and out about a half inch, (its kinda hard to explain, almost like going positive camber, then to negative and back all while pushing the brakes in.
going back to the shop this morning to get the driver side done. i can wait to see how it rides

phaphon

haha i never heard of it too but they are not lying i had that exact same problem when i fixed my wheels bearings it fixed the problem completely