Hi

I want a bit more out of my B16, and have been offered 99spec ITR inlet mani and cams. What can I expect to gain from my B16A2, and will it need to be mapped to suit, and if so what ecu is best? Modifications to date on the car include full stainless steel exhaust with decat, and topfuel carbon CAI.

I also want to buy a four branch manifold for the car, need some advice please.


Thanks

 

Running that intake manifold (I think it's the same as the password JDM style?) will cause a loss in power and so will installing another intake on the b16a. The stock P30 intake manifold is one of the best intakes out there for that engine in particular. I wouldn't even consider changing it until I had some decent cams and other supporting mods intalled or power is what you'll lose, not gain. Tuning will also be needed.

 

Thanks for the info... I remember reading elsewhere that it would lose power on it's own.

But in my post it states that cams and im will be fitted together, along with full system and decat. There is also a local tuner who specialises in jap cars.

So with reference to my original post, what gains will I get with cams, im, full system, decat, tuning.

Thanks

 

When I said some decent cams, I meant something larger than the ITR cams as they are still considered to be a stock cam. They're good but not in the same category as the skunk 2 tuner 2 cams, pro 1 cams etc. Buddy club 3 cams and Skunk 2 stage 1 cams are larger as well. With the ITR cams I would still absolutely run the P30 intake manifold and not change it. Without knowing the type or size of your exhaust I can only guess that you'll make somewhere around 150whp and 105 WTQ maybe on a dynojet. Only way to know for sure is to test it out for yourself.

 

Thanks fella, helpful advice!

 

I totally disagree, I ran an ITR manifold on my stock first gen B16 with a stock computer and it gave me a healthy midrange gain with some more top end as well, very noticeable. I also had the ITR cams in my GS-R engine with a stock computer with a Skunk 2 ITR style manifold and it also made a nice difference. I have a feeling the other guy has no personal experience.

 

from earlier posts here on HT

there have been many dynos showing that b16 intake manifold outperforms pretty much all manifolds till 7800-8000rpm, above that itr or blox etc will outperform so it really depends on your priorities. I spend much more time below 7500rpm so I plan to just keep the b16 im since that is where I spend 99% of my time and I'm not willing to take 5-10hp out of the middle/low and put it at the very top end which is what would occur if I changed it. I actually have an itr manifold sitting here so its not like cost is really a factor for me anyway.

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Great topic to bring up for those who don't know!

The deal is, that it's true, the stock B16 manifold- 2nd gen that is, known as the P30 performs very very well! With the slightly longer, narrower intake runners, air really pickys up a lot of velocity on stock and mild built engines.

The P73 ITR manifold has shorter, wider runners which actually make 2-4hp "less" than the P30 up until about 7000rpm where the ITR manifold design shows it's colors

I've seen dyno's of built B20 vtec covnersions with both manifolds used, same result!!

For most people, really anybody who uses their car on the street, the P30 is a better choice. it should also be noted that i have seen the P30 manifold ported with even better performance of another 4-6whp across the rpm range.

The last thing i have to mention is that from dyno testing i've seen done, the P30 outperformed most aftermarket designs as well!




shorter runners-more air volume/less air velocity-move up the power band(type-r,victor-x)
longer thinner runners-more air velocity/less air - move down the power band(B20 intake manifold




ed9man
placebo effect, arguing with laws of physics...^^^
GSR engine is not same as b16 hes talking about b16
from intake manifold down to pistons and crank, gsr is different.

skunk2 IM is also not an exact copy of type-r intake manifold, even skunk2 mentions it,saying its modified "type-r style".


you can test it with your gsr intake manifold ed9man
drive around with open butterflies and then drive around with closed butterflies and see the difference in power and where it is.

 

ok fair enough, the engine I had the ITR manifold on was a stock JDM first gen B16a with stock cams. I guess the first generation B16 manifold is different than the one you are talking about. good to know

 

It would help if you had some solid numbers to back up your impressions as well. You'll notice that my car started off with a B16a in it and I tried a number of different comninations on it before I went to the b18c5. I also use to own the largest performance automotive shop in my province and tested many things on different cars on a dynojet 248c. I can assure you that I have personal experience.

 

you have any dynos left? that would be badass to see the difference between all the parts that came from same dyno

 

I've been out of that business now for about 7 years and most of the dyno information I have is in my mind and no longer on computer. Most of what I experience now is what I experiment with on my own car and through a few hard core tuner friends.

 

Thanks again for all the great info.

So in summary, I shouldn't change the standard intake manifold on my car. Thanks, that saves me a few £££.

 

without a dyno sheet your view here is not helpful. considering all your mods were untuned I wonder why you think it is useful. there is no butt dyno that is accurate. b16 will own pretty much any intake until 7rpm or so, just go check the "build honda horsepower" book, it has TONS Of dynos showing this to be true, even on built b20vtecs

 

There IS a dyno sheet of a P30 intake manifold vs and ITR manifold on an ITR motor. The P30 manifold made MORE power until about 8500rpm on the ITR motor but tapered off from there, the ITR manifold carried passed 9k but didn't have the midrange of the P30 setup.

When I find the sheet I'll post it...

 

What do you all reckon about stage 1 cams, using the standard intake maniold? I'd like the car to be daily driveable with a good idle.

 

good match.