Hey fellas,
Recently got done doing a "poormans R" build/swap into my car, took it in to be dyno tuned and got back the numbers, somewhat disappointed. It made 172whp and 125tq on pump gas with my apexi ws2 catback on it. It was tuned on a Dynopack at speedfactory. I was hoping to get in the area of 185 or so, i thought it seemed reasonable, so I just wanted to share my build and see what you guys have to say. I already know you will tell me to scrap the intake im running (whale *****) but i got it for free from a buddy and I was doing a budget build the best I could. Heres my build...

82mm GSR block
GSR crank
GSR rods
RS machine PR3 82mm pistons
(CR is 11.35:1 or so)
B16 head
ITR cams on S2 gears
B16 IM
CF Whale ***** intake
RMF narrow header
B16 trans w/ LSD
No cat, testpipe into WS2 catback exhaust

Seems low in HP numbers to me, might just be the exhaust. My buddies B20V made right at the same power with STOCK PISTONS and gsr cams. Open header on the dyno though.

Thanks for your thoughts

 

Did ask your tuner?

 

He said hes tuned a few ITR motors bone stock with a I/H/E and they usually come out to about 170ish hp. Im running slightly higher compression and larger pistons which should in turn give a few extra horses. I wanna run it open header and see how it responds...the WS2 can be quite restrictive.

 

since your on a budget build,try putting some gsr cams in that B16 head. you can pick them up pretty cheap

 

id swap out that intake manifold for a ITR or skunk2 piece. ive seen great numbers with a WS2 exhaust.

 

what header are u running.

And also how do u know that u have true type r cams that u are running.

I'd say a good header should get u a few horses. Normally poor mans r kick out like 183 with 131 tq so u are close.

also get a 3inch cold air intake and also drop the exhaust and see if u pick up some horses.

 

4 Posts and no mentioned the CF Whale ***** intake.
Remove this and go with a 3" CAI with a Velocity Stack.
Your exhaust might be holding you back about 5-8whp. A nice 2.5" should help.
The ITR or Skunk2 Pro manifold is better than the B16, a few more 3-5whp here.
These three changes should get you much closer to you 180whp goal on a Dynopack.

 

Yeah, get a 3" intake piping with a nice quality air filter.

 

DON"T need to swap the b16 intake manifold for an itr one. You will gain maybe 2whp right at peak and lose 3-5whp pretty much everywhere else. I put down 177whp with stock gsr cams on a b16 intake manifold w/stock b16 head and have seen guys put down 195whp on a b16 intake manifold and relatively mild cams. If you search around you'll find dyno sheets proving this. pretty hard to beat the b16 intake manifold until you are pushing it >8k rpm. the intake is not your problem at this level. I was running 2.5 magnaflow muffler too btw.

get an ebay 3" intake arm and blox velocity stack/filter, get a 2.5" electric cutout and you will put down 185whp+ no problem, assuming it is tuned of course.

 

He is right, you are nowhere near the limits of the b16 manifold. Get you intake changed out and go from there.

 

172whp is about dead on for your setup.

You are not going to like the exhaust change for 8-10whp. WS2 is quiet compared to what it's gonna sound like and this isn't WS2 biased, I prefer the sound of open header/megaphone.

 

My GSR w/S2 Pro IM and S2 Stage 2 cams w/JDM ITR header, OEM cat and WS2 exhaust made 174/116 on a Dynapak. When I swapped the header to a DTR big-tube 4-2-1 and lost the cat, I got it up to 185/120tq. Keep in mind that your tuner's Dynapak may be calibrated to read low. I know that my tuner's Dynapak reads about 4-5% lower than the area Dynojets. I personally verified my 185/120tq read 192/127 tq 2 days later on a Dynojet in the Bay Area.

fm

 

Speedfactory's dynapack is known to read higher than most dynojets. At least a certain one in the area. Plenty of people have dyno'd at speedfactory only go get lower numbers on that dynojet.

Keep in mind though, that doesn't mean anything besides the fact that they are two completely different dynos.

Something more informative than posting peak hp/tq numbers would be a dyno graph. We'd be able to tell a lot more from that.

 

I have almost the same set up and i made 192whp, 136tq.I need bigger injectors.Theres more left in it.

ITR head
ITR cams w/ aem cam gears
ITR IM & TB
DC sport header
Blox VS w/ 3" intake
LS block
ITR crank, rods, pistons
Thermal catback
Hi flow cat
ITR tranny 4.4

 

yeah, same besides he is using an 87.2mm GSR crank and your using an 89mm LS crank and your using a less restrictive exhaust and a velocity stack with 3" intake. So i'd say not really the same. lol

 

Sorry guys been busy today, ill answer a few questions:

First off im running the CF whale ***** cause it was FREE, and it was a budget build i threw together while i was at school and playing baseball the past 6 months. Maybe when i get a few bucks ill try out a diff intake setup as mentioned above.
I am doing a 600whp turbo build as well, i just wanted a fun motor to drive around my car with for the summer without breaking the bank...i blew my 350whp LSV turbo last august.
I would run a diff exhaust BUT i have gotten 2 tickets for loud exhaust when a had a N1 style a few years back, so i put the ws2 on to keep the cops happy. When i hit the track it will be off and hopefully will make a difference for me.

So for now im going to let it be, its a fun reliable daily driver, but ill keep in mind the V-Stack w/ 3" pipe for my intake as a change down the road. Im not concerned with how much power it makes on the road, i dont street race, ill make it go on the track.

RickCRX, what do you have your cams degreed to? stock spec? my tuner told me degreeing stock cams would do nothing and would be more a waste then anything.

 

Im not gonna bash on the whale ***** as I ran one on my 85mm b20v and made 231/155 with it so IDK how bad it really is. but I can say put it on cl for $150 and then go to orielys auto parts and buy a $15 dollar V stack and get a 3" intake and you will pocket the rest of the cash.

 

orielys vstack

 

How high are you reving the engine? Can you post your dyno sheet?

 

Can u read my post again and tell me what crank i have!!!!! READ BEFORE U POST SOMETHING!!!!!!!

He has a gsr block and i have a LS block.But the setups r pretty close.

 

lol. you dont have to get pumped. But, didn't see the itr crank and rods. But, if you knew better you know not to compare your numbers to his and say mine made this lol. Unless you dyno'd same day, same place, same elevation, same humidity and same exact setup down to bore, bolt-on's, oil used, clearances etc. It's just irrelevant, please do research

 

if you want more power I would get bigger cams, I know yours aren't maxxed or anything its just alot easier to make more power on s2s2's or something comparable.

 

The way u sound in ur post was like a smart *** kid so thats the way i took it.I didnt post my specs for him to think he should it make the same whp. Its just an idea and why i have to do reasearch?There's nothing to research.

His
82mm GSR block
GSR crank
GSR rods
RS machine PR3 82mm pistons
(CR is 11.35:1 or so)
B16 head
ITR cams on S2 gears
B16 IM
CF Whale ***** intake
RMF narrow header
B16 trans w/ LSD
No cat, testpipe into
WS2 catback exhaust

Mine
LS Block= I have shorter block by less then 1mm
ITR crank= Same
ITR Rods= Same
ITR pistons= He has bigger domes
ITR head= same head
ITR cams w/ AEM cam gears= yeah
ITR IM= I got better IM
Blox VS w/ 3" intake= " "
DC sport header= He has a better header
ITR tranny 4.4= yeah
Hi flow cat w/ thermal exhaust= I have a better exhaust



Ofcourse there's some difference on the setups but he has some better parts and i have some too, and the conditions of the engines r different too but my point on my post was just an idea for him to go by but whatever!!!!!

 

Like stated earlier, ditch that crappy intake, and i've seen those exhausts hold back a lot of power.

 

It stopped making power at 8200 so it pointless for me to rev it past that. Ill have to see if i can come across a scanner so i can put my dyno sheet up for you guys to look at.

When i go to the track i will be running open header and i also made a "magic arm" intake to try out and see how it does. The ecu isnt tuned for those 2 mods, BUT i think i will still get usable hp out of them, especially at high rpm. Any thoughts on this?