I won't put this in GDD for obvious reasons.

I'm curious what ITR owners think...

I've owned an ep3. I have had two 8th gen Si. I have never had an ITR, but knowing what i know and experienced with the ITR, between both cars, i just can't see the parallels, or atleast parallels that would be stronger than how the 8th gen Si relates to previous gens of Si.

to quote myself in another post, "...different generation of enthusiasts, different goals, different use/reasons for the cars, etc. An ITR would never have a subwoofer, navigation or sunroof, or shitty suppliers for their parts. Honda made the 99-00 Si as a way to bring the Si moniker back, but without stepping on the toes of the then current GSR. The ep3 had a more powerful engine than the other civics in its gen, but again, in order to not encroach on the RSX-S, they held it back with a 5 speed and a lower power engine. well, since the demise of the RSX-S, there is nothing else stateside for the Civic to run against from the Honda/Acura lineup. so by default it got the 6 speed and k20z3. it'd be totally outclassed versus the other econoboxes from competing mfrs if it DIDN'T have that. the Civic Si is exactly what it says it is - the higher performance Civic. it's not a stripped down, limited edition, track intended sports car meant for a very small niche of enthusiasts."

maybe i'll be surprised by the results and your thoughts, who knows.

 

Do you really want to see another thread that Ross gets upset in?

 

haha, wait, has this been debated in here previously? i'm sorry if so, i browsed but must have missed it.

EDIT: oh...i see a 3 page thread in this subforum about the review of the Si. let me look into that -

 

https://honda-tech.com/forums/showth...light=civic+si

 

yeah, i figured since it had gone mutiple pages that something sprouted up toward the end ; )

i'm curious what everyone else thinks, currently. I know what Ross thinks, maybe others agree, i don't know, but i'm set to find out!

 

sry IMO the new civic doesnt have any "personality" so to speak. sure they are kinda fun to drive but they dont have the feel an R does. An ITR has a raw feel like it wants you to drive it hard! the new civic is just another good Honda. Not bashing the civic, they are great cars and i wouldnt mind one for a DD but IMO the ITR blows it out of the water!

 

The new Si is a strut based appliance designed to provide a safe, comfortable driving experience. Too blunt?

 

Have you read the GDD thread (and there was one in here) about the recent article about the Civic Si vs. ITR comparo?

https://honda-tech.com/forums/showth...light=civic+si

https://honda-tech.com/forums/acura-integra-type-r-8/itr-article-insideline-2732655/

 

But I wish to be mean yet again.

 

I LOL'd.

IMO option 2.

 

No! Two toally different cars. Even the 2010 Honda Civic Type-R and the 2000 Honda Integra Type-R are two very different cars. The SI is a downgrade from the JDM CTR, which IMO the new JDM CTR isn't as much of a car as the DC2 ITR.

 

I have both of these cars. The SI is better, for strapping an infant into their car seat.

 

should have just gotten a db8 ITR. hahaha jk

 

i can see paralells, sure.

but there's no denying they're completely different cars for completely different purposes. i'm just glad there's atleast ONE Honda left that's got any pep.

 

No more needs to be said. IMO they are not comparable.

 

Its a good attempt of Honda to provide a peppy little car but its not a track designed car by any means. I used to own an 06 rsx-s and it wasnt close the an ITR either. The rsx-s and si are basically the same car which neither are close the the ITR.

 

I disagree. The Si is much more performance oriented then the RSX ever was. Thats why the current Si made the RSX obsolete.


For those saying these cars are not comparable. Thats not true. As much as I would like to live up to my ITR elitist reputation, they are comparable just not the same. I have spent alot of tine autoXing and tracking both of these cars. Si and R.
The Si has alot of the same characteristics behind the wheel that the R has. Where the Si lacks is....
Its heavy. You can really feel the extra weight moving around behind you.

The brakes are no where close. Not even on the same planet.

The steering isnt as responsive and doesn't feel as nimble. It lost the "point and shoot" feel of the R

The tiny steering wheel just pisses me off.

VSA pisses me off too. I know you can turn it off, but still.

Whomever thought DBW in a car was good idea should be shot.

The 6 speed tranny is weaker than the 5 speed. Seems to pop out of 3rd at the worst times.

The shifter feel doent have that "direct feel" of the R



Other than that. Its a great A & B driver.
Also after driving them I believe the 4dr is the better platform. It just felt more solid and rigid with less body flex in hard corners.

 

stock 18s?
sound deadening?
sunroof?
no special kit, hubs, colors
no numbering
no stickers

not really in the ITR grouping

 

Huge wing?

 

wait, 18's? so i got shorted with my stock 17's? wtf!

there is a sticker on the side of my car that is essentially mumbling something about i-vtec

 

I voted no not even close. The new Civic Si is a nice car dont get me wrong but no where near the spirited Type R feel. Its basically just for those that want an upgraded faster and nicer looking Civic. The car does not feel like it was meant for the track one bit, too much luxury and not enough sport to be in the same class as the R. Power wise, the weight kills the Civic Si. To me they just feel too clunky, the extra weight is deffinately apparant once you drive it. If anything I would compare it more to a GSR. I would much rather drive a newer Civic Si compared to a GSR though. I dont even think you can compare it to any of the new Honda's even the Type R's. Just a different type of breed. Honda's just arent as spectacular because of the luxuries added to suit the newer style of cars. Bigger, quiter, more features... The motors are still very impressive, just not in the chassis they come in.

 

I voted no, but that I understand the parallels and understand why someone would think so.

The DC2 ITR was a pure homologation special. It was designed to make up for design differences that made it difficult to compete in the basically factory-OEM series in which Spoon and others wanted to compete.

The biggest thing they fixed was something we don't talk about much, namely the tendency for an un-re-enforced rear shock tower to tear under the strain of many laps with R comps.

The series in which the car originally competed did not allow for bracing that was not a part of the chassis design to start with. We never really saw that problem in US racing of the DC Integra, but we benefited from it when we started racing the homologated DC2 ITR.

I think that if you really liked your old ITR as a commuter car and you're not really ready to move on to a bigger car, you'll like driving the Civic Si as a commuter.

But the Civic Si simply has a lot of stuff on it that we would never have put on the ITR even if the items had been available at the time. Hell, even AC was an option for 1998 and 1997, remember.

Ross, a moderator who was reviewing for Roadfly, seems to feel rather definitely that if you were looking in a daily driver for the same kind of feeling you have on the street in your ITR, that the Civic Si is something you should consider. Watching his review of the Civic Si, it is impossible for him to conceal how the car makes him feel and how it brings back memories of his ITR.

 

The AC option was why I did not go for the ITR in 1997 when I bought my GSR. I lived in Wilmington, NC and it was damned hot.

 

In April of 1998 when I bought my GS-R, the dealer tried like bloody hell to unload on me a CW ITR that he had been unable to sell. It was a 1997 (!!) that had just sat on the floor for over a year because he couldn't sell it.

A couple of months after I got the GS-R, I had learned more about the ITR and decided that I'd get one if they ever came out again.

Although there was nothing really wrong with the GS-R, it is one of the Hondas I have owned for the shortest amount of time, from 04/1998 to 12/1999 when I bought the '00 ITR #110 that is still my track car.

:-)

 

I worked at an Acura lot at the time and some dealers decided to install AC's and even sunroofs and cruise when they came in. They didnt sell well in 97 and 98 so some "not so informed" GM's of these dealerships thought that they where doing somebody a favor by doing these things. They thought they where making the car more Acura/luxury feeling.