alright, I know you cant give me a definite answer. but as it sits now, a 01 accord EX 5spd coupe. just has the extra intake crap before the filter housing removed and exhaust. spec v has I/H/E. accord also has around 500 pounds on the nissan.

needless to say from a stop the accord just flat out gets spanked and on the freeway it isnt AS bad but its still pretty sad.

if I was to swap the H22 head on, using K20 pistons for an 11+:1 cr, stock H22 cams, no porting or anything, and get myself a CAI and header, do I even have a chance?

I know the one built with skunk 2 cams, ITB's, and 12.8:1 pistons only laid down 249/181 which is no slouch, but when you consider the spec V weighs so much less and has 175/180 stock(at the crank), Id assume freeway I might be able to take em, but still Id have a real hard time from a stop. I would also be running the stock 01 EX tranny.

and for the ECU, the H22 ecu would work far better than the F23's, right? it would be going untuned for probably quite a while, if ever being tuned(which Im sure will cost the build some decent power right there).

 

don't forget gearing too... if you can keep your car in it's most optimum rpm range you'll stand a better chance against the nissan compared to slowly wrapping out each gear...

 

well, I know that the stock tranny isnt the best option. but this is the wifes car, and its not going to get that much money dumped into it. she bought it without me around, and I didnt even have a clue what she was buying, which is why she ended up with an accord. I mean I really like the body style, and it isnt a COMPLETE dog, but I really would have rather started with a civic hatch/coupe or teg hatch, which is what Ill be doing for myself. but since she owes so much more than her car is worth right now, no way we can sell it, and if we gave it back wed have to come up with a bunch of money, so we well probably be keeping it for a long time, which is why Id want to do a little to it, but I dont want to sink much into it, because IMO, when it weighs almost 50% more than the EG hatch I want to build for myself, its pretty much a lost cause unless I want to put a few G's into it.


I would just like to get it a little quicker. beating the spec V with it isnt so important, because I know my hatch will once I finally get around to it, it would just be nice to quiet the nissan owner a little sooner.

 

Well consider the F23 is ~140ish hp stock with around the same torque and the H22 or H23 starts at 200hp stock (can get up to 220 for a Type S) and you get a better geared transmission for acceleration (optional LSD too which helps) it will give you a much better fighting chance.

Your other alternative, which does very well is turbo on the F23. Quite a few members went that route and are definitely happy with it.

H22 swaps are in the Accord FAQ so you get an idea of what is involved
Turbos are also noted in the Accord FAQ but you can also go to the Forced Induction section and read up on the Turbo F thread.

(I went with an H22A swap in my 5th gen and loved it)

 

well, I originally thought about an H22 when she first brought the car home. but now, we dont want to put that much into it. considering a OBD2 H22 swap runs around 3k+, I can get a civic hatch and a B20 to start my project for alot less than that.

and the turbo is that same deal, more than we want to spend on it. I know it is a good route though, no frm liners and low comp....

do you think an H22's ECU running a G23 could lay down 185/155+, not enough to take the spec v, but enough to at least not get embarrassed at every stop light.

 

oh, and also, another thing we were considering was a F20B or H22 longblock/ecu and mate it to the stock trans for now. I know the trans wouldnt be the optimum, and we could do the trans swap later, but we could get a longblock and ECU for about a G, little less maybe for the H, little more for the F.

 

What's prohibiting you from getting an OBDI swap? I did an OBDII to OBDI swap unless you're like California where they'll ding you for it it should not be a concern.

And to clarify, you have an F23. The G23 is a coined term for a F block and an H head.

I would suggest doing it all at once and not do the motor now, and trans later.

 

whats prohibiting me from an OBD2-OBD1 swap is a. dont want to mess with the wiring, and dont want to spend money on a jumper harness. b. we dont have inspections here, but we move alot and might have inspections where we go.

and I know I got an F23 now, I was looking at the F20B, the DOHC VTEC engine, I know Id be losing displacement, but Id be gaining some revs as well as a nice HP increase.

and money dictates how it goes. and Ive had the engines out of hondas so many times its cake, and doing the tranny later is an easy deal.

 

You can't tune OBDII btw, one of the biggest reasons people do that. You won't be able to run any ECU other than the stock one. The wiring is incredibly simple and straight forward. The guides are in the Accord FAQ

Jumper harness is really only like $60. And you'll have to spend at least a $1000 in maintenance items when you get the motor (injectors, plugs, wires, clutch, flywheel, fluids, timing belt, water pump, etc) You're much better off saving up before doing the swap.

Saving money by going to the H22A (like $1700 FULL swap or ~$1900 with LSD) and putting it towards maintenance and you're set

But do what you want, there are plenty and I mean PLENTY of threads on the topic.

 

I know, but if I went straight H22 or F20 swap, I wouldnt tune it, because if would be a factory ECU running a factory spec motor.

and Ive gotten 3 engines from importers, and have never spent that much on maintanence.

timing belt and water pump can be had for around 100 bucks, cap/rotor/plugs is about 20 bucks, engine oil/filter, trans fluid, and coolant is only about 45 bucks at most. Ive only replaced wires a few times, because the ends were so corroded when I bought the car, or some reason like that. the ones that are still in good shape, have never tested out of spec for me no matter how old they were. never had to replace the injectors in any of them, sensors have always been good, etc..

I always got them from hmotors, maybe thats just a good place and thats why I got lucky everytime.

I appreciate the help and everything, but I really dont need any info on actual swaps, or assembly of a G23, I have swapped from AT to MT, D15 to DOHC ZC to B18B to B20b, B16 to B18C, D16 to B16a.....

I am simply curious to see if anyone can tell me whether or not a G23 quipped 01 coupe would even be able to touch a 04 spec V. I know that noone can really tell me "yes, you will win by a little", or "no, youll lose by a little" but it is possible to tell me "no, youll still get smoked" lol. and if a basic G23 isnt going to come close to beating the spec V, then the stock F23 is going to just remain where it is.

 

I was reading what I wrote, and that line about not needing help, I realized I might be coming off as a bit of a dick.

not my intention. there is still PLENTY I dont know, just showing that I do know my fair share and have done it, and that the point of this thread wasnt to receive help with the actual build/swap

 

Haha, well to give you an idea, a H22A swapped 5th gen with an H22A transmission is capable of high 14's in a 1/4.

The 6th gen is a touch heavier than the 5th AND you're wanting to keep the F23 transmission. The SpecV is stated to have around a 15.5 quarter.

So I would say you have no chance with the F tranny, and a much better chance with the H.

 

alright, thats about what I wanted to hear(well, that type of answer, not that actual answer, lol)

I had heard people tell me that an H22 could put an accord into the 14's, I just didnt think they could be right since id never seen it in person, and the power to the weight didnt sound right to me.

now maybe the H22 is a more valid candidate. I have wanted to run a F20B for a while, do you think a CG coupe with an F20B mated to the T2T4 tranny would hang with a H22 equipped CG coupe? (on a side note the H22 would be perfect because it was 2 days ago she was telling me of an argument she had a few days ago with a kid who was saying an H22 would take her car, and she denied that it would even be close. lol)

I mean hmotors has the OBD1 H22 for 1800, then 300 for the LSD, and then to keep even numbers say 100 for the OBDII-IBDI deal. (2200)

hmotors has the F20B LB for 1000, 200 for the ECU, and 900 for the T2T4 LSD tranny. (2100)

I know Id be giving up about 15 ft/lbs, but I like the idea of the F20b because I feel like it would be like driving the B16 of the big bores. I like a screamer more than a stump-puller(even though no honda could be called so).

maybe Ill have to give her some of my money to put with her refund and get a swap in her car

 

A F20B is essentially a destroked H22A. They're fairly comparable.

 

alright, I think I got her on the hook with the H22 option.

well probably wait til we have the money for a lightened fly and new clutch, CAI, and header.

how large of a TB can you go on a I/H/E H22 to gain some upper end without sacrificing much throttle response/low end?

I would like to gather everything, hide it, make the swap and then go play with the nissan before I let her know whats been done. Im sure she will notice the accord sounds a little more throaty, but maybe she will just think we only got a CAI for the F23.

and say I wanted to eventually tune it, if I was to mod the ecu, is there basic programs out there I could flash without tuning on a dyno, somewhat like the hondata reflashes for the S2k/RDX/RSX/etc...

 

and Im looking at something like a 11-12 lb steel fly and not a 8lb aluminum one. Id like to keep some sort of inertia for the freeway.

 

Some things you may want to look at.

BlackTrax IM spacers (pretty decent gains for low $$)
EuroR IM (pretty awesome gains - BlackTrax sells those too)

There are several basemaps for things like I/H/E H22's and what not available from like Phearable.net using Chrome or UberData. But you'll probably want to ask them.

 

I was trying to figure out what your deal was about beating a spec V, then I saw this post. Too funny.

Yes, you can get a reflash, but 1) there is no guarantee it will be better suited to your app, and 2) it will be obsolete as soon as you change anything in your setup. Switching to a tunable ecu gives you the opportunity to get the most from your set-up as well as being able to re-tune when something is changed.

 

I know, it is a little immature to care so much about beating one car, and not just enjoying your own. but you dont know how many times I have to hear about how fast her nissan is and how no honda here can beat it, of course there is one civic that she says can, but its because "it has everything done to it and hondas need everything to beat her"

Ill admit the car is quick, and its fun to drive. but she also thinks shes beaten a STI that was able to pull an R6.... I tried telling her that the guy obviously cant drive because a stock STI would leave her behind like she wasnt trying... she agreed but still brings that up in her arguments. and was even telling me about her argument with someone else and how her "honda gurus" were on her side that an H22 couldnt touch her car, and that an H22 needed a bunch of work to pump out 195HP.... some guru's, lol(I am 99% sure they were not talking WHP either)

I just wish I still had my 92 GSR or my 11:1 B20 EG hatch.... all I got aside from the wifes 01 is a 93 auto accord with 290k, so Im not going to be beating her with that!

 

Is her car stock? Because I think it's lame when people brag about how fast there stock car is even if it's quick. A REAL Tuner can take a slow car (such as a Accord) and put their own time, money, work and knowledge and fix it up to be quick. They got the REAL bragging rights not the lamo who buy a quick car and brags.

 

Immature, maybe, but I would be pretty pissed about losing to a girl as well. My wife's best friend drives an STI, and I won't run her until I'm boosted. At least then I would have some kind of a chance. The girl can drive, she's been racing shifter karts for 10+ years.

 

I/H/E is all. they got it used, and the harness was messed up at the firewall, and they think it might have been from some kind of engine management that was ripped out before it was sold(auction is where they got it) so there could be something internal, but they didnt do it if so...

from a stop one time though, there were 4 guys in the accord, 4 girls in her car, and I got slaughtered. by the time I hit 60 I would say that she had at least 5+ cars if not more(was quite a while ago). about an hour later the same day on the freeway I was messing with her and it wasnt quite as bad, but still pretty bad.

 

lol, the part about getting beat by a girl isnt what bothers me, its getting beat by a mouthy girl who brags about her car which is really nothing special, I just dont have anthing to compete at the current time(totalled one of my integras a long time ago, and have never recovered and gotten back into a nice honda yet)

 

My friend owns a 02 SE-R Spec-V, and I have had the privilege of driving it on numerous occasions.

I honestly love the way it drives. The thing pulls like nobody's business because of the torque and the short 6 speed. It will definitely surprise you. HOWEVER, it has its limits.

No doubt, it will NOT beat an STi or pull on an R6... at least if both of those vehicles are actually racing and they don't need a "driver mod." The only surprising car I have seen it beat is a new Dodge Charger Hemi from a dead stop (of course once they got to 80+, the charger stomped the Spec-V).

The things are also notoriously hard to get to make power comparable to other cars with the same mods (due to the way the engine was designed, at least for Forced Induction). Not to say they can't, but its hard, AND expensive...

Sounds like your friend is too cocky for their own good. I would strongly suggest you swap to a shorter trans. When I've "raced" my 98 against the Spec-V, one of the definite advantages he has is that his powerband comes in almost instantly. You might have noticed this as well.

 

yeah, they got 180 ft/lbs or something dont they?

I definitely noticed that and the fact that the gears are nice and short.

I was driving it by myself to pick her husband up from work one time, and I had it in 6th gear cruising at 50, and when I hit a 25-30 degree incline I didnt even need to downshift, or even give it much more throttle for that matter.

I have the argument for if she complains that we swapped to beat her(I had it plannned from when I wanted to shove an H22 in a civic), its just what nissan did with her car, take the big engine out of the next model and stuff it in her car. "whats the base sentra have, a 1.8, you have a 2.5. the civic had a 1.6, now it has a 2.2- not my fault honda didnt cheat from the factory!" lol