NOTE: NO I WILL NOT DO A LS/CR VTEC, NO I WILL NOT SWAP AN H22, NO I WILL NOT USE A DIFFERENT MOTOR/BLOCK OTHER THAN MY B16A, I AM NOT VIN DIESEL THEREFORE I DON'T LIVE A 1/4 MILE AT A TIME. SO DON'T RECOMMEND I USE A B18A/B, B20B/Z, H22, K-SERIES, B17, OR B18-GSR/ITR.

What I want from my build:

1.) Reliability
2.) Gas Mileage
3.) 180-200WHP
4.) All on 93 pump gas
5.) Cost effective build/parts (Higher cost parts just means longer build time, but would prefer lower cost, proven parts)

What performance mods I have so far:

1.) 3 in.Short Ram intake with K&N Cone Filter
2.) Ebay 4-1 Headers
3.) Thin Metal Headgasket (increases compression)
4.) GSR transmission, with performance Clutch + lightweight flywheel

Now, where do I start????

I need a catback exhaust to complete the typical bolt-ons of I/H/E,
but beyond that what should I do next? Some say start with the head, others say start with the block. Some people recommend cams, others recommend retainers/springs/cam gears first, then cams.

Also, should i swap/trade/sell my GSR tranny for a B16 tranny? Or should I just replace certain gears within my GSR tranny?

Now, I would love to rev to 10k RPM, and run 13's (high or low lol). If that's even possible considering my goals I don't know lol. But to sum up what i want....

A high revving, great sounding, reliable, fast (13-14sec 1/4 ET),with a smooth power-band (if possible, i don't really like spikes at Vtec point with certain types of cams).

 

whats your budget? that's going to be a big factor in reaching your goals. when you cant do much yourself and have little to no knowledge about how to do it,.......

good luck

 

My budget will fluctuate, depending on bonuses at work, overtime put in, income tax returns, etc lol. I'm your typical, everyday, Honda enthusiast on a normal 9-5. Right now,
I can afford an upgrade worth $500, but I'm not necessarily looking to make a time-lined build thread so much as I am a blue-print or guideline for where to start with my b16, and how to finish it so that my goals are met.

If I had to put a price on what is realistic to me, considering my earnings...I'd say my budget falls between $1500-2000 in parts alone (no labor costs) within the span of a year-year 1/2.

I can hypothetically do most stuff myself, since i am a military reservists with access to multiple chassis lifts, Engine hoists, specialty tools, impact tools, etc. Now having access to the tools and knowing how to use those tools to get a particular job done are two different things. I lack the knowledge to do most of this myself, and considering the fact that this is my DD, it would be hard for me to keep her in the shop for long periods of time while i do the work myself.

But i am willing, and able to make the appropriate sacrifices (w/ regards to transportion, etc), to tackle a particular job most here deem appropriate for a careful DIY'er like me.

So having said that...whats a good start.....

 

Better gearing will make the biggest difference:
http://www.teammfactory.com/products...0Ratio%20Gears

 

Oresama, I have been the owner of an EDM ek4 vti (b16a2) for over 7 years now and in my own opinion I would suggest you stay away from major mods like cams,nos,turbo if you really want reliability and good mpg.

the cost to those mods would also be in the high dollar figures anyway.

I dont know if you are aware that you can mate everything you have including the head to a gsr/itr shortblock and up the dissplacement for very little.

all you would need would be a shortblock and some minor gaskets etc which in total would be around 1k (if your able to find a healthy shortblock near you off a forum etc)
and you would easily see gains between 15-20whp,keep original vtec oil passages,not require any vtec kit etc,and stay oem.

you could also sell the gsr tranny for pretty much the same amount a sir go's for (or direct trade) and accellerate faster, if possible you could also sell the b16 shortblock and bring down the cost even further down.

trust me its a piece of cake to do and is wayy easier then installing valves,springs,cams,turbo, etc.

I know you already wrote your not interested in such an upgrade and I appologize for still advising you that but all Iam trying to do is be honest and trying to help.

Iam very certain that if you want good mpg,reliability,power than the 1.8 upgrade is the best solution especially with the budget you have.

 

*******NOTEWORTHY******

the only way you can rev to 10,000 RPM on even a semi-regular basis reliably and make power (there's no need to rev that high if you aren't making any power that high) without grenading your motor is to get a B16A or a B16B. get the crank dynamically (with the flywheel, clutch and pulley) balanced, light weight balanced rods and light weight balanced pistons. i would even go so far as to say that you would need a crank girdle (even with the 77.4mm stroke) to stabilize the mains from deflection at that RPM. of course, you are also required to have the obligatory headwork/valvetrain, cams, header, intake manifold and fuel/tuning to supplement those high revolutions on your B16A/B. its all about SYNERGY AND OPITIMIZATION.........

i am in the military too. being able to do most of the work yourself, have access to tools and technicians and having a place to do it is a HUGE advantage you have over others.

if you want a lower cruising RPM and a lil better MPG, keep the GSR tranny and combine it with the 4.928 final drive. the GSR's .787 5th gear is better for those reasons. if you dont care about either of these issues get the B16A tranny and final drive for its shorter gears and you will have the ULTIMATE in manipulation of the powerband.

******OF NOTE*******

THE SINGLE MOST IMPACTFUL MOD YOU CAN PERFORM ON A B16A/B IS A 4.928 FINAL DRIVE

 

I have driven a b16a eg (edm vti) with 4-1 h,decat,3inch piping,stage 2 cams & gears, skunk2 intake manifold,tb,lighweight crank,rods,pistons which made around 12 comp,breather,tune etc and yes its wicked at high rpms but its certainly very very very poor at DD drivability,low end power,mpg and sounds horrible unless your at high rpms on wot otherwise it sounds horrible and even that thing wasnt making power till 10k which I find pointless.

plus I dont think the op has the money to even build half a build like that.(all costed over 6k for him excluding the labour and I dont think the op can do this build himself either)

switching the fd for that final gear ratio would do nothing but give you a very close to sir gearing and have a even shorter fifth at the end,how is that any better than just simply switching to a sir gearbox? if 5th is soo much an issue and lower rpms is going to get you better mpg than why not switch to a cheaper ls 5th?

I researched alot on a sir gearbox with a ls 5th because I am in Germany,we have the Autobahn and trust me driving a car that switches to vtec after 105 mph isnt fun nor efficient in a highway where grandma's drive at +100 mph,anyway there are alot of vti's here with ls 5th's and Iam yet to see anyone say they gained mileage from it,most said its too long for the b16 making you push harder on the throttle and your back to square one!

 

Hey Guys.....Thanks for the info . For the record, I do own a JDM OBD1 B16A. It's very very fast (to me, which is all i care about lol) with potential for more. Reliability is a big deal to me (which is why it was number one on my list of goals) and the B16 seems to be designed to (theoretically) handle higher rotations at much lower stress levels than its B series counterparts.

Meister: I considered exactly what you recommended, and thought heavily on the convenience factor of having a GSR/ITR block sitting in the shop on an engine stand, awaiting the install of parts at my convenience, with my B16 block serving up DD duties until GSR/ITR block is fully built and ready for install. But then I considered reliability, and wasn't sure I could reliably do this myself lol. (Of course I'm referring to the assembly of an engine block lol. If it's not as hard as it seems please enlighten me, since I enjoy doing my own work when the skills required are not so daunting.)

EG6: Where can I get the crank, etc "dynamically" balanced? And aren't most all aftermarket forged pistons and rods, say like JE, Wiseco, etc already balanced during manufacturing? (I would hope they're balanced, given the intended use & cost) Who do you recommend purchasing the rods and pistons from, and what compression ratio am I looking for, considering i want to run pump gas? Concerning the girdle, is there a stock/oem piece I can use, or is an aftermarket piece all that's available for the B16? Also, I drive 400 miles to my hometown once or twice a month, and commute weekly to work and school via I95. Where, with the 4.9 FD, and while in 5th gear, will my rpms sit say at a steady 50, 65, and 75 mph respectively?

Thanks again guys..... and if the 4.9 FD RPMS under highway speeds are manageable/not excessive to me ....rest assured the FD will be my very next upgrade. Cheers

 

Oresama I wont lie I have never built an engine myself so I wouldnt be able to enlighten you on that,but for the FD math doesnt not lie so you really dont need much experience for that one to understand the figures.

either very easily learn how gears ratios are calculated or use on the gear ratio calculators provided online,they even readily have stock gear options so all you do is pick a gearbox,set rpms,and if wanting to change fd change it to the ratio wished for.

you can even run it against a second gearbox in order to compare which I suggest you do.

pick the usdm gsr vs the usdm si/sir and change the fd input to 4.928 for the gsr than compare. you will see it ends up being literally indentical to a sir gearbox only with an even shorter(horrible) 5th ratio.

plus the fd out there go for 550 + tax + shipping+ labour how do you justify that when all your going to have is pretty much a sir gear ratio at the end?

gsr + fd means no selling (making money) and purchasing a product that costs +600

go sell the gsr gearbox and get an sir for the same cost and pay $0 instead of 600.

as for the rpms with and with out the 4.928 fd.

stock 50(2500)-65(3200)-75(3700)
4.9fd 50(2800) -65(3600)-75(4200) these numbers are with 195/55/15 wheels (wont change by much unless you have huge or tiny wheels) and the speedometer factor isnt acounted for here(most Honda speedometers read off by %6 so your actually doing 50mph when yours read 53mph,trust me its true just compare your speedometer to one of those machines that read your speed at school zones and such)

 

Buy a Hondata S100 and tune it! That will be about $350-450!
The motor won't magically make 30 more horsepower, but you'll
feel a huge difference from idle to red line in all around power!
It feels alot more responsive and Hondata has many safety features
to keep your motor safe! Also... the Hondata will allow you to
tune the motor for that header and exhaust you'll be getting! Plus,
if you buy anything else for your engine in the future, you'll be able
to tune your car immediately and avoid lean/rich fuel mixtures that
may do damage to your engine!
A Hondata or any type of stand alone engine management should
be your first purchase! But for god sakes! stay away from
VAFC's! Hondata's S100 is the same price and WAAAAY more features!!

 

you got a pm i got the perfect b16a motor for you! let me know if you are interested. you can sell your b16 and have some extra cash.

 

open up your exhaust!
3 inch the whole way back!

or just do weight reductions:
carbon hood
wheels
brakes
carbon fenders

carbon everything!!!

 

Split personality?

If you cant run 14's with a JDM B16 then just give up....Ive seen CRX's run high 13's with them...hell I ran mid 14's in a pig of an Si hatch at full weight

Just get a FD upgrade and a good LSD...wavetrac etc...they are like $795 retail

When your ready to go faster the nice trans will go great with an H22 powerband

 

put a 100 shot on it. lol

instant power and when not in use your motor is stock so stock mpg.

sounds dumb, but honestly nitrous is really really fun.

just put a walbro fp in it and get it tuned.

 

110 shot direct port

1997...12.8 with an Si hatch B16, bolt-ons and 110 DP...lol...on Racing Hart Tracers! Love those rims!

 

Ummm.I don't think 3" will help any on a stock to mild build. Besides, its about anti reversion as well. Not just size. No offence.

 

build a stroker B16A and be done with it. the short-rod stroker motor will make more torque and have a fatter power curve than a similar-stroke B18/B20 motor.

If you are dead set on being slow, then keep your stock B16 stroke.

 

You should get a copy of my video that actually walks you through a 200whp B16 build part by part and modification by modification.

Youtube has trailers of it.

It will take some of your confusion away.

 

You should do a type r valvetrain with type r cams. As for the bottom end, rebuild it and use ITR pistons. That would be a great start

 

you do know that the ITR pistons have a taller compression height than the B16a pistons. the pistons will hit the head.

 

any respectable performance machine shop can balance your crank. if their method of balancing does not include at least the flywheel and indexing, go elsewhere for this service. while the crank is at the shop you may want to get the journals micropolished also. i should have specified why i said balanced rods and pistons. all UPPER echelon rod and piston manufacturers sell balanced sets. i suggest Wiseco for 2618 and Supertech for 4032 piston wise. Crower has some of the best rods i have seen for Hondas. anywhere from a 11.5 to 11.8 compression ratio is good for a DD B16A on pump gas.
the stock girdle is a cast piece that only braces three of the mains. Function 7 makes a forged unit for all five mains that can be installed without any extra machining.
go here to purchase and/or calculate your RPMs with which ever gearing combo you decide to use **** http://www.teammfactory.com/gearcalculator.php

 

With the Omni b16 build DVD. It will give you step by step instructions for building one that makes roughly 200whp.

 

i have a jdmb16a block with a gsr head and type-r internal in the head and a ls tranny and im easy pushing 200 and its my dd,

 

True story and great vid...bought a hard copy years ago lol