I have a 2004 Honda Civic with 71,500 Miles Manual. Stock 100%.

In 2005 with 12k miles on it, I noticed problems and griding noises going into reverse. I took the car into Kolbe Honda to only be told that it was normal and that no repairs needed to be made.

4 years have passed with my Honda Care Expiring August 22nd, 2009.

I took my car into Honda of Hollywood and they decided to look into the Transmission. They saw problems with my reverse! They took my vehicle in on July 17th, 2009 and had the vehicle until August 3rd, 2009 (17 days) They "fixed" the problem once and when they test drove it out, according to the Service Manager, there were other "complications" they mentioned that they may have ordered the wrong part.

When I got my vehicle more than 2 weeks later they tell me, "You practically have a new transmission"

Parts Changed:
Bearing, Ball #10, Hondabond, Hldr (reverse shift), Piece, CAM (reverse lock), Fluid MT
2nd Page
Fork Fifth Shift, Gear (reverse idle), shaft (reverse gear), Bearing, Mainshaft, Gear Set, Bearing

Total Cost $1956.52 (Honda Care Paid)

PROBLEM

3 weeks later (1450 miles) I do commute. I notice a whistling, possibly grinding noise that matches the strength of my "revving/ accelerating" I turn the vehicle in immediately to honda and their faces are WHITE. They hold the car for two days and mention that it sounds like a loose bearing.

I am upset and have my friends that are Honda Lovers come down to hear me drive the car and get their opinion... after basic driving back and forth reversing, going on the freeway the following problems are noticable:

1) Fifth Gear Jolt an inch back each time I Accelerate
2) Weird obnoxious Whistling Sound from Transmission (Made me believe that it was magically supercharged lol)
3) When in reverse it wouldn't let me go out of reverse unless jimmied
4) 3rd, 4th and 1 time 5th, jumped into neutral while on the freeway driving home.

On Monday Honda says the following:

1) We suggest you change your clutch like we told you the first time (I nor my hardcore manual-driven friends notice any issue with clutch)
2) We see that a syncro is burned... this has to be your fault and you need to pay for everything to be fixed.
So with my practically new transmission... my syncro burns to a crisp in 1500 of normal everyday driving?
And what would cause that whistling sound?
And why would the Fifth Gear twitch like it was possessed a couple days after taking it from the dealership?

PLEASE HELP!

 

sounds like they shimmed the trans wrong. the size of the case's and gears and shafts can vary a couple thousands so honda makes several different shims to accommodate for the variances if it is off by too much the shifter can pop out of gear it can grind a bit and be a pain in the *** to get into certain gears.

and a syncro won't go out in 1500 miles unless you do something crazy but with these transmission your more likely to stretch the cables first.

 

My car has 71,500 miles on it and I have driven 1,500 miles in 3 weeks after taking the "repaired" car from the shop.

What is the life span of a syncro.. and what would I have needed to do to destroy it?

What on the mecanics part could have harmed the syncro?


Thanx in advance!

 

Well they kept on stalling until your extended warranty expired. If your transmission was legtimately having problems they would have requested authorization to repair when apart. These transmssions are difficult to overhaul, so they messed up something when apart, negligence on their part. If you were to pay for a new clutch install, it would not cost the service deparment any time to remove and open up to see what they screwed up. I remember the first 2001 5 speed our senior, most experienced tech had apart who was very thorough with transmssion repairs. He ended up having to remove the trans a second time to fix a mistake, out of his pocket. The trans can be removed, reapaired, and reinstalled in a single work day, so unless there was a parts backorder they were screwing you, the most authorization would take would be one day.

 

anything honda does work on is automatically warrantied even if the car is out of warranty for something like 90 days or 5,000 miles. and most honda shops won't touch the transmission they out source to some one else to get it fixed cause most tech aren't qualified or would not know what to do with a trans apart. sorry not a fan of most honda techs.

now life expectancy of a syncro it all depend if you don't know how to shift and you screw with it you can kill one off pretty quick but I would say an average life of the third gear syncro with an average driver is probably at least 3 years if you know how to drive technically they should never need to be changed. but I would say 5-10 years on most peoples cars they probably should be changed.

oh and these transmission are actually really easy to work on. definitely easier than the old b and d series (stupid change assembly) and transmisson parts sense there is not as much demad for them individually it is not uncommon for them to be on international back order. I have had to wait 3 months for a cone ring before it sucks!

 

I have a Honda 2004 Civic LX (71,500 miles) 1 owner

Honda repaired the reverse gear and bearing and replaced the reverse fork and 5th Fork.

3 weeks later my trans makes a whining noise. 1 Day of driving later it becomes very difficult to shift and drive.

Honda opened the trans and said my 5th syncro is burned and it could only be my fault. They claim that I went from 5th into reverse on the freeway.

Question:

What done by the shop can cause my syncro to burn so quickly?

 

you driving it like a nascar

 

It was the employees. Problem Solved.

 

and if im not mistaking i do not think you can place it in reverse while the car is in a farward motion.

 

answer: if the shims are off one gear on one stack can be a little lower or higher then it is supposed to be, causing them to brush against the syncro ring and grinding off the teeth or you can burn them up by not having enough fluid in the trans.

 

Service Manager states, "All new transmission fluid was put in the trans. We couldn't have done anything wrong because when you put back together the transmission, if anything was incorrect, you would know it driving out of the lot. He states that it wouldn't take 3 weeks for the effects to take place.

"They only way you can damage a syncro is through bad driving"


Can someone prove this guy wrong?

I need as much insight and evidence as possible.

 

I'd skip the dealership and go straight to Honda USA. If a shop had my transmission apart and it failed three weeks later I would absolutely put the blame on the shop.

The fact of the matter is that the D17 manual transmissions are garbage out of the box to begin with, so it's kind of a lost cause as far as long term reliability.

 

I contacted Honda directly and they filed a report. I received a call from a case manager stating that "Upper Management" received the pictures of the burnt syncro and that could only be caused by me. They can not think of any other way of it happening.

 

i ve build trannies at work that othe r tech have screwed up. the last one i did was almost the same problem you are discribing. what i found was the countershaft or mainshaft i cant rememeber which wasnt clean properly before reasembly causing the hole that supply the gear and syncros to be clogged causing all kind of problems with the shifting... 4th gear sychro was (black) burnt due to lack of lubrication so i would trey and have them repair what they messed up.

it happen to me were ive rebuild a trans want to back off my lift and found trans wasnt right and had to take it apart again. and fix it

good luck hope they do the right thing for you

 

I saw someone install a bearing upside down and cause your symptom.

 

I'm bumping this old thread for one reason:

Original post from OP talks about a whine or whirring noise that keeps up with acceleration. This is a usual indicator of misalignment and/or poor lubrication. Of sufficient oil is in the tranny, then there is something block or partially obstructing the flow internally. Considering the OP mentioned one syncro being burned up, I'd guesstimate that the mechanic who did the rebuild did not align the shimmy up correctly... and another thing. These honda transmission don't like having flushes. Top off and don't replace the tranny fluid. It will last much longer. A flush will also run into poor lubrication flow.

as for other people talking about the noise in reverse-

When you park your car, people pull up on the hand brake and leave it in neutral. This is not wrong per se, but according to a Honda manual I read some years ago, we are supposed to park our civic in reverse. The tip someone mentioned about reverse not catching well so shift to fourth then shift to reverse, is accurate. Two parts to that:

1) The internal shift linkage inside the transmission has safety mechanisms to prevent you from shifting into reverse while moving forward with enough torque. It would be a catastrophic failure if you did shift into reverse while pulling forward.

2) While the engine is running, and while in neutral, ALL GEARS spin inside the transmission. The clutch alleviates the torque on the gears, allowing you to shift into one of the dogs. The syncros help match Rev and wheel speed so its smooth. The rear gear in a lot of the Hondas sometimes do or don't have a syncro. Therefore, while in neutral...clutch into reverse may still make noise. If you experience this, try shifting into reverse while completely still at about 2000ish or a little less RPM. It should be smoother. Or, use a syncro from your other gears. [Preferably not your overdrive aka 5th or 6th gear]

Again sorry for bumping. Just thought I'd info dump some relevant stuff here!

[Edit: When shifting into reverse, don't over force the shifter into the reverse. i am not sure on exactly why but i know that you can do it. Shift until you feel it catch. Like you shift into any other gear, if it doesn't work don't try forcing it into reverse. Just thought I'd make a quick mention on that]

 

Just about all of this is poor advice and factually incorrect. Thanks for bumping an old dead thread.

 

hmm.. im part curious how you figure, and part not sure if I actually want to know. Why respond without elaborating? It definitely sets a certain pretext about your personality.

And in response to that I'll add youaare very welcome then.

[PS: I can provide additional citations for my information if you like sources, aside of just my personal experience. No, they are not wiki links either.]