what is differance between a 3port soleniod and a 4 port soleniod/.
is there any advantage's from 1 to another?

thanks

 

Disclaimer: no internal gate nonsense will be discussed here, they are garbage technology.


A three port solenoid is used to feed pressure to the top hat of an external gate when energized, and bleed the pressure in the top hat off when de-energized. By cycling the solenoid really fast it's easy to maintain a somewhat steady pressure in the top hat that's less than the source pressure. When the bottom hat is fed directly from the pressure source (it always is with this setup) this allows you to hit the "rule of thumb" 20 psi over wastegate spring rating that any MBC can net you; the caveat to this is you don't always get 20 psi over spring rating for a variety of reasons.


4 port solenoids are, quite simply, very very cool. When de-energized they (Humphrey's, anyway) flow straight through to the port directly across the valve, and when energized they X over and both ports on one side feed the port diagonal to them on the other side. This can be used to feed the bottom hat (and vent the top hat) when the valve is off, and to feed the top hat (while venting the bottom hat) when the valve is energized. Since you don't have the bottom of the hat fighting to open the wastegate against whatever pressure is in the top hat, a 4 port solenoid allows for very big boost off of a very small wastegate spring. BTW, thanks to Jeff Evans for dropping that bit on me, it's come in handy.

 

Can you run a 4 port solenoid with a system like hondata and still run it duty cycle based?

 

You should be able to, but I don't touch Hondata with a ten foot pole to say with any certainty.

The thing to worry about is cycling frequency. If running a Humphrey 310/410 (90% of what I deal with) they give the broadest response in the 20-25Hz range, any higher and the operating range becomes quite brief. Not everything out there lets you adjust the frequency, and not everything has a fine enough range of adjustment (AEM sucks in that respect, 15Hz or 31Hz blah).

 

thanks for the info this make a lot of sense, since the 4 port releive's the bottom of its pressure.
but i am running a 3port now and i'm hitting that wall at around 34lbs , i have a 4port from dashlogger(PCS) from there dash boost controller, i was wondering if you could help me with the Hz. the #'s on the soleniod are 31891H
25/07
0707 on the valve body
and my output signal is 30Hz on the ecu or i can switch it to 60Hz

thanks

 

I can calculate it's target response with reasonable accuracy if you know the mH rating of the solenoid's coil. You probably don't, and since you don't know the brand of valve you have it's likely not going to be handed to you.

That being said, you aren't going to hurt anything cycling it too slow or too fast... too slow it'll not be very responsive until you turn it on solid, too fast and it'll have a narrow window of operation (35-65% duty, to pick figures off my head).

 

good info.I have been searching for awhile on what frequency to run my 310 solenoid on and have gotten answers back from as low as 20 and as high as 31Hz.

 

31Hz works with them, but it's a very compressed operating range. They are a huge PITA to set up a closed loop EBC when cycled that high, it's just easier to cycle them lower *if* you have that ability with your EMS.

 

made some calls and found out it's an humphery's 410 valve, but hat your saying at 30Hz there will be a small amount of adjustabllity or it will only raise the boost to a certian amount and then basicly stay open? .

 

At a higher cycling frequency the valve won't begin to open until an intermediate duty cycle, and then it is a short span until the valve stays open all the time even if you aren't at 100% duty yet.

I haven't cycled a 410 valve at 31 Hz before. I ASSume it's the same coil as the 310, but if the internal spool valve is different that can throw off the solenoid's properties. 90% likely you'd be fine with it at 31 Hz in an open loop setting (will require adjustment as temps fluctuate), but expect recurring seasonal spiking or surging if you try to use one closed loop for a little while until you get it dialed in.