Hello people of Honda-tech.

I've been looking to do an H2B swap in my civic for the past few months. I've gained all the knowledge I can from a few topics I created as well as reading all the H2B/F2B FAQ pages. I know which kit I wish to use etc.

Over the weekend I was telling my brother about my future swap and what it is etc. He runs a high performance shop on late GM model cars. I trust his judgement over anything. He is very knowledgable about cars. As I was mentioning my swap I told him I planned on using an H22 Motor with a short geared b16 tranny. He asked why would I run a short geared tranny. You should run something with longer gears to stay in your power band longer.

That is why I started this topic. What is the true purpose of gearing a b series tranny with an H series motor?

 

shorter gears, imo means you can go through your gears faster. not have to wait to get into your power band i think. cause at about third ur basically creepin atleast i am. thats long enough as it is.
my buddy has a gsr swapped da with an ls tranny. everytime i hit third i start walkin him. so in your brothers theory he would win? yet i walk by just bout everytime.

 

ok so if his theory is correct. . . then these examples should be . .

Ex. #1
NA - GSR build would go faster in the 1320 with an LS trans than it would a GSR trans

Ex. #2
NA H22 build would go faster in the 1320 with an H23 trans in comparison to a h22

However, these statements are not correct.

Now ex#1 is pretty much common sense to any B series guy. A few years back a friend of mine tested ex #2 out and the h23 geraing was not the way to go.

Apples to Oranges my friend . .

 

Our honda's dont put out that much HP, so long gears just kill us. I can see where he would say longer gears would help as his cars are probably pushing out some good rwhp and need longer gears.

 

That is very true. Those v8 beasts have more torque too. So having long gears is wiser when torque is in low capacity.

So then if the power band theory is correct, a turbo H22 with an LS tranny will pull harder then a turbo H22 with a GSR or a b16 tranny. Does that make sense?

Opinions! This is a pretty good discussion

 

You're killin me smalls

 

this isnt a discussion you are just making yourself look real stupid! i bought a car with a b16 and ls tranny ran like sheet and the would lose vtec after every shift. heres a tip go search some more!

 

No need to get offensive. It was a simple question you obviously didn't answer. If you don't have anything productive to say then don't say anything at all. Simple stuff.

 

ok lets back up a second. The thread started wrong so lets get it back on track.

The main reasons of the h2b swaps development are drive train alignment and operation. The full h22 swap with its transmission in a civic chassis (of any generation) will offset the axle shaft axle by a large degree (not to mention cutting of your floorboard to feed the transmission cables through). This means that only so much power can be applied in a straight line, and accumulated forces easily break axles when suspension geometry changes during cornering (even at low speeds). The h22 swap used to be not recommended because this was very common. The h2b swap enables the use of a drive train that was designed for this chassis, which means stock components can be used, thus providing stock-like suspension geometry characteristics.

The use of the b series is no doubt a benefit for us to put the h22 power to the ground. With any engine/tranny combo, there is a power band that the trans must tap into at the proper point in order to achieve maximum performance. For our honda engines, the power band is in the mid to high rev range, so generally speaking your would want to get the engine revs high for as long as possible. So a trans that will enable the engine to stay within a higher rev range from gear change to gear change would be appropriate. A tranny with longer gears would stay in the powerband longer, but it would also take longer for the engine to reach that region. Vis versa if the tranny had very short gears, the time spent reaching the power band is short, but the time spent in the power band would be limited as well as the overall top speed. There is an equilibrium that needs to be found in order for you maintain the advantages you want and deal with the disadvantages you will have to trade off.

good luck with your swap

 

Thank you sir! You cleared up a lot of things. That does make sense to find a happy medium.

So then how could we develop an optimum transmission? One with gears to hold in the power band, yet short enough to stay in it between shifts or take little time to get back into it.

 

Another reason to go H2B is that the H trans isn't supported much at all for aftermarket gears and components. It is a huge bulky trans as well. B series parts are easier to find, a lot cheaper, and more abundant.

Axle angle is also a huge factor into going h2b, like lollypopking said...


as far as longer gears etc etc. You can use bigger slicks with shorter transmissions to go faster. any comments?

 

any b series tranny will be able to tap into the h22's power band, but it is a matter of when that's important. To find the answer for you, you must decide what your overall purpose for the car will be. General recommendations from those who have done it say that the ls tranny is similar is feel, ratio, and effectiveness as the stock tranny so there will be small benefits if any. The B16 tranny gears are very short and great at keeping the engine revs high, so many feel that this is suited for autox/road racing. The GSR tranny is widely regarded as the happy medium, giving decent gas mileage for the performance. There is always the ITR tranny w/ LSD which is what I have seen most hardcore drivers use. The gear ratios are similar to that of the b16 but more suited for a motor with larger displacement.