so I got the fluids changed and everything, clutch and brakes bled (only the fronts, can't get the nipples open in the back and didn't want to risk breaking one this close to the track day).

I got an alignment, -2.7 camber in the front, -1.7 in the back. 1/16th toe out in the front, zero toe in the back. ~1 degree of caster.

I aired up my victoracers to 45 lbs. I will let some of that out after bolting them on and getting ready for the track.

what else... I think everything is ready to go. I have these Mugen N-zero dampers, with 500 lb springs in the fron and 600 in the back. I have no idea how the valving is set, but we'll see. I'll have a little screwdriver along to tinker with the settings as the day wears on.

I'm having an odd brake problem: when I press the brake pedal right after being Wide open throttle, it's almost like I have no power brakes. if I coast for a little (a second or two even) with my foot off the gas pedal, I have much better brakes. I may need to look at my brake booster and or maybe just the little check valve at some point. Even at 1000 lbs heavier, my evo outbrakes the civic handily.

Anyway, Texas World Speedway tomorrow. I'll report back how it was.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so I got the fluids changed and everything, clutch and brakes bled (only the fronts, can't get the nipples open in the back and didn't want to risk breaking one this close to the track day).
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sometimes you have to give the little wrench a "whack". wrap a rag around the wrench....and hit it quick and hard with the palm of your hand in the counter-clockwise direction

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I got an alignment, -2.7 camber in the front, -1.7 in the back. 1/16th toe out in the front, zero toe in the back. ~1 degree of caster.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

ok

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I aired up my victoracers to 45 lbs. I will let some of that out after bolting them on and getting ready for the track.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

This air pressure is WAY too high. You should be looking get around 36 PSI HOT, which means starting around 26-28

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

what else... I think everything is ready to go. I have these Mugen N-zero dampers, with 500 lb springs in the fron and 600 in the back. I have no idea how the valving is set, but we'll see. I'll have a little screwdriver along to tinker with the settings as the day wears on.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I probably wouldn't worry about messing with the shocks at your first days event. You are going to have you hands full learning how to drive your car.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


I'm having an odd brake problem: when I press the brake pedal right after being Wide open throttle, it's almost like I have no power brakes. if I coast for a little (a second or two even) with my foot off the gas pedal, I have much better brakes. I may need to look at my brake booster and or maybe just the little check valve at some point. Even at 1000 lbs heavier, my evo outbrakes the civic handily.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hmm... I'd start with that check valve... and look for leaks in your hoses. Mine cracked in the back just behind the intake manifold

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Anyway, Texas World Speedway tomorrow. I'll report back how it was.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Have fun...

don't forget the following...

1.) Drink plenty of fluids... dehydration is common at track days. You can get a headache, and get easilty distracted.
if you aren't pissing every hour, you are NOT drinking enough water/fluids. I like to alternate between gatoraid and water

2.) Bring a chair, sunscreen, hat, and some shade.

3.) don't forget to eat!

4.) Listen to and obey your instructor. They can only teach you what you are willing to listen to and follow and learn

 

Dave summed that all up nicely. I'd be ready to replace those rear calipers, just as a precaution.

 

You said it all... especially the drinking and listening part.
Have fun...!

 

Thanks guys.

I'll be careful. not sure if I can find a FWD instructor, but we'll see.

yeah, I already bought new rear calipers and have them sitting in the garage. my project before the next track day, on May 4th or so.

 

So I headed out to TWS SUnday morning. Almost no-one else showed up. so, we got 8 sessions, 30 minutes each.

I got the hang of the car pretty quickly. I am obviously still driving it pretty cautiously, but in my last couple of sessions drove most sections with at least as much speed as I was in my evo. I was getting on the gas later and shifting a little more than I had to in my previous car. I am stilldeciding whether I really need to be shifting down as often as I am. not sure if there's any benefit from the extra cockpit activity. I know that I need to shift to 3rd when setting up to pass right after corner exit, but when it's just me I may be able to just carry more speed throught the turn in 4th. still deciding. I was able to catch and pass several entry level porsches, an evo ix, an STI, some NSX's, a very poorly driven C6 (non Z06), and some others. I was stalemated with several Cayman S 's. An RS4 on race tires was a little faster than I, and a Porsche Turbo was hella faster than I was. THis was all in HPDE 2 (or "blue," whater). so driver skill was very much a factor.

The car was very well balanced, and throttle steered very well in some of the slower carousel/buttonhook/horseshoe type turns. I didn't have the guts to try it in the high speed sweepers, having scared myself early when lifting right after turnin at about 100mph (it oversteered quite a bit, but recovered under throttle. luckily it was uphill too...) The car is a little "darty" in the straightaway at speeds above 110, but easy enough to keep up with. I'm guessing this is due to the zero toe I have in the back. tire wear in the back is perfect, in the front I could use a hair more camber.

My oil temps kept going up to 230F or so, but I was told in the pits that that was ok (anything under 290- 300 is ok, supposedly, for Amsoil??)

I did use about 1/2 a quart of oil in 70 miles of 4500 rpm highway driving plus 5 30 minute sessions, which bothers me a little, but I guess it is what it is. as long as it doesn't get worse...

Anyway, just my initial feedback fom my first track day. Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.




Modified by L8APX at 11:07 AM 4/7/2008

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crazydave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sometimes you have to give the little wrench a "whack". wrap a rag around the wrench....and hit it quick and hard with the palm of your hand in the counter-clockwise direction</TD></TR></TABLE>

don't do that! i have a permanently broken little bone in my hand from doing that. use a rubber mallet.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So I headed out to TWS SUnday morning. Almost no-one else showed up. so, we got 8 sessions, 30 minutes each.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Wow!! Thats a lot of track time!

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
was getting on the gas later and shifting a little more than I had to in my previous car.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hmmm..why do you think that is?
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I was able to catch and pass several entry level porsches, an evo ix, an STI, some NSX's, a very poorly driven C6 (non Z06), and some others. I was stalemated with several Cayman S 's.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

HPDE Champion!
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
THis was all in HPDE 2 (or "blue," whater). so driver skill was very much a factor.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Good observation!
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

The car was very well balanced, and throttle steered very well in some of the slower carousel/buttonhook/horseshoe type turns. I didn't have the guts to try it in the high speed sweepers, having scared myself early when lifting right after turnin at about 100mph (it oversteered quite a bit, but recovered under throttle. luckily it was uphill too...)
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes.. cars tend to get loose in turns when you let off the gas or step on the brake.
you will get used to this feeling as you get more experience.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

The car is a little "darty" in the straightaway at speeds above 110, but easy enough to keep up with. I'm guessing this is due to the zero toe I have in the back. tire wear in the back is perfect, in the front I could use a hair more camber.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

What was your toe / caster in the front?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


My oil temps kept going up to 230F or so, but I was told in the pits that that was ok (anything under 290- 300 is ok, supposedly, for Amsoil??)
</TD></TR></TABLE>

I regularly see 280+ on my D16z6
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by L8APX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Anyway, just my initial feedback fom my first track day. Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

What were some of the big eye-opening things that you learned?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mike_C &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

don't do that! i have a permanently broken little bone in my hand from doing that. use a rubber mallet.</TD></TR></TABLE>

dang...

how did you do that!?

I suppose that a rubber mallet is better, but a rag or 2 folding in quarters has always been enough for me.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crazydave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

dang...

how did you do that!?

I suppose that a rubber mallet is better, but a rag or 2 folding in quarters has always been enough for me.</TD></TR></TABLE>

from not using a rag or anything... basically using the side of my hand as a hammer now that it's broken, i can hardly twist off an oil filter. have had to learn to do all that crap with my left.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mike_C &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
from not using a rag or anything... basically using the side of my hand as a hammer </TD></TR></TABLE>

That'll learn you. "F- this! *WHAM!-crack*.....oh darn..."

&lt;--- Several scars to show for similarly retarded He-Man-esque moves.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crazydave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
HPDE Champion!
</TD></TR></TABLE>

lol. was more to give an idea about the relative speed of the car, and less bragging.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crazydave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What was your toe / caster in the front?</TD></TR></TABLE> 1/16t toe out in the front, and only about 1 degree of caster. Good point, the caster could be what's causing it to hunt around. I was thinking it felt like the rear was scooting around not the front. will pay closer attention next event.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crazydave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What were some of the big eye-opening things that you learned?</TD></TR></TABLE>

the rpm's that this motor seems to like was genuinely eye-popping. 9000+ rpm has until now not even entered my universe of generally accepted principles. still not sure I am comfortable with it.

I attribute the oil consumption to my extended stays above 6k rpm, so I am also a little disappointed (about the oil consumption).

no abs was interesting for the first time. heavy braking down from 120+ was sometimes a little scary. I got some tail wagging when not braking in a perfectly straight line, and having to back out and reapply pressure with the edge of the track coming up fast was sometimes worrisome. in retrospect it was fine, but there were a coule pf times I wished I'd braked a little earlier.

otherwise it was as expected. I suppose I expected a little more understeer than I got.


I think you asked something else I forgot to "quote" about getting on the gas later. My other car had AWD with LSD's everywhere, so I could get on the gas sooner. Plus, the other car woud take until the apex for the turbo to spool anyway, so getting on the gas earlier was more of a non issue. Too much gas before the apex in the hatch caused me to go wider than I'd have otherwise wanted.

 

Hey Man,

I come from Time Trialing a high HP Evo and am getting used to a 215 WHP Bi8C CRX weighing 2200 pounds with 200 pound driver....it's definitely a different world, and I know what you mean about having to wait to get on the power. With AWD you can just nail the throttle way before the apex...not so now. I'm having a KAAZ 1.5 LSD put in the car next week, which should really help getting the power down...It has a Type R LSD now. I too was surprised witht he amount of power when the thing is in the correct rev range, it flies. Hard to get used to not being lazy in the cockpit. I also found that it's a weird feeling to get used to everything happening at the front of the car. the CRX is very twitchy, and that's a new sensation as well. When we get used to these cars I think there will be an even greater appreciation for relative high power coupled with light weight. Good Luck!

 

Your braking problem is likely the check valve between the booster and the intake manifold. It's allowing the vacuum to leak down, thus no power brakes until you let the manifold build up a bit of vacuum (thus building vacuum in the booster).

I would expect the front toe out to cause a bit of the darty feeling. Toe in on the rear will certainly help straight line stability as well.

If you're interested, I'll be out at TWS with NASA on April 19/20 along with a few other Honda guys. A friend of mine and I (both in Preludes) will be running in PTB (sometimes run in H2 as well). We're hoping a couple of guys who run in H1/PTB in S2000s will be showing up as well. Perhaps we've talked about it before? I recall talking to someone about the TWS event who was going to get a newly purchased race car out to TWS this past weekend. Maybe it was you? I don't recall the screen name, and the IMs have been deleted from my profile. If so, sorry!

If you can come out to the NASA event, feel free to come find us!

 

Hi Percy.

yeah, we're in the same boat now. What have you decided about your car? you were offering it for sale not too long ago. I would've bought it if it had been near street legal (I don't really have a tow vehicle).

Thanks for your encouraging email before I bought my current track car.

TimK

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 117 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Perhaps we've talked about it before? I recall talking to someone about the TWS event who was going to get a newly purchased race car out to TWS this past weekend. Maybe it was you? I don't recall the screen name, and the IMs have been deleted from my profile. If so, sorry!

If you can come out to the NASA event, feel free to come find us! </TD></TR></TABLE>

Hi, yes it was me. I switched to this username so I don't have to keep track of so many, given that I post on other forums too. I wasn't aware it was available here.

I will try to come to the NASA event. I was saving my $ for a POrsche club event, but they wont let me buy one day only. I need to contact NASA HPDE I guess. Even if I don't HPDE I may drive out to watch/visit.

Thanks!

 

http://www.nasatxracing.com
http://www.nasaproracing.com

You can buy just one day with NASA, which is nice. If you're going to only do 1 day, do Saturday. Sunday afternoon will be a 4 hour enduro, so the day ends early for the regular HPDE & race classes.

We'll be in the garages somewhere. If you want to give Hallett a try, we'll be out there in June with NASA.

PS - I'm jealous. I've wanted a hatch for so long. I'd LOVE to have one to race. I love my Prelude too, but a hatch with an engine swap has to be a ton of fun to drive!!

 

Hey Tim,

I'm keeping the car. Just decided to go all out and learn to drive it quickly. It's a challenge, as it is much more difficult to drive than the Evo, but in the end, it will make me a better driver.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hagakure &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey Tim,

I'm keeping the car. Just decided to go all out and learn to drive it quickly. It's a challenge, as it is much more difficult to drive than the Evo, but in the end, it will make me a better driver.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I actually think mine handles a lot like my evo. tailwagging under heavy braking, throttle-steers like it, etc. I have a little longer wheelbase than your CRX though so that makes it a little less prone to swapping ends suddenly.

I am thinking that my oil consumption is likely just the PCV, and not necessarily rings or valveseals. let's see if it gets worse. I hope not. 30 minute sessions are LONG, in my opinion.

Percy just think of this: I bought 2 new rear brake calipers, with brackets and everything, and the total (with tax) was under 100 bucks. Try THAT with an evo...

 

Right On!

I jsut bought new front rotors...for 45.00....that would have been a minimum of 175.00 witht he Evo. I'm loving the lower cost of consumables. Yeah the CRX is a bit of a handful, but I'll get it down in testing this year. Want to run it in PTA next year, as the engine is not HC legal.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I did use about 1/2 a quart of oil in 70 miles of 4500 rpm highway driving plus 5 30 minute sessions, which bothers me a little, but I guess it is what it is. as long as it doesn't get worse...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Which engine, cams, rev range, modified PCV system(?) are you using?

It was very common for me to burn that amount, and sometimes more then that in my Type-R(B18C5) during the similar amount of track time.

Austin

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Austin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Which engine, cams, rev range, modified PCV system(?) are you using?

It was very common for me to burn that amount, and sometimes more then that in my Type-R(B18C5) during the similar amount of track time.

Austin</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hi Austin.

yeah, b18C5 here as well, but bored & sleeved to 2 liters. I have the DPR stage 4 headwork & cams, so I don't really know what my rev limit is, but I was shifting in the low to mid 8000's. I would spend about 70-75% of my time in VTEC (0ver 6k rpm). My PCV system is a catch can mounted behind the passenger headlight. is doesn't really have a baffle or anything, so I suppose much of the oil vapor may be sucked right back into the intake tract. I don't actually know where/how old my PCV valve is (if i even have one). I'll check, and if I don't have one I may splice one in. I just emptied the catch can (after who knows how long, for all I know the previous owner had never emptied it), and it was about half oil & half water.

It doesn't smoke obnoxiosly (or at all, really), so that is encouraging I can smell a little bit of oil burning, but only if I really try. I'll just need to add some oil now and again, I suppose.

here;s a pic of my catch can, bottom left behind the passenger headlight:



Modified by L8APX at 8:13 PM 4/9/2008