First, some background information.

-1st Dyno Session at Rosen Autosport Dynojet248 (Baseline)
Mods: Comptech Icebox, Comptech Filter, Ignition Timing @18 degrees
Addtional Info - 4rd gear run. Fan was blowing. Outside temp was around 65F.
WHP: 166.9
WHQ: 120.3


-2nd Dyno Session at Springfield Motorsport Dynojet248 (3 Runs)
Mods: Comptech Icebox, Comptech Filter, Ignition Timing @18 degrees, TypeOne Catback
Additional Info - 4th gear run. No fan blowing. Outside temp was around 50F. Stock Type R Rims with 195/55/15 Nokian NRW (Winter Tires)
1st Run - With Silencer On
WHP: 167.7
WTQ: 120.2
2nd Run - Without Silencer
WHP: 173.1
WTQ: 123.9
3rd Run - Same setup as 2nd Run
WHP: 173.0
WTQ: 124.6
Cut and Paste For Dyno Sheet: http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...9.jpg.orig.jpg


-3rd Dyno Session at Tempest Racing Dynojet248 (2 Runs)
Mods: Comptech Icebox, Comptech Filter, Ignition Timing @18 degrees, Spoon 4-2-1 Header, 2.5" Carsound Cat, Mugen Twinloop Catback
Addtional Info - 3rd gear run. No fan blowing. Outside temp was around 95F. 15x7 Kosei K1 with 205/50/15 Azenis.
1st Run
WHP: 172.1
WTQ: 121.2
2nd Run - Same as 1st Run + Hondata w/4800 VTEC Engagement Point and Tuned for Skunk Stage1 Cams (Did it for kicks)
WHP: 169.8
WTQ: 121.2
Cut and Paste For Dyno Sheet: http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...a.jpg.orig.jpg


I got a printout of the raw data for the 2nd and 3rd dyno sessions. I plugged the numbers into Excel and made my own dyno chart to make the comparison easier. Obviously, I'm not happy with the numbers considering that I was looking for low and mid range power and I got exactly the opposite.
Cut and Paste For Excel Graph: http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...5.jpg.orig.jpg


I thought I would see better numbers with the Icebox/Spoon/2.5in Cat/Mugen exhaust than what I got with the Intake/TypeOne exhaust. I'm at a lost here and I've asked a couple of people on why my numbers are lower than I expected. Here's a couple of possible causes I received and some that I bring up myself.

-Heatsoak
Someone mentioned that although the dyno compensates for the outside temps, heatsoak has the potential to affect my numbers. It was a very humid 95-98F during my most recent session compared to 50F degrees during my 2nd dyno session.
-Mugen Twinloop as a Restriction
Pretty self-explanatory but EP Gonzales and Phat Bastard both make 200+whp with the same exhaust.
-ECU Reset
With regards to my 2nd dyno session, I was able to daily drive with the TypeOne for two weeks. I'm not sure how the ECU works but I read that you can either manually reset the ECU or drive around for a while so it can "learn" how to correctly deal with your mods. For my current mods, the header/cat was installed on a Saturday and the exhaust was installed the following Thursday. The dyno was done right after the exhaust was installed without manually resetting the ECU.
-3rd Gear vs 4th Gear Run
Self-explanatory also.

My plans are to wait for a day where the conditions are close to that of the conditions during my 2nd dyno session. I will also go back to the same place where my 2nd dyno session took place and run in 4th gear. Yes, I know that dyno numbers aren't really comparable when they're done over a period of time but shiieeet, the numbers are just too whack for me! I wasn't expecting much from the exhaust but I thought the header/cat would give me atleast 175whp 124wtq. If my numbers don't improve, I guess I'm just SOL. This will give me reason to buy a VAFC and cam gears to help me get the numbers I want. My butt dyno tells me that I have more power now than I did when all I had was the intake and exhaust so I'm at a lost.

Enough of my rambling. All opinions, suggestions, and JDM flaming are welcomed. Just try to make it constructive.

 

What about the mileages on your motor on each of those runs? I take it the base run was done a while ago... maybe time for a valve adjustment?

I definitely think Mugen catback doesn't flow as well as your typeOne catback. But, I'm sure it sounds a lot quieter and more stealth.

It seems like you're making around 175whp... so that sounds about right with your mods.

 

chris, go back to the same place where you dynoed with the type one and try to replicate the same conditions...that as close as you are going to get to a direct comparison...different dynos, different conditions yield different numbers...

 

Should have bought a Camaro Z/28

In reality, I agree with BlueR, you should use the same dyno and do your pulls in the same gear. The Mugen exhaust is 2.36 inches while i believe the type-one is 2.5 inches. that will make a differance in peak numbers.

 

shouldn't a 3rd gear run yield higher numbers?

i may have this mixed up...

 

some once did a comparision of 3rd gear vs 4th gear pulls...negligable difference
although ideal is 4th gear pull

 

-Mileage was ~21,000, ~23,000, and ~27,000 for my 3 dyno sessions.
-Yes, it's true that the 2.5" TypeOne does flow better than the 2.38 Mugen but ponder on this. Isn't it an widely believed that a 2.5" header/cat will yeild better numbers than a catback on our ITRs??? So in following, shouldn't my ITR be making the same whp/wtq with the Spoon Header/2.5" cat as my previous setup of stock header/cat and TypeOne catback?


I wasn't worried so much about peak numbers really. I had a sick feeling after I saw how much I lost in the low-mid range.

 

I've been to numerous dynos and they all showed the same hp before tuning. All were on different days and conditions of course. The only Dyno that didn't show the same #'s was a Dynometer. If caliberated, the Dynojets should all very close.

 

Chris, I bet with the Type 1 exhaust and Spoon header combined you will have close to 180 whp. Your midrange will not pick up unless you lower the vtec or get big *** cams with high compression.


[Modified by MPH, 3:42 PM 7/9/2002]

 

Hey 2 quick questions. Did the Type One catback bolt up fine to the stock cat? Im assuming you were running stock header and cat with the type one. And also do you have any sound clips of it on your car? Im interested in purchasing one but dunno if it would be too loud for me. Thanks.

 

Yes, the TypeOne catback is a direct bolt-on to the stock ITR cat. I don't have any sound clips of it on my car but it was too loud for my taste. Keep in mind that what's loud to me might be music to your ears. I wound't put too much credibility on sound clips as they do not portray how things are in reality.

 

OT: Hopefully by the end of the week, i can give you guys some in-car and out of the car sound clips of my Type One exhaust with the JDM 4-1 header w/ a butt dyno review. After 2.5 months, all the parts have arrived!!!

 

Very interesting, very interesting indeed.

I know you already know this but, the conditions AND dyno's were of course different so of course you will get different results. I also suggest going back to the origional Dyno and trying to replicate the origional conditions to see whats what.

Here's my plot from this last February at about 50 degrees, minimum humidity, No Fan, Comptech Icebox, their foam filter, Spoon 4-2-1 header and Carsound cat, on steel wheels, and 205/50/15" snow tires:


It was not the Best PIC and also we did NOT have the best luck reading my RPM, it just jumped around so I won't go boasting. I do however feel the power difference and am pleased with the header/cat results regardless of the less than perfectly accurate numbers.. I will be sure to post some more clearer graphs in the future when we go back and tune more.

So to think that you get only the 2-3 albiet peak WHP, and the 3 PF of torque for whatever you spent on the better performing Type1 and Now the Mugen twinloop. I am still considering a catback but, not for midrange TQ, more for topend gains for when I am racing. I only have 3 choices left and am still not decided and this post has again confirmed my support of the Stock catback.

I realize that your testing has many variables but, hey it doesn't show me any miracle power spike either and is Not a heck of alot more or stronger than mine and I'm missing a catback setup.

Sorry that your results are less than encouraging, And Thank you for helping Me and Us gain knowledge from your experiences.

One question: Would you go back to a stock catback to see if all of the other mods kept you near the numbers you have now?

Good luck CPR, it's always nice to read your postings and results.

A.

 

You can't compare 3rd vs 4th gear pulls.

 

usually ppl use 3rd gear for dyno, and of course u need to have the same gear to compare with. I believe it should be something worng with tunning, i expected more than that with an extra header and nice exhust. BTW, why does everyone lower the VTEC point? My car stays the same.

 

Difference dyno, difference gear, difference temp., difference tires, and difference ecu. I don't think you should compare the results. Why don't you go back to your first dyno place to dyno it again and compare, this way you can get a better comparison!!

 

I thought you are supposed to use the gear with the closest ratio to 1:1, which would be fourth in the Integras. I could be wrong though.

 

well...most of place around my area they dyno with in 3rd gear, and ppl i asked they told me it's 3rd...not idea about the ratio tho.. i could be wrong too...well need some ppl come out and explan all these for us please.


[Modified by YelLowITR, 7:37 AM 7/10/2002]

 

I've done 3rd and 4th gear pulls and the power is the same, but the 3rd gear plot is smoother.

 

Correct.


And not wrong.

A.