Guys,
I have a 1994 BMW 325iS. I used to have a type-R. Now the chance has come for me to sell my car with 48,000 miles, and get a type-R... I went to drive a type-S today to see apporx. how the type-R drives since its been a while, and I was entirely disappointed... On my car, I have M3 suspension, and different cams, exhaust, chip, etc... Im probably pushing 220 at the fly.... But it weighs more, yet I still feel like it pulls harder than the Type-S did today... Is the type-R also going to feel weak like this? AM I going to regret selling the 325iS, since it has TORQUE and it also handles VERY well? I used to think that selling the R was a huge mistake, but driving the S made me think maybe its not... Anyone here care to comment on if an R is going to feel crappy to me in the motor department if I was not at all happy with the motor on the Type-S? Anyone in the Philly suburbs wanna give me a ride in their car so I can feel how a type r pulls again? Please, what do you guys think? Keep my car, or get an R... MY car is FAST, it handles well, it looks great, but the mileage is getting high... What do you think...

 

It's definitely not all about how hard the ITR pulls. For reference, a friend test drove a Type S some time ago and said it was noticeably weaker compared to the ITR's power. Maybe because it was still new. Handling and braking wise, the ITR makes even more of an impression. Compared to a stock type s I would keep your BMW if performance is what you're after. But certainly do take out an ITR for a drive if it's between the 325 and the ITR.

Having said that, the street (driving) simply does not do the ITR any justice...

 

Just keep your bimmer

 

Will I'll say the R but you mod your 325iS so the R might feel weak compare to a stock R. Will how it being since you sold the R? When you got the 325iS after you sold the R what did the 325iS feel to you? But I'll compare stock to stock and I'll have to say the R.
Good luck


[Modified by 2001ITR828, 11:44 PM 6/27/2002]

 

Of course it will drive and handle differently.

First things first, you went to testdrive a car that is pretty much no where near the suspension and driveabiltiy of a ITR. The RSX-S is a fairly decent car with, ahem, similiar power, but the suspension is completely different and IMO you made a mistake doing what you did.

Secondly, a FWD vs RWD car will FEEL and ACT differently, both on and off a road course. Your RWD Bimmer might FEEL like it has more power because its PUSHING you around, while the R may in fact be fairly close. Realize a bone stock ITR is "supposed" to have ~195HP bwhp from the factory, so with the mods you are claiming on your 325 you are only 25HP above a stock ITR.

It will also depend on what exactly you want the R for. Are you a road racer? Is it just going to be something to "build" and then drive 'round town? You obviously have an interest in modding a car; if thats the case just throw some things on the R to make her a little more peppy. (I/H, possibly exhaust..) then some Cams if you wanna stay NA, otherwise FI.

Alot of decisions you need to make yourself, and much more input here is requested for others to provide you a more accurate assessment of the two cars and your goals with each.

 

i ahd a 325 is and traded for my R , never regretted it . . . well unless i tink about the rwd thing . . i say do it

 

I would say keep your bimmer, not saying that ITR is bad. However, the pressure and sometimes the jealousy or hatred from other civic or even DC2 owners that make having a type r is tiring. But, its up to you...
just my 2 cents

 

what cams do you have in you 325?

 

That would be a tough choice to make, as I love both the ITR and the E36 325.

However, using the RSuX as an ITR substitute does the ITR no justice. The RSuX seems to me a combination of what I dislike about both cars (Heavy, higher CG, strut suspension from the Bimmer side, FWD and Japanese styling from the ITR side).

Oh, and to answer your question, well, I can't. Drive an ITR again and make up your own mind. I can tell you which I'd prefer, but what good does that do you?


[Modified by MK Ultra, 6:17 PM 6/27/2002]

 

For me, I feel much more connected to the road in the ITR. Much more important to me than hp.

 

very good point. like others said, straight line pull is not a reason to buy an ITR.

 

Guys,
Thanks for all of the responses so far... Firt of all, the main reason I drove the RSX was because I don't have access to an R to drive... I figured that since i had no R to drive, the type-s is the closest thing, even though I HATE the type-s and I am NOT under the impression that the type-s is that similar to the R..... its just the closest thing i could find. When I think about the two cars, I remember how well the R handled, braked, etc... My BMW is almost there in terms of handling and breakingh, but it is a bigger feeling car and as such you can't really throw it around on the street or on a Road course. So my main concern was really that I'd get an R, and be so USED to having gobs of torque and feeling the 'thrust' that the Type R wouldn't seem powerful enough. I never got a back to back, because I sold my R (had to at the time...), waited 2 months, got a stock 325is, and the modded it... So I cant remember what a stock 325is is like let alone an R. I only modded the 325is to make it a better road racer, and I wouldnt mod the R beyond tires, brakes, springs for the track.... My question is basically, if the handling and braking are basically a toss up, am I going to feel the 'lack of power' in the R as much as I did driving a demo type-s? That car was unbearable, the engine didn't even pull, and I know the type r pulled a bit harder, but is it STILL going to feel like a slow car when i gas it? Thanks for the responses, keep em coming, you guys are gonna mke the descision for me with what you say...
-Jeff
PS: My cams are 3.0 M3 cams, I have M3 exhaust, chip, sport clutch, M suspension and brakes, and M-aero kit... other than the motor mods, the car came with everything M as a limited 1 of 150 car, called the M-Technic... essentially a M3 with a small motor.... Its a special car in its own right...

 

i think the top end of the ITR will make up for the lack of torque it has. I know when i drive my friends BMWs (usually a Pete McHenry built e30 with ~215 or so...) i love the torque, but i'm dissapointed to have to shift at 7000....

just me though. You car sounds nice, it was one of the rides i was looking at (e36 m3, modded 325, ITR...)


ps- i think the ITR is so great because it is such a well balanced car all around. its not ridiculously fantastic at any one thing, but just good at EVERYTHING.


[Modified by Rob, 8:29 PM 6/27/2002]

 

I drove a 328 about 700 miles on my way to pick up my 2000 R. I had never driven a 328 or an R. The torque on the 328 was awesome, I loved punching the gas at any RPM and feeling a surge of power. I was actually starting to get a little worried that I would be disappointed in the R after driving the 328 for a couple days (we stopped over night in KC). After driving the R for the first 5 minutes I knew I wasn't disappointed at all. I will say that the 328 was a freaking nice ride, and it has it's role for sure, and I will admit I had already owned an Integra (LS) before, so I was a Honda person at heart, but damnit, the R was so raw and I've loved it ever since. Oh, and BTW, I whipped my roommates *** in the 328, all the way back home. (and it doesn't help that the bimmer had a 130mph limiter. oops, did I just admit that?)

 

I hate to tell you this, but a stock ITR shouldn't have a problem beating a mildly mod'd E36 325is like yours. Your 325is is not "fast", however, I wouldn't doubt that it's a whole lot of fun. My room-mate is an experienced BMW tech and I worked at a BMW shop for about a year. He has an E30 with less than a year old built from the ground up motor with streetable headwork and some other typical power makers. The car pulls WAY harder than any E36 325is I've ever driven (and I've driven a lot) - In my GSR with intake/underdrive pulleys with some fresh rubber, I would consistently pull him by a couple-few car lengths up to around 100mph.

BTW, I drove his 325is all day yesterday - it "feels" five times faster than my recently deceased GSR. Way funner to drive and I don't have to rev it to 6 grande just to get around town - thank god for torque, thank god for RWD (and driving an old school BMW with '02 blue M3 paint and 17in forged BBS RC's dropped is lady magnet).

We Dinan supercharged a 325is at the shop a couple years ago - it still only made it AS fast, not faster, than an E36 M3.

IMO, for a daily driver - keep what you have, but don't blow anymore money on it just to be disappointed because it won't take its counterpart (M3 of any generation).

Ultimate Driving Machine doesn't necessarily factor in the quarter mile.

 

Yea the 325 has 170hp in a 3000+ pound car,the R has been pissin on 325's 28's and 330's in realtime,thats why BMW keeps upping the displacement cause its keeps getting its *** handed by the R.A GSR would take out a stock 325 stock for stock.

 

I've got the answer for you...

Sell your 325 and get an E30 M3. And, spend some money on EVO parts to wreck havoc on many cars on the track.

I recommend this 'cuz you're already familiar with the Bavarian product... shouldn't be hard for you to upkeep an E30 M3.

 

According to Edmunds a 1994 325is has 189 hp and weighs 3086 pounds.

 

I guess there were more than 1 model,the other models came with 170 then.But still 189 hp in a 3100 pound car VS 195 in a 2600 pound car I'll put my money on the R,and I would also put the money on a GSR stock for stock.

 

And http://www.car-stats.com gave the 94 325is a 15.9,A GSR should rape it drivin right.

 

You all are missing the whole point of a 325, or even the 325is. They're "luxury-sport". They aren't made to race, they're made for real-world daily driving comfort and handling capabilities. Trust me, I'd much rather drive a stock 325is or 328 daily than a GSR or ITR. As far as a street racer car is concerned, well, that's a different story - put simply, I wouldn't drive a Honda or a BMW for street racing.

Go drive a 325is knowing that its a tad bit slower than a GSR and realize what I'm talking about. BMW has matched comfort and sport better than any other company.

 

You also forget, or don't know, that 325is's respond AMAZINGLY well to "chipping", not to mention tuned for more aggressive cams and exhaust.

 

I'm just talking about the the performance apsects stock for stock,If were talking comfort lets talk 740IL's.As for driving comfort,my GSR is perfect for myself,I'm 5 foot 8 and that little ride is simply a toy to drive around for me.Its awsome in tight sqeezes,I've fit the nose of my car in the tightest cracks in traffic,why I think the the GSR offers great driving comfort,as for seat and cockpit comfort there are alot of cars that offer more head and leg room and have nicer and bigger seats.

 

Stock for stock, the GSR would lose against an E30 325is. Stock for stock a GSR should beat an E36 325is. Stock for stock a GSR would gets *** handed to it by a newer 330i and an ITR would be dead even. Either way, for the most part its driver vs. driver even if they are both modified (as long as its around mod for mod). Two tenths of a second can be made up easily by good driving - half a second to a full second...different story - little bit harder to do.

Like I was talking about a little bit before, I drove my GSR daily for a straight year. I could beat my room-mates 325is by a 1.5 car lengths in the quarter. After driving his car for one day, I'd take that anyday over a GSR (remember - for daily driving and occasional street encounters).

Anything above 12 seconds in the quarter mile is slow for me anyway, so my opinions are a little sketchy sometimes in this area If you want to go fast, get a bike - any thoughts of "fast" cars will be fleeting, trust me

 

huh? dead even with a 3400lb/220hp touring coupe? riiiiiiiiiiight