I am thinking of making a new pedal so that it will sit closer or even to the gas pedal, hence, making it easier to Heel Toe.


I have done tool/equipment design and development as well as reverse engineering in the past so I am familiar with the details that need to be looked at in order to make something right.
I have been practicing but I thought it would make the whole thing easier to modify the pedal.
Or suck it up and and practice and get used to it, which I can do, but I am always thinking of more efficient ways to do things. Just my nature all in all it can be just something to do and learn, I am not worried wether it is possible or not.


I am more curious and looking for comments on difficulty of removing the pedal and clearances I may have to worry about. I am planning to go to the Junk Yard and take the pedal assembly off a car there to use as reference. But as always everyone has a right to their opinions.

Are there any laws to modifying something like this?
besides voiding the warranty


Mods: can you please fix the title, thanks



[Modified by 98401R, 5:58 PM 6/27/2002]

 

warranty on what exactly? the brake pedal?

you may modify that which ever way you choose...

its not too difficult removing the pedal, just take your time..

you wont need another set of pedals to practice on, provided you have the proper tools.

i'm not sure what you plan on doing, but perhaps you can just get away with removing the rubber padding...

cutting the pedal off may not be the best idea...


[Modified by 00-0187, 1:00 PM 6/27/2002]

 

the other set of pedals is to take mesurement and have as reference so I can still drive the R until I can finish.

A lot of dealer may take it as a safety issue and void the whole warranty.

 

In japan, the ITR comes with a different pedal assembly that puts the brake
pedal closer to the gas pedal. I dont know if this applies to the US ITR though
I swear I can tell a difference when im sitting in another integra

 

Really, any way to get a hold of an assembly that you know off
or
does anyone have any pics/info on it?


[Modified by 98401R, 6:13 PM 6/27/2002]

 

how about bending the pedals?

 

Honestly, I would modify the gas peddle before messing with the brake peddle. Seeing as how you put ALOT more pressure on the brakes than you do the gas, I wouldn't take a chance of doing anything to weaken your brakes...

 

I have some Momo pedal that fit on top of the existing stock pedals. They make it a lot easier to heel and toe by bringing both brake and gas pedals closer together.

Why would you want to make your own design when there is countless ones already on the market ? It would seem to be like reinventing to wheel.



[Modified by JPP, 1:17 PM 6/27/2002]

 

00-00187 - bending the brake pedal may be difficult it is a flat thick piece of metal that would be difficult to bend back, unless i am missing something.

that is why I plan to construct a new pedal so it will be as strong as the original, instead of bending or cutting anything. If I were to bring the gas pedal up it will bring my knee up and will hit the steering wheel at least the bottom cover which I am already very close too. If you say just put seat back farther away that will also put me farther away from the clutch. Even when I try to heel toe now my knee hits the cover and the steering wheel is as high as it will go.

 

I am not planning to modify the pedal cover, I want to modify the whole pedal assembly, the arm so to speak of the brake pedal.


[Modified by 98401R, 6:21 PM 6/27/2002]

 

You can get the brak pedal signifigantly closer the the accelerator by installing a good aftermarket set of pedal-covers intended for this purpose. I have a sst of OMP and love them. When you install them you can position the accelerator so it is very close to the brake if you want...

 

I've seen those, but the whole thing is not to get them closer together but more even in height.

I know there are may different pedals that makes it easier by bringing the pedals together, I've read every post I found doing a search, I jsut keep thinking it would be better for the pedals to be at the same height, or at least close than what they are now. an inch would make a big difference.

 

you dont want them at the same height. You want the brake pedal higher then the gas pedal.

The only time you need to heel toe for the most part is when you are HARD on the brakes. So press hard on the brakes.....now the pedals should be even.

 

Actually if you press on the brake pedal hard enought to simulate hard braking just before you take a turn, you will see that both pedals are pretty much at the same height. The gas pedal is a little higher but if you try to lower it, then their is a chance that it will hit the floor of the car before you are at full throtle.

 

yeah I thought about that you are right.

There has been a few occassions it would have been nice to used Heel-toe in Solo2, I am not sure how much you would use on a real track, never been on one. not yet at least

But even to get the brake pedal alittel lower would make a big difference and help out a lot, unless there are rules that I do not know about where it is illegal on the track.

 

JPP- I thought about that and noticed that the pedal only gets halfway down at the most before the ABS kicks in. I have slotted rotors and SS brake lines which have made th brakese more sensitive. I have never felt or seen the pedal hit the floor will look into it more closely just to be on the safe side.

 

Tonyxcom- I just checked and you are right the pedals are at the same height when fully presses, but that would mean that ABS is on. Maybe softer brakes(minus the rotors and SS brake lines would be better for heel toe, becuase it would not be as sensitive.

But if I go for the gas pedal when fully pressed my knee hits the steering column cover.

I would think the gas pedal being higher than the gas pedal at this point would make it easier to pres the gas pedal with the heel, what do you guys think?

I still have about 4 inches before the pedal hits the floor when fully pressed...

 

Your problems have nothing to do with the pedals. It has to do with seating position. Most novice drivers do not position themselves properly when driving.

The Type R comes with seats that are perfect for people up to about 5'8". If you are taller than that - or have long legs - you are forced to sit with the seat too far back or your knees hit the underside area of the steering wheel assembly/dash. I cannot sit in a stock Type R with a helmet on in a proper driving position because the base of the seat is too high. I remedied this situation by installing another seat that lowers my seating position by about 4 inches.

I think your pedal modification efforts will be in vain - but go ahead and try it.

 

I am 5'7 and have no problems with the helmet, I sit upright when racing ( that way the seat hugs better) and I still hit the steering column cover. I sit far back enough just so the clutch can be fully pressed any more and I will be worried about it. I may just have unusually longer legs, but I think I am pretty average.
I'm sure practice will make it whole lot easier, but just trying to asses if any modifications can make it better.

I am sure that most expert Heel- toe drivers would just say suck it up and practice, but I am always thinking for efficiency. It is an interesting project for me and I'm sure some other people as well.
All this started when I friend of mine mentioned that Audi are easier to heel toe beacuse the pedal are at almost the same height, which then I checked in my GFs car and they are and it is easier to reach the gas pedal when braking so I thought it migh be interesting to see it would be just as good for the ITR. Every little bit helps.

thanks for everyones input.

 

Or again you can use a set of aftermarket pedal covers and modify the way you heel and toe. With these pedals, I brake with the center/left part of my foot and I blip the gas pedal with the right top part of my foot. It requires a lot less motion of the leg and work very well. This way is a lot more "natural" in my opinion

 

If you race your car on a track, heel-toe is very important. You will find you use it there more then autox. Hell, with my cx the way it is now, once I am in 2nd, im there for the entire race.

Anyway, in order to truely see where you brake pedal will be in relation to the gas pedal under braking.... you have to go out and drive the car. Once the car is running the power brakes are preasurized different then when the car is parked. So try the street before you make any judgments on what may need to be raised or lowered.

Driving position makes a difference in the type heel-toe you can do. The one where you actually have your toes or ball of foot on the brake and you pivot your heel onto the gas....

or putting the left edge of your foot on the brake and rolling your foot to the right to hit the gas.

I cannot use my heel for the gas because my knees are to close to the steering column (6ft tall, and bad posture )

 

I know...might not be what your "looking" for but this is what I did for heel toe...

(bad pic sorry, but there is about a 2"-2.5" gap between the brake and gas pedals, and the gas petal was raised just slightly).

 

Is your steering wheel in the "all the way up" position??

 

I believe that it was for the picture only...I really took the pic because I just finished the stereo install. I usually have the steering wheel close to the "all the way down" position

 

I was thinking about that , just put a pedal on the gas pedal. Maybe I'll put one on like the kid in Indiana Jones block of wood.
is it better with a cover on the brake as well so they are closer together?