Power wise what is the difference between a 4-2-1 header and a 4-1 header? like is the peak torque and horsepower going to be lower on one or stay the same? I know there cant be much of difference but I'm curious. thanks in advance

 

Uhmm...simple, turbocharge it and you wouldn't have to worry about a header.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NVturbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Uhmm...simple, turbocharge it and you wouldn't have to worry about a header. </TD></TR></TABLE>

even turbos you can play with the headers!
and how dose your above comment help with the question?


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 994door &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Power wise what is the difference between a 4-2-1 header and a 4-1 header? like is the peak torque and horsepower going to be lower on one or stay the same? I know there cant be much of difference but I'm curious. thanks in advance</TD></TR></TABLE>

Anyway! Depends on whom you talk to when it comes to headers RMF for example believes in only 4-1 headers and claims they make the most power from what he has told me unless he has changed his mind?

Then you have companies like sms, hy-tech who like the 4-2-1 headers and say their designs you get best of both worlds

SMS is a member on this forum and knows his stuff you may also want to PM him and get his take on this or perhaps he may grace this page with this experience?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Richard... &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Anyway! Depends on whom you talk to when it comes to headers RMF for example believes in only 4-1 headers and claims they make the most power from what he has told me unless he has changed his mind?

Then you have companies like sms, hy-tech who like the 4-2-1 headers and say their designs you get best of both worlds

SMS is a member on this forum and knows his stuff you may also want to PM him and get his take on this or perhaps he may grace this page with this experience?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

thanks... I'm getting into auto-x next spring so I want to make more power in the mid range is there a certain design I should look for to give me this goal... such as longer runners, etc.???

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 994door &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

thanks... I'm getting into auto-x next spring so I want to make more power in the mid range is there a certain design I should look for to give me this goal... such as longer runners, etc.???</TD></TR></TABLE>

Once again depending on who you talk with you could just get your self the productions knock off 4-2-1 header that is been sold on this forum reasonably priced so you can use that as a foundation and see were you need to go from there!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Richard... &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

even turbos you can play with the headers!
and how dose your above comment help with the question?</TD></TR></TABLE>Okay, I guess. I'm sure there are plenty of people out there that are using their old "DC headers" as turbo manifolds.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NVturbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Okay, I guess. I'm sure there are plenty of people out there that are using their old "DC headers" as turbo manifolds. </TD></TR></TABLE>


YEA thats real funny

HOWEVER!

DC dose actually make turbo manifolds for some applications other then honda!

bottom line if it were me i would as i have already said contact someone like SMS for a recommendation for your setup

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NVturbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Uhmm...simple, turbocharge it and you wouldn't have to worry about a header. </TD></TR></TABLE>

lol why are turbo guys always doing that ****. I think I'm gonna go into threads where someone asks "what turbo should I use" and say "f#$k that. Buy a header instead".

EEEVERYTIME someone asks how to make good NA power because they dont wanna spend a lot of money nor do they want to go turbo for whatever other reasons. There's always atleast 1 guy going "just turbo it".

Forced induction isnt for everyone. Just like NA isnt for everyone. The guy asked a question about a header. If you're that jaded about NA, then just ignore the post.

Anyway. OP: I always go 4-1 since you're not really going to notice a HUGE drop in midrange as compared to a 4-2-1. Hondas make top end power for the most part. So just play on the motor's strengths instead of trying to make it do something it was never designed to do. Look at the pathetic torque curve on any given NA honda 4 cyl. motor. It's hopeless lol. I wouldn't give up top end.

Instead, you could get a nicer geared transmission or a final drive gear. That will magnify torque very very effectively.

Or you could just get a bigger motor. H22s make tons of torque (relatively), and they make it through a good chunk of the power band. Slap on a B16A trans...and you can pull your house down the street.

What motor are you running?

 

just another thought going along with the mid range you want what air intake are you using?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B serious &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Or you could just get a bigger motor. H22s make tons of torque (relatively), and they make it through a good chunk of the power band. Slap on a B16A trans...and you can pull your house down the street.

What motor are you running? </TD></TR></TABLE>

right now a jdm b18c with lsd. i want to get a b16 tranny with a ls 5th but that won happen for a while.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 994door &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

right now a jdm b18c with lsd. i want to get a b16 tranny with a ls 5th but that won happen for a while.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why the LS 5th gear? The B16A trans doesn't really hurt gas mileage more than MAYBE 1mpg. MAYBE. probably not even that.

Here's a reference:

LS gas mileage: 25/31
GSR gas mileage: 25/31

I know that the 5th GSR gear is slightly higher than the B16A 5th gear, but you see where I'm going with it. Just buy an ITR trans so you can keep your LSD. That way you save the money of having ot buy an LSD, and swap it into a B16A trans. Plus with the ITR trans, you keep the GSR 5th gearing. The later 00spec ITR trans has a lower final drive, though. Either way, those transmissions are the boss.

The best torque mod you can do (while keeping the same motor and straying NA) is lower gearing.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B serious &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Why the LS 5th gear? The B16A trans doesn't really hurt gas mileage more than MAYBE 1mpg. MAYBE. probably not even that.

Here's a reference:

LS gas mileage: 25/31
GSR gas mileage: 25/31

I know that the 5th GSR gear is slightly higher than the B16A 5th gear, but you see where I'm going with it. Just buy an ITR trans so you can keep your LSD. That way you save the money of having ot buy an LSD, and swap it into a B16A trans. Plus with the ITR trans, you keep the GSR 5th gearing. The later 00spec ITR trans has a lower final drive, though. Either way, those transmissions are the boss.

The best torque mod you can do (while keeping the same motor and straying NA) is lower gearing. </TD></TR></TABLE>

i think the idea of the LS 5th is rpms?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Richard... &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i think the idea of the LS 5th is rpms?</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah but the reason most people wanna drop their RPMs is to try to save gas mileage. Otherwise, what's the reason? Top speed? Most JDM ECUs limit you to 120mph anyway. Besides that, even with a really high gear, the car will run out of power well before you can reach the top speed of the gear. Unless ofcourse...the car is turbo.

Turbo guys do higher gears in general so they can drag out their power bands for longer since turbo power bands are a lot fatter than NA power bands.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 994door &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Power wise what is the difference between a 4-2-1 header and a 4-1 header? like is the peak torque and horsepower going to be lower on one or stay the same? I know there cant be much of difference but I'm curious. thanks in advance</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you are going to auto-x your car, don't buy any "upgrades". The car will not be the limiting factor when you take it out. Learn the car first then decides what mods you are going to need to net you faster times.

In Auto-x, power isn't king. Driving the car is more important.

m-

 

hasnt this been covered already

 

There really isnt a difference in power i've had both on my b18b1 in my 94 civic coupe and i couldnt really tell a difference

 

in the future i'm putting a b16 head on, just for kicks... but for now I'm getting used to the suspension. I'm thinking of a ws2 for exhaust, I've seen good results from that. but still i wont see any real gains from any bolt on. here's a pic of my car...