Boosted H power bands. 9k+ rpms?
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Master H Technician
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From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Boosted H power bands. 9k+ rpms?
I posted this in the forced induction forums as well, but was was told (and figured) I would get alot more views and replys here...
Ive been looking for the past few days trying to find different dyno graphs of H series and the power bands. Basically, Im interested in high how people are revving to make power and when it levels out.
Most of the H series guys from what I can tell aren't going too much above stock redline and thats a trend that hasnt changed in the last few years of advancement in the H series power game. Anyone else making power up in the regions I am?
Heres a dyno run recently at 14PSI. You can clearly see I am making power all the way up and even my torque is climbing slowly beyond 8000rpms..
Ive been looking for the past few days trying to find different dyno graphs of H series and the power bands. Basically, Im interested in high how people are revving to make power and when it levels out.
Most of the H series guys from what I can tell aren't going too much above stock redline and thats a trend that hasnt changed in the last few years of advancement in the H series power game. Anyone else making power up in the regions I am?
Heres a dyno run recently at 14PSI. You can clearly see I am making power all the way up and even my torque is climbing slowly beyond 8000rpms..
Re: Boosted H power bands. 9k+ rpms? (JTCdudeman)
Awesome stuff. Maybe because a lot of people just build there bottom ends? I dunno, I have seen people with built heads only making power to 8k. 9k rpms must be awesome. Whats your setup?
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From: Single camshafting for now in, N.Y.
Re: (Ludster)
I'm wondering what wrong with a h22 that peaks 490whp earlier at like 6000 rpms.
less wear and tear to extract the power.
what is your particular setup?
parts and clearances?
less wear and tear to extract the power.
what is your particular setup?
parts and clearances?
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Master H Technician
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From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Re: (alterdcreations)
Alteredcreations. Theres nothing wrong with making power in a shorter rpm band as you described. The thing is with the longer band you have more time between shifts if you like and its less sudden of a jump in power.
Heres a link to my setup. Its far easier to do it this way.. http://preludepower.com/forums...77187
Turbo: Turbonetics T 60-1
Because someone asked for a video, heres several.. Just look in the top right hand corner for more from that day... Also, be sure to look for fastludeh22...
http://good-times.webshots.com...VPVCo
Modified by JTCdudeman at 10:08 AM 10/19/2007
Heres a link to my setup. Its far easier to do it this way.. http://preludepower.com/forums...77187
Turbo: Turbonetics T 60-1
Because someone asked for a video, heres several.. Just look in the top right hand corner for more from that day... Also, be sure to look for fastludeh22...
http://good-times.webshots.com...VPVCo
Modified by JTCdudeman at 10:08 AM 10/19/2007
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From: Cantonment, FL
Re: (alterdcreations)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alterdcreations »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">are you using the methonal with pump gas?</TD></TR></TABLE>
yes, he is.
yes, he is.
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From: Cantonment, FL
Re: (alterdcreations)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alterdcreations »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">he needed it at only 14psi?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Simply wanted to run more ignition timing than pump gas will safely allow you to run.
Simply wanted to run more ignition timing than pump gas will safely allow you to run.
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Master H Technician
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From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Re: (98vtec)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 98vtec »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">how far do you rev the motor when you are at the track and where are you landing between the gears?
your still on the stock h22 final drive right?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Im taking it to about 8800 at the track. Depending upon the gear it puts me close to 6.2k or above. Ive shifted lower and higher, but I seem to do the best shifting right around there...
And yes. stock final drive.
Mgags7:
Now, whats so bad about the efficiency of the turbo? Some more details would be wonderful.
your still on the stock h22 final drive right?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Im taking it to about 8800 at the track. Depending upon the gear it puts me close to 6.2k or above. Ive shifted lower and higher, but I seem to do the best shifting right around there...
And yes. stock final drive.
Mgags7:
Now, whats so bad about the efficiency of the turbo? Some more details would be wonderful.
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Re: (JTCdudeman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JTCdudeman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Mgags7:
Now, whats so bad about the efficiency of the turbo? Some more details would be wonderful. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Well, just at the surface, taking a look at the torque curve, you can see that thing thing is really not reaching its full potential.
The torque should peak low and flatten out the whole way thru the powerband, kinda like this:
That is Greg H's setup, on the exact same housing and pressure (14psi). I'm not sure of the a/r on either of your setups, but obviously there are compressor wheel differences, as his curve is much different than yours and you have very similar setups.
It may be a manifold difference, he has that sexy *** lovefab sst manifold on there.
I think you'd be able to make near 700whp if you could keep revving, which is why I say that turbo is out of its range. You could possibly resize the compressor wheel and move the powerband some, and get a lot better midrange torque. I'm sure yours spins a lot less wheel though as the onset of torque is much more gradual.
Now, whats so bad about the efficiency of the turbo? Some more details would be wonderful.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Well, just at the surface, taking a look at the torque curve, you can see that thing thing is really not reaching its full potential.
The torque should peak low and flatten out the whole way thru the powerband, kinda like this:
That is Greg H's setup, on the exact same housing and pressure (14psi). I'm not sure of the a/r on either of your setups, but obviously there are compressor wheel differences, as his curve is much different than yours and you have very similar setups.
It may be a manifold difference, he has that sexy *** lovefab sst manifold on there.
I think you'd be able to make near 700whp if you could keep revving, which is why I say that turbo is out of its range. You could possibly resize the compressor wheel and move the powerband some, and get a lot better midrange torque. I'm sure yours spins a lot less wheel though as the onset of torque is much more gradual.
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Master H Technician
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From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Re: (mgags7)
Thanks Matt...
I appreciate the reply. I should have posted Greg's setup as its very similar and I have done some comparisons in the past. We are running a similar turbo, different wheels as you suggested. When mine was purchased, it was intended to have a wider range. I would almost say its oversized, but it helps at different boost levels.
Now, my torque curve would be awesome flat, but the timing is very conservative on pump gas and changes to very aggresive just above 10psi with the methanol giving me the torque climb noticed in the graph. Its less noticable at higher boost. It usually maxxes out by about 6.5k above 20psi.
Wheel spin may be less, but thats all relative... Hence the 14psi graphs trying to figure out gear by boost and wheel spin on slicks even...
I just chose to post that one..
I appreciate the reply. I should have posted Greg's setup as its very similar and I have done some comparisons in the past. We are running a similar turbo, different wheels as you suggested. When mine was purchased, it was intended to have a wider range. I would almost say its oversized, but it helps at different boost levels.
Now, my torque curve would be awesome flat, but the timing is very conservative on pump gas and changes to very aggresive just above 10psi with the methanol giving me the torque climb noticed in the graph. Its less noticable at higher boost. It usually maxxes out by about 6.5k above 20psi.
Wheel spin may be less, but thats all relative... Hence the 14psi graphs trying to figure out gear by boost and wheel spin on slicks even...
I just chose to post that one..
Re: (alterdcreations)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alterdcreations »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">how were your results when using race gas and methanol injection?
max hp and psi?</TD></TR></TABLE>
no race gas for him. being the meth head that he is , no need for it. dousch bag aka jtc has a progressive controller. starts out spraying meth at 10 psi and i think peaks at 28 psi. from what i remember the meth setup he has peaks at like 700 whp? he has gotten higher in the past, but this recent dyno adventure he was having fuel psi problems at high boost. cant remember the boost, low 20's i think, but the whp was around 550...93 octane only...
btw-i hate u tommy, race gas is now like 8/gal
max hp and psi?</TD></TR></TABLE>
no race gas for him. being the meth head that he is
, no need for it. dousch bag aka jtc has a progressive controller. starts out spraying meth at 10 psi and i think peaks at 28 psi. from what i remember the meth setup he has peaks at like 700 whp? he has gotten higher in the past, but this recent dyno adventure he was having fuel psi problems at high boost. cant remember the boost, low 20's i think, but the whp was around 550...93 octane only...btw-i hate u tommy, race gas is now like 8/gal
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Re: (JTCdudeman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JTCdudeman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks Matt...
I appreciate the reply. I should have posted Greg's setup as its very similar and I have done some comparisons in the past. We are running a similar turbo, different wheels as you suggested. When mine was purchased, it was intended to have a wider range. I would almost say its oversized, but it helps at different boost levels.
Now, my torque curve would be awesome flat, but the timing is very conservative on pump gas and changes to very aggresive just above 10psi with the methanol giving me the torque climb noticed in the graph. Its less noticable at higher boost. It usually maxxes out by about 6.5k above 20psi.
Wheel spin may be less, but thats all relative... Hence the 14psi graphs trying to figure out gear by boost and wheel spin on slicks even... I just chose to post that one.. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I see, so you run two different setups, one for pump gas, one for race gas.
That's a great way of going about it, being conservative on pumpgas with timing is always a good idea.
What switches the methanol on? Rpm, boost, a setting in the tune?
I appreciate the reply. I should have posted Greg's setup as its very similar and I have done some comparisons in the past. We are running a similar turbo, different wheels as you suggested. When mine was purchased, it was intended to have a wider range. I would almost say its oversized, but it helps at different boost levels.
Now, my torque curve would be awesome flat, but the timing is very conservative on pump gas and changes to very aggresive just above 10psi with the methanol giving me the torque climb noticed in the graph. Its less noticable at higher boost. It usually maxxes out by about 6.5k above 20psi.
Wheel spin may be less, but thats all relative... Hence the 14psi graphs trying to figure out gear by boost and wheel spin on slicks even...
I just chose to post that one.. </TD></TR></TABLE>I see, so you run two different setups, one for pump gas, one for race gas.
That's a great way of going about it, being conservative on pumpgas with timing is always a good idea.
What switches the methanol on? Rpm, boost, a setting in the tune?
Re: (mgags7)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mgags7 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I see, so you run two different setups, one for pump gas, one for race gas.
That's a great way of going about it, being conservative on pumpgas with timing is always a good idea.
What switches the methanol on? Rpm, boost, a setting in the tune?</TD></TR></TABLE>
the only "conservative" timing he runs is below 10 psi.
the meth turns on at 10 psi, and sprays more per boost. more boost=more meth=more timing
edit: no race gas setup, see 2 posts up
I see, so you run two different setups, one for pump gas, one for race gas.
That's a great way of going about it, being conservative on pumpgas with timing is always a good idea.
What switches the methanol on? Rpm, boost, a setting in the tune?</TD></TR></TABLE>
the only "conservative" timing he runs is below 10 psi.
the meth turns on at 10 psi, and sprays more per boost. more boost=more meth=more timing
edit: no race gas setup, see 2 posts up