95 prelude h23vtec

head
crower valves
crower retainers
crower springs
crower stage 2s(mistake)
aem cam gears
mild port n polish

block from alterdcreations
i have another block getting sleeved but for now im going with a
complete stock bottom end with type s pistons 12.6

m2b4 h22 lsd final drive tranny from mgags

cat back apex exhaust

i have a question though. should i upgrade to like some 450cc's dsm injectors with a bigger throttle body and port match the intake manifold with a good tune. instead of getting a rmf header i was just going to put the 2.5in collectors on it. also should i pipe my cat but i hear they thrive of back pressure so i dont know. so is there anything else i can do or that you guys would suggest me doing. also how much power do you think i could make with a good tune. thanks

 

i'd run a "better" injector. I'd suggest RDX. cheap and efficient. Dunno what it will take for them to work in a H22 manifold tho.

what are you doing for tuning?

what header would you be using? RMF isnt the only custom header.....www.sixsigmaracing.com has had very good luck with the h22 motor so i would suggest using them.

 

i was going to tune with crome at turbo tune were im from. ill check into the header and injectors but how much power you think i could make. will 450s be big enough for what i have for now

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by preludefien &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i was going to tune with crome at turbo tune were im from. ill check into the header and injectors but how much power you think i could make. will 450s be big enough for what i have for now</TD></TR></TABLE>

dont worry about the power. Build it and tune it. I would opt for a better tuning rom....thats a serious amount of compression for the street. One small blip of detonation and your bottom end could be toast.

450 is plenty.

 

what do you mean small blip of detonation

 

detonation...misfire.

Detonation is the result of too much compression, too high ignition timing....etc

the result of detonation is an instantaneous increase in cylinder pressure which will already be high due to the amount of compression you are going to be running. Peaky/high cylinder pressures put amazing amounts of stress on the rods and rod bearings which is VERY bad. Any amount of detonation with that kind of compression, audible or not, can be result in catastrophic engine failure.

Now you could very well be fine with crome. I would just trust a program in which everything has been tested and true. Crome has MANY plug-ins that are not tested and are just thrown onto the internet for DIY tuners to use. The question with crome is, is it really doing what you tell it to do?

big question.

Here is a comparison between Neptune and Crome by Blundar (created most of the scripts for the plug ins in crome)

At the time of writing (1/20/07):

Neptune Strengths:
-No fussing with which plugins work
-No fussing with getting hardware working (well, in comparison)
-Accurate values in program and datalogging, predictable program behavior
-IGNITION CORRECTION CONTROL
-Proper output control, boost controller control
-Sane temperature compensations (IAT,ECT)
-Sane gear corrections
-FLEXIBILITY and configurability
-Working Idle controls
-Faster datalogging
-Graph datalog analysis tools that are pretty damn good
-RTP: record logs
-RTP: bluetooth

Crome Strengths:
-Cost, licensing
-INJECTOR BATTERY TABLES
-Cleaner, more intuitive UI (IMHO)
-Improved statistical process routines for displaying datalogged data in tabular format, i.e. error filtering while street tuning

Neptune Weaknesses:
-Lack of injector battery table support
-Datalogging error filtering could be improved
-Steeper learning curve with UI

Crome Weaknesses:
-LOTS OF UNTESTED CODE
-LOTS OF UNDOCUMENTED FEATURES
-LOTS OF UNDOCUMENTED / UNFIXED BUGS
-LOTS OF THINGS THAT DO NOT WORK LIKE THEY SEEM/SHOULD
-LOTS OF THINGS RELEASED WITHOUT COMPLETE TESTING
-Dealing with scripts for functionality beyond minimal base
-Dealing with more hardware compatibility/interface issues
-Lack of ignition adjustments control
-Lack of proper output control
-Lack of documentation / help / support
-Expectation for you to know a lot more in order to be able to make full use of its capabilities.
-Although easier to use initially, MUCH more difficult to get excellent results and precise control than Neptune.
_________________

 

good break down. so what when i drop it in i want to make sure to retard the timing on the dizzy until i get it tuned

 

do not start this motor without a tuner on hand. Do not drive this motor untuned. Do not baby this motor during break-in.

http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

 

damn thats going to suck. the block that i got had a spun bearing but since he built it he only put 10k on the block. so should i go ahead and change the rings. i was going to rebuild it myself but i dont think that would be a good idea. ive built plenty of h22s but all stock rebuilds and it seems like a picky thing so ill prolly just take it to a machine shop and have them tear it down and rebuild it. i have a vafc just nobody to tune on spot.

 

vafc is not good enough.

I'm not saying you need to rebuild it. If alteredcreations initially built the motor, then i can bet that it was broken in properly. If thats the case, dont worry about breaking it in. The block is still assembled correct?

 

yea but it has a spun bearing. its completely built but he said it had a spun bearing. couldnt beat the deal though 250 and it had an aftermarket oil pump with manual tensioner. so i dont need to worry about the rings unless i get it honed out right

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by preludefien &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yea but it has a spun bearing. its completely built but he said it had a spun bearing. couldnt beat the deal though 250 and it had an aftermarket oil pump with manual tensioner. so i dont need to worry about the rings unless i get it honed out right</TD></TR></TABLE>

right

did the spun bearing ruin the rod?

 

**** if i know. i want get it until tomorrow and take 20min to tear it down. hopefully it can be honed out and be reused. but i will have to mic it to be sure right. i hope it can because i have the slightest clue as to were i can get one f22 rod

 

I'd put up a wtb in the thread up top, I'm sure there is somebody who has just one rod they can part with

user "kmaxwell" has a bunch of h series crap laying around, try sending him a pm.

Blake is right though chris, you are gonna just want to tow it to turbo tune and have mark start it up right on the dyno and smooth everything out from there.

It is going to have to be a pretty extensive tune to get this thing to drive good on the street, so some street tuning is probably going to be necessary, considering turbo tune only has a dynojet, and you can't tune partial throttle very well on there.

 

I've been running chrome for over 2 years, and never had a problem. Perfect ever since, 15psi daily.

 

damn this **** is going to be a bitch i see. so i guess ima fork out more money but i dont care as long as this **** is reliable. do you guys think i will have any problems with this set up with a good tune as a daily driver. there is another tuner in greensboro but they are new so i dunno

 

not as long as its tuned properly. Given that the guy has tuned a high compression motor on pump gas, he would know to knock the ignition down because that is what will make it run rough and eventually die.

i've run into the problem of running too much ignition at part throttle and it creates a lean spike at throttle tip-in. High enough in the rpm with enough load on the motor and those kind of events could kill a 12+ compression motor. Just remember that detonation is easiest to occur at high loads and low RPM. Whats even worse about detonation is that sometimes it isn't even audible to the ears. I'm not trying to scare you or anything, but these are things you need to know to be cautious about so you dont become a victim and blame the person who built the block

street tuning is going to be a must if you want to daily drive it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jaywoodz &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've been running chrome for over 2 years, and never had a problem. Perfect ever since, 15psi daily. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Your SIG says Uberdata......
CROME not CHROME......
Cui ROM Editor

 

you know of any good tuners in the Raleigh Greensboro areas in nc. mgags7 tuned with jdogg in charollette but thats to far to take my car

 

also i know you cant tune with a p13 so what do you guys suggest i get...like a p27 p28 or something

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by preludefien &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">also i know you cant tune with a p13 so what do you guys suggest i get...like a p27 p28 or something</TD></TR></TABLE>

Whatever can support Hondata or Neptune!
I think its just about every OBD1 ECU other than the P13/P14!
Hondata/Neptune FTW!

 

anyone know any tuners in the raleigh greensboro area

 

good luck with the short block rebuild.
i hope everything turns out good with everything. cylinder walls are fine i wouldn't even pull the pistons unless you need to. i hope your crank turns out fine...maybe try some acl bearings

 

chris the only tuners around are turbo tune, rlz (in charlotte), p1 auto (charlotte), and phantasm (thats where jdogg tuned my car)

You need a street tune though, which will require a wideband o2 sensor.

 

Good stuff so far man ... weren't you building a boost setup not too long ago? or am I mistaken