OK, so it'll be a while before I start modding the car. But I'm trying to figure out exactly what I'm doing before I start.

So here's the dillio. I want to run around mid 13s, but the car will mainly be used for driving to work and autocross. Therefore I don't want a peaky power curve. And I don't want turbo lag. In fact I really just don't want to mess with a turbo. It's also my daily driver, so streetability is a huge factor.

Maximum budget for engine is around 5-7 thousand dollars, but cheaper is very very good - college is expensive. And insurance is expensive. And well, life is expensive .

So what's the best thing to do here, besides turbo? JRSC is looking very promising at this point. Do you think some form of N/A would be better though?

Is anyone running mid to high 13s or lower, is streetable, and thinks they've got a decently flat power curve? If so, you're awesome, and I'd really like to hear what you have and how much it costed, and anything else you want to tell me.

Thanks for any help

 

A JRSC at stock 6 psi will get you in the mid 13's
but I suggest you go NA

 

Thanks for the response.

Why exactly does everyone suggest NA over JRSC??

 

the b18c5 platform was meant to be naturally aspirated because of its high compression ratio. but tuning is key!!!

 

pretty much u can run 13's with a stock block.

 

just get a t3/t04 with like a .48 or a .58 a/r... something a little smaller. We're talking about full boost at 3 or 4k rpms... thats nothing man. If you really want to, you could go ball bearing.

If i were you, I'd go turbo, despite everyone's hate of it in the ITR forum.

 

THis is a simple matter actually.

Your budget easily allows 13's.

Are you into pulling your block apart?

Or do you want less than 1 day downtime?

Forget about the supercharger. Its not a racing option. Well, unless you want your motor to not last a long time. Too much heat. heat is a motor's worst enemy.

Supercharger runs hotter than anything, so its something to stay away from.

People will argue this all day. And your high compression adds to the heat.

I look at it from a pure effeciency/longevity VS HP standpoint.

All motor would be the best from all standpoints.

Start with valvetrain from toda for example....
Then perhaps start with some Skunk 2 cams...or perhaps Toba B's.
Then lets move to the header.
JG edelbrock with our modification is nice, or with your budget, order the SMSP from stadules.
Move to the exhaust. Sell yours. Get carsound 2.5 inch high flow, with 2.5 inch crushbent special, and an ultraflow straight through muffler.
Move to the ECU. I don't knwo where you live...but find this:

OBD1 with Hondata Stage 2. tune for a A/F of 13:1. That will run great for auto-xing. not too hot...

That will be high 13's on slicks right there..

Move to the block. Put CTR pistons in it. That will be good for 10 WHP.
And there you have it..

a 200 WHP Type-R motor or so.

Pretty reliable.

Cya.

Jeff

 

good advice

Thats the route i went and i wanted reliability as well.

Hp can sometimes come cheap,such as turbo or Nitrous,but reliability is what's exspensive.

 

Thanks everyone, quality replies so far.

As to pulling the block apart, no I really would rather not do that. One other criteria I forgot to mention that this reminds me of....reliability. I really want this thing to be as reliable as possible. And messing with as few things as possible is good for the same reason.

And as to superchargers and heat...I was definitely planning on intercooling in some way. I'm not sure what's available in terms of intercoolers, but with that and either stock boost or 8 psi you think heat would be that big of a problem? I was tentatively planning on a hondata 2b for it too.

How are those skunk2 cams by the way, I still haven't heard anything about them.

Argh...so many questions.....I'll stop here for now.

 

Exactly . What exactly have you done?

 

Toda B's with all the goodies and change to a different head gasket to bump comp ratio.
Good header with the ability to run it open at will.
Lightened flywheel.


That should be pretty close.

 

I've done jun3s, 12:1 compression, JDM header ETC...

it's reallly not that great honestly... i'm looking forward to boosting in the future, and nothaving to rev to 9k rpms to make power.

Just my $.02

 

Aren't a lot of people without fully built motors having problems with toda B's?

 

No. Toda Bs will still make power on a stock block.

The only problem is people expecting 200 whp on a stock block with untuned Toda Bs. That's simply not realistic. If you want to get the most out of them, higher compression and extensive tuning is necessary. However, there are plenty of people who have gotten good results with Toda Bs on stock blocks.

 

Being honest, not trying to hurt people's feelings, but I know I will..

Superchargers are totally inferior to turbo.

Totally.

My turbo system, im running intake air temperatures at about 80-95 degrees F.
Superchargers, your running in upwards of 200 degrees farenheight.

Per the same level of boost.

AND the supercharger has WAY more drag on the motor to make even 1 HP...

So in review:

Turbo VS Supercharger:

Turbo runs over 100 degrees cooler...
Turbo makes considerabely more power per/lb of boost.
Turbo does not take away as much HP to make HP as the charger. (No belts)
Turbo has the option for variable boost. Electronically.
Turbo spools up slower, thus you have WAY less wheel spin.
Turbo can be built custom for any RPM band you want...supercharger just makes power all over...(wheelspin)
Turbo runs way more effeciently (heat).

Cons:

Turbo is more expensive.
Turbo is totally illegal (if you want big power)
Turbo needs rebuilds faster.

wait....just go turbo and forget about it.

Take any type-R, supercharge it, and we will beat it all motor in the same car. 1/4 mile.

Jeff

 

What`s the budget though?

 

I thought that was the idea...
a totaly flat torque curve, controlled only by your right foot..not turbo lag.
Also, I remember him saying that he wants least hassle and mods as possible, and the drag on the engine is way more compensated for by HP increase, lower cost an less complexibility.
The supercharger system itself is generally more reliable than a Turbo system (not the engine, the actual kit itself). Also I think there are options which allow the SC to engage (like the AC compressor clutch) only when needed as in full throttle applications.
They are both excellent options, but for that application and requirements, I think a JRSC is the best way to go.

 

i ran 13.77 and still going lower all motor. but only had i/h/e/test pipe, fuel rail and fpr with slicks.
13's easy.

 

B18C5's are not meant for F/I....they have the highest piston speed of any vehicle made, excpet for maybe and indy car...cuople that with high compresion, plus turbo , or s/c ...and this whole reliable thing your trying to get flys right out the window...s/c or boost on a b18c5 doesnt = reliable...only N/a does...thats what its built for...

 

any mod to any car throws reliability out the window . . . get off the ******* Na kick . you have no clue about fi do you?

 

well aparently this guy doesnt wanna crack into his block , understandable, but if he just wants to bolt on a s/c , to an engine that is already under high stress (10:6.1 c/r) then the reliabilty of it suffers, unless your tellingme that its safer to put Boost/NOS/S/c , on a b18c5 , than it is a basic N/a build up...

 

you can just as easily do a sc, turbo or nos as you can na .
the people who have problems with their set ups are usually the ones qwho dont do research or try and cut corners or just basically have no cluer what their doing.
i know plenty of fi people who have not had reliability problems . . . . including myself.
its not about what you do , its about how you do it .

 

for a daily driven car...would you recomend f/i ...in the long run, would a f/i 'ed b18c5 live as long as a n/a one built up with bolt ons to get it into 13's ....?

 

If done properly, yes. but none will last as long as stock.

 

.....waiting for mike marsey to chime in re: jrsc.

imho:

Allmotor = *myth of* reliability

Turbo = fastest/ quickest

s/c = decent gains all over (if done well)

nos = b00m (after you run 12's for less than spending $1k)