Alright, apparently there is a fairly common fix for my situation but I've yet to find it. Heres a rundown

-Car is a 1999 Civic EX with OBD2b engine harness.
-It has a d16z6
-p28 and converted to OBD1. It has a chip for tuning chrome, but I completely disabled that by cutting the jumper.
-Everything on the motor is OBD1 except for the Intake and Exhaust manifolds, PS pump, and Alternator.
-There are no aftermarket parts on the motor (ie stock internals, all pulleys, etc etc etc..)

I've tried like crazy to set the timing on this bastard, but haven't had any luck. The situation I am in is that the Dizzy has to stay a bit more retarded than it should be to get the motor to run smooth through the rpms.

It doesn't hesitate during acceleration much, only at low low rpms and usually only during warm up. It does hesitate at Idle though, especially during warmup. And overall, it's just not as smooth as a honda motor should be.

The mechanical timing seems to be set correctly. At TDC the notch on the crank gear is aligned with the arrow on the oil pump. The Cam Gear "7 oclock" mark is aligned witht he plastic arrow inside the timing cover, however the lines that are supposed to be level with the head, are not level.

Am I missing something?! Is there some random sensor or some **** that needs to be swapped to OBD1 to run right?

I'm just at a loss. Theres a piece missing from my puzzle, and I can't find it for the life of me

 

by the way, Dizzy is OEM and new. Same goes for plugs and wires.


I've got sufficient fuel pressure

Any ideas??

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Forty04 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">however the lines that are supposed to be level with the head, are not level.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

sounds like you just said what the problem is....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94hatchling &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

sounds like you just said what the problem is....</TD></TR></TABLE>

The problem is that I've read a ton of contradicting threads both here and across the net. Basically the arguement is which lines need to match up for the z6 to be timed correctly

A - the 7-oclock notch aligned with the pointer in the timing cover

or

B - The horizontal lines being flush with the head


From what I've seen, you can't have both. So which marks am I supposed to be aligning?

 

come on, someone has got to know

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Forty04 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

The problem is that I've read a ton of contradicting threads both here and across the net. Basically the arguement is which lines need to match up for the z6 to be timed correctly

A - the 7-oclock notch aligned with the pointer in the timing cover

or

B - The horizontal lines being flush with the head


From what I've seen, you can't have both. So which marks am I supposed to be aligning?</TD></TR></TABLE>

It's the horizontal lines being parallel to the crack of the head/block.

I never used/seen the "arrow" - though I've heard of it .

 

Alright, then my cam timing is definitely a tad off....Looks like I'm back to ripping the **** apart again.

I also tossed a VSS code on the way to work this morning. Is this just a "replace it to fix it" sorta thing? (I haven't searched yet, but will right now..)

 

the arrows need to pont to the left and sit in a straight line with the deck/head just like you said.
yea the vss either take the top part off and replace it or replace the whole thine
obviously you should check to see if there is any chewed up wires or loose wires first
good luck

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SIXTY-1HATCH &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the arrows need to pont to the left and sit in a straight line with the deck/head just like you said.
yea the vss either take the top part off and replace it or replace the whole thine
obviously you should check to see if there is any chewed up wires or loose wires first
good luck </TD></TR></TABLE>

Good deal. Thanks for the help guys.


If it doesn't stop raining soon I'll just pull it into our warehouse and inspect the VSS, it's plug, and the wiring both in the engine bay as well as by the ECU.


The other issue will have to wait till I get home so I can use my impact and all that jazz.

I'll keep you guys posted. Thanks again!

 

Checked the plug, looks like theres some gunk on the middle terminal.

Reset the ECU, started the car, and the CEL came on solid, no flashing this time. I will pull that code when I go out for lunch.

 

Tried pulling the code...no flashing.


Jumpered it, turned key to II position, and the CEL will not flash. Stays solid

wtf?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Forty04 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Tried pulling the code...no flashing.


Jumpered it, turned key to II position, and the CEL will not flash. Stays solid

wtf?</TD></TR></TABLE>

If the CEL stays solid with the car jumped, you have no codes.

 

yeah I'm an idiot

 

alright, this **** is getting nutty...

Just started the car, and got a solid CEL.

Jumpered it, and the CEL comes on solid, short pause, then solid for a long time.

Short pause

Solid for a long time. Short pause, solid, short pause solid long time

 

Car is ******* possesed...

It's throwing codes at random, and blinking the codes even without being jumpered. When I do have it jumpered, the CEL comes on and stays solid, as if there are no codes. But when I pull my wire out of the jumper, turn the key to ON, it flashes codes, wtf?!?

I completely removed the ECU last night to let it fully reset. I won't know whether or not that changed anything until around 4:00 when I get home from work.


But have any of you ever heard of such a thing? Showing codes while not in diagnostics mode, and NOT flashing them when in diagnostics mode??

 

Did you jump the service connector while setting your timing?

If not then the ecu will be trying to change your setting.

 

I have an unrelated question to the fact that your car is posessed...

When you did your swap, did you get an obd2 oil pump to put in the d16z6, or did you just splice an obd1 plug onto your harness?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jayjay &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did you jump the service connector while setting your timing?

If not then the ecu will be trying to change your setting.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yessir, I always jump the connector when setting timing, adjusting idle, etc..

 

Did you use the Z6 or a Y8 camshaft gear? They are different in case you didn't know. As for the ECU CEL issues, sounds like you have a wire or loose connection somewhere. You sure when you cut the jumper that the jumper can't vibrate or whatever and periodically make/break contact?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid96EK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did you use the Z6 or a Y8 camshaft gear? They are different in case you didn't know. As for the ECU CEL issues, sounds like you have a wire or loose connection somewhere. You sure when you cut the jumper that the jumper can't vibrate or whatever and periodically make/break contact?</TD></TR></TABLE>

That is sort of what I'm thinking. I need to take a closer look today when I get home. What will really tell the tale, is when I get the new (virgin) ecu in tomorrow or Friday, and see what that does.

I used the camshaft gear that came on the z6 motor. As far as I know it is stock. Here is a close up pic, not sure if that will help or not..

 

still not working huh? i would deffinatly wait and see what the virgin ecu does, where did u get that BTW?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by cpl rampage &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">still not working huh? i would deffinatly wait and see what the virgin ecu does, where did u get that BTW?</TD></TR></TABLE>

ef-honda.com Guy out of Ohio was selling it. Pretty random coincidence considering he posted it the day I was having my issues

 

That is a Z6 gear. You have the correct gear. Looks like the marks line up fine in the pic also.

 

I think the angle of the shot is making it look more aligned than it really is. I seem to remember it being a bit off. I'll update when I konw for sure.

 

I can't see the bottom mark too well, but you know to use this, right?