89 CRX no start

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Old Apr 24, 2007 | 04:28 PM
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Default 89 CRX Si no start

Well, I've done some searching but I know there's a few things it could be and would just like to narrow it down a bit. I was told that it could be my alternator by a friend who has had slightly the same problem.

It turns over and feels like it wants to start, but then there is nothing or it will make some weird sounds (almost like a grinding) every now and then it will slightly start up but sputter out and die without fully starting. I've seen semi white smoke come from the muffler as well. I don't have the right equipment to check the ECU for codes.

Couple questions on warning lights:
The engine light is on for 2 seconds right when the key is turned before turning off and the oil light and battery lights are on until I attempt to start the car, and when it's fine and actually running they just stay off when the car has started. Is that normal?

Okay, back to the problem:
The car was running alright earlier the same day, so I was checking the water and decided to put some more in the radiator cap after I checked the oil (which looks like it could use a change), and I set the dipstick down and forgot to put it back in before I put the hose to the radiator cap, and water kinda splashes around a bit so I'm thinking some water might have gotten down in the hole where the dipstick should have been.. because it wasn't until after that that the car wouldn't start. Though I didn't attempt to start the car again until much later in the day. Could this be the problem? Or maybe the water casued the timing belt to get slippery and jump a notch or two? Not sure.
Any ideas would be greatly appreciated


Modified by usrm1d at 3:37 PM 4/25/2007
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Old Apr 24, 2007 | 06:22 PM
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No good on ideas?
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Old Apr 24, 2007 | 08:18 PM
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I was checking my spark plug tubes and noticed that there is much oil on all of them except the plug tube #1. Is this normal? I'd think that the oil would be stopping the plugs from sparking. Also, it looks like there is some condensation on the dip stick and it's telling me the oil level is about an half inch too high now.


Modified by usrm1d at 9:34 PM 4/24/2007
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Old Apr 24, 2007 | 08:54 PM
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Default Re: (usrm1d)

sounds like to me like you have a head gasket problem or the VC gasket spark plug rings might be leaking too. did you check your timing? have you messed around with it at all? couldnt be the starter if the car is trying to turn over? did you check if you have spark in all cylinders?
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Old Apr 24, 2007 | 09:06 PM
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My timing belt broke on me a while back and I replaced it myself so the timing isn't PERFECT but the car was running fine.. unless I'm right about the belt slipping then I don't think it's a timing problem.

No, I haven't yet checked for a spark on any of the clyinders... I was going to but I got sideracked. I'll try to check tonight.

Any more ideas?
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Old Apr 24, 2007 | 09:14 PM
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Default Re: (usrm1d)

ok as far as the check engine lite and oil and batterie those are normal
and to check the ecu you dont need equepment other than your eyes and the interweb so next time you go out to your car pull the passinger carpet you will see a plate under the plate is the ecu the plate has a little hole so you can manualy pull the codes what you do is pull the carpet back turn the key to the on position with out starting the car and look for a little red lite in that little hole no if there is a lite count how many times if flashed the it tends to flash once persecond if it dose and stops for more than 1 second than it just told you your code so then count again and write down how many times it flased then go to the Civic/CrX Faq here on honda tech and look for the ECU codes thread and what ever numbers you wrote done look for that ok if you have any more questions ask
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 12:29 PM
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Oh =]
Thank you.

Well I checked my ECU last night.. the light blinks one time when I turn the key to on position, and one more time when I turn the key to off position. Other then that it's not giving me anything. Is this good or bad?

Still have not been able to check for a spark because I don't have a long enough socket and can't seem to find my spark plug wrench. I'm going to assume there won't be a spark in plug #4 due to the massive amount of oil that is coming up on the tube. There's a little bit on #2 and some on #3 as well. #4 is almost covered in oil, though, while #1 looks "normal". I notice that the amount of oil gets less and less on each plug starting @ #4 so I'm thinking there must be a leak somewhere, possiby the spark plug rings as HondaRex suggested. I don't know if it means anything, but the rubber piece on the end of the spark plug tubes, is that suppose to come up with the plug when you pull it out? I don't remember which ones but it only comes up with a couple.


Thanks
And anymore troubleshooting suggestions would be appreciated
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 12:59 PM
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Well, let's start at the start.

What model of CRX? Is it the DX, HF, or Si?
Have you done any modifications to the car or motor?
When was the last time you changed the oil?
Have you driven through any high water?
Was it rather warm that day?
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 02:04 PM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by VashTheStampede &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well, let's start at the start.

What model of CRX? Is it the DX, HF, or Si?
Have you done any modifications to the car or motor?
When was the last time you changed the oil?
Have you driven through any high water?
Was it rather warm that day?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well,
It's an 1989 Si with no mods that I know of and a pretty unstraight body.. I bought it 3 months ago for a project car and have just been driving it around to run errands etc since then. I havent driven it enough to call it a daily driver, though.
I haven't changed the oil, but it does look like it could use a change.
Hmm, yeah it was feelin pretty warm that day, definitely.
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 02:40 PM
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Default Re: (usrm1d)

thats normal when you turn the key off and on it flashes like that so no codes or CEL's?
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 04:31 PM
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Nope, no codes or CEL's.

I took another look at the engine and it really looks like the oil in plug hole #3 and #4 are what's causing the problem. I'm not 100%, though. It also looks like there is oil coming out of of the head gasket from basically all around. Should a new head gasket and oil change fix this up?
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 04:37 PM
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Default Re: (usrm1d)

oil change head and valve cover gasket if you think thats the problem
good luck
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 04:44 PM
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Thanks a lot =]
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 04:52 PM
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Default Re: (Under Con. CrX)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Under Con. CrX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">oil change head and valve cover gasket if you think thats the problem
good luck </TD></TR></TABLE>

it would still start if it had a leaking Headgasket but it would run like complete ****. But right now im leaning towards your not holding compression

First off, check to see if you have fuel, spark, and compression, dont tare apart anything until you can confirm you have all of those. No sense of tearing everything apart for a headgasket when a fuse or a sensor went bad and caused absolute chaos.

as posted above, were you trying to start the car after its been sitting out in warm/hot weather? ef's have trouble in hot starts. Sometimes it takes me 2-5 minutes to start the engine on a warm day
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:02 PM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bjorn20 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

it would still start if it had a leaking Headgasket but it would run like complete ****. But right now im leaning towards your not holding compression

First off, check to see if you have fuel, spark, and compression, dont tare apart anything until you can confirm you have all of those. No sense of tearing everything apart for a headgasket when a fuse or a sensor went bad and caused absolute chaos.

as posted above, were you trying to start the car after its been sitting out in warm/hot weather? ef's have trouble in hot starts. Sometimes it takes me 2-5 minutes to start the engine on a warm day</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sometimes it will start up but it will almost immediately die and sound like trash. It doesn't start up all the way when this happens, but I'm able to let go of the key and it runs on it's own for about 5 seconds.

I know I've got fuel because I had just put $10 in the tank just incase I was getting low (my fuel gauge is broken) about 20 minutes before all of this happened.

I don't have any spark plugs laying around and since I've moved I have no idea where all my sockets went so I cant pull one to use from the engine. Is there any other way to check for a spark? and how would I go about checking compression?

The weather was nice - wasn't warmer or hotter then normal.
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:07 PM
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well you cant check compression unless you take out a spark plug and sence you dont have any whay of removing it there is realy no way to tell

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bjorn20 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">it would still start if it had a leaking Headgasket but it would run like complete ****. But right now im leaning towards your not holding compression

First off, check to see if you have fuel, spark, and compression, dont tare apart anything until you can confirm you have all of those. No sense of tearing everything apart for a headgasket when a fuse or a sensor went bad and caused absolute chaos.

as posted above, were you trying to start the car after its been sitting out in warm/hot weather? ef's have trouble in hot starts. Sometimes it takes me 2-5 minutes to start the engine on a warm day</TD></TR></TABLE>

i just made a sugetion cus he said that it his block had oil all over it he is the one that said i might be a head gasket i was just guiding him
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:08 PM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by usrm1d &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Sometimes it will start up but it will almost immediately die and sound like trash. It doesn't start up all the way when this happens, but I'm able to let go of the key and it runs on it's own for about 5 seconds.

I know I've got fuel because I had just put $10 in the tank just incase I was getting low (my fuel gauge is broken) about 20 minutes before all of this happened.I don't have any spark plugs laying around and since I've moved I have no idea where all my sockets went so I cant pull one to use from the engine. Is there any other way to check for a spark? and how would I go about checking compression?

The weather was nice - wasn't warmer or hotter then normal. </TD></TR></TABLE>

thats really starting to sound like its not holding compression (air) in the cylinders.

Just because you have fuel in your gas tank doesnt mean its getting to the injectors or even spraying into the cylinders.

Yes there are other ways for checking spark without pulling the plugs. Your going to want to disconnect the wires from them and install a spark plug tester if you have one. Try not to use those inline cheapy ones because even though you can "see" a spark, all that means is the secondary circuit has current going through it, it could still not have enough voltage to jump the gap.

for checking compression you would need a compression gauge. You can pick those up anywhere from $20-$150. pull all of your plugs, install the gauge into #1 cylinder (opposite side of transmission) crank the engine over 4 revolutions and see what the results are and if the needle stays steady.
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:09 PM
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Default Re: (Under Con. CrX)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Under Con. CrX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well you cant check compression unless you take out a spark plug and sence you dont have any whay of removing it there is realy no way to tell

i just made a sugetion cus he said that it his block had oil all over it he is the one that said i might be a head gasket i was just guiding him </TD></TR></TABLE>

lol, i posted before i read above about the oil on plugs issue. The OP had a no start problem so i didnt really care about gaskets lol
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:13 PM
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Very nice information. Thank you =D

If the compression is the problem what would a solution be?
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:17 PM
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i know its a triple post but i dont even care, dont feel like editing.

but anyway..... PLEASE check your fuses and relays that contain to fuel and ignition. You would beat yourself to death if it took you hours of frusteration to figure that out. Not sure if you have a ohm or a testlight which would help a lot. You can always do a "visual" on fuses. If the little wire inside is gone or you see anything burnt its obviosly blown. But even if it "looks" ok, it can still be bad which is why its nice to have a DMM and testlight.

Just a thought....
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:20 PM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by usrm1d &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Very nice information. Thank you =D

If the compression is the problem what would a solution be?</TD></TR></TABLE>

You are certainly welcome

A lot of money that you dont want to spend lol. If compression is lower than **** or just plain 0, you would then proceed to a cylinder leakage test to get a better idea on whats causing the leak. Once you have confirmed that you would begin to start tearing down the engine and replace the problem. Sometimes its sticking valves, worn springs, blown headgasket, bad rings.

Or worst comes to worst and you discover you have a hole in your piston and or cylinderwall. But i wouldnt worry about that in this case since it wouldnt start at all if it was that bad.
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:24 PM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by usrm1d &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Very nice information. Thank you =D

If the compression is the problem what would a solution be?</TD></TR></TABLE>

man the list is endless of possibiltys of no compression
for example my motor had no commpresion in it
and ever one was telling me about piston rings
and gaskets and a **** load of other stuff
turns out my valves where to tight *new motor never messed with by me*
to it wouldnt build compresion fixed the vavels and started right up
so there could be a **** load fo things it could be you just have to start
a list i guess you can call it and if you want to change some thing
make sure its some thing you can aford or some thing you can get form a junk yard so start on little stuff you think might be check fuel*not if you have fuel but if your geting fuel* spark make sure thats the first thing you check when you find your tools and if all else fails call a mechanic to check it for you
thats what i had to do but good luck
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:29 PM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bjorn20 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i know its a triple post but i dont even care, dont feel like editing.

but anyway..... PLEASE check your fuses and relays that contain to fuel and ignition. You would beat yourself to death if it took you hours of frusteration to figure that out. Not sure if you have a ohm or a testlight which would help a lot. You can always do a "visual" on fuses. If the little wire inside is gone or you see anything burnt its obviosly blown. But even if it "looks" ok, it can still be bad which is why its nice to have a DMM and testlight.

Just a thought.... </TD></TR></TABLE>

How might I go about checking these things?
(where would the fuses/relays be located etc)
=]
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 05:49 PM
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well you have 2 locations. You have a fuse box under the hood located at the upper left corner of your engine bay when looking at it as if you were going to open the hood. Pop the cover off and there should be a diagram of some sort on other side of cover. Look for anything that sais ignition/ign and fuel. Pull those fuses (fuel will be a relay) and just see if they look good. You will know if its bad.

The other location is underneath the dash on the drivers side. You will need to pop off a plastic cover that has two tabs (one on each side) just push them out, i think it is, and it should come right off. The problem with the underdash fuse is you have no idea what fuse powers what unless you have a schmetic/diagram of it. But there are ecu and igntion fuses under there.

But to properly check a fuse. You will need to pull it out of the fuse box and hook an ohmeter up to it. Fuses dont have polarity so dont worry about getting the leads mixed up. On most things that do have polarity it will just read a negative number, that number would be the same when hooked up correctly so it really doesnt matter unless your dealing with batterys. Anyway, Your not looking for much, maybe 1/2 (.5) of an ohm or less.

for that compression test, your going to need 2 people. The hose that connects to your spark plug hole isnt very long and its quite difficult to crank the motor over and read what it sais at the same time. If your uncomfortable doing any of these test on your own, i would honestly bring it to a shop.


Modified by Bjorn20 at 10:43 PM 4/25/2007
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Old Apr 25, 2007 | 06:20 PM
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So I checked out the fuses etc. I'm assuming the IG on the diagram was for ignition and that seems to be okay. Didn't see anything about fuel so I just checked everything with my eyes and it all looks okay. I checked every fuse under the dash and found one fried 10, don't know what it was for but I replaced it and it didn't change a thing.. except whatever it changed, which I don't know what is yet. ha.
I don't have an OHM on hand, unfortunately.. I'll try to get a new one, though, and check them all again.
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