I had a customer who I tuned that wanted to test a new set of NGK plugs vs a new set of Rocket plugs.


Modified by mtber at 1:23 PM 3/25/2007

 

The NGK PFR7G11 work well also.

 

High cam changeover makes power,and it smothed it out, however I expected a different outcome

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DELTEGRA &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">High cam changeover makes power,and it smothed it out, however I expected a different outcome </TD></TR></TABLE>

The difference could have been the gap of the plugs...
I didn't even check to see what the rocket plugs were gapped to.

For the money, the power gain is useless because there is almost no gain at all.
I consider the difference to be none between the two after seeing this comparison.

 

i had those rm on my b18..
i never did dyno them vs the ngks i mainly use..
never fet anything on the butt dyno..
anyway.

 

Maybe im looking at the wrong graph, but the rocket plugs look to be on top, albeit by a very very small portion, pretty much all the way throughout the dyno.

Also, in the Intertune DVD, rocket gives a how to on how to mod the plugs; it requires a grinder with a rotary wheel, not really brain surgery. You could buy a cheaper set of Champions and do the same thing.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Combustion Contraption &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Maybe im looking at the wrong graph, but the rocket plugs look to be on top, albeit by a very very small portion, pretty much all the way throughout the dyno.

Also, in the Intertune DVD, rocket gives a how to on how to mod the plugs; it requires a grinder with a rotary wheel, not really brain surgery. You could buy a cheaper set of Champions and do the same thing.</TD></TR></TABLE>

The difference is almost non existent, the difference you are seeing could simply be the gap in the plugs as the BKR7e's were not gapped before being installed.

 

gapped the night before to stock specs

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Echo7847 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">gapped the night before to stock specs </TD></TR></TABLE>

What were the Rocket plugs gapped to ?
What did you gap the NGK's to ?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mtber &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The difference is almost non existent, the difference you are seeing could simply be the gap in the plugs as the BKR7e's were not gapped before being installed.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Im not trying to nit pick, believe me, i have nothing to gain, but non-existant doesnt show up on a dyno, and in this case, the results are there.

I understand the NGKs were not gapped but you also stated that Rockets werent either. Gapping the plugs is 1 of only two things you have to do when installing plugs (the other being a dab of anti-seize) and you didnt do it, or even record the unmodded gap, and then post a dyno denouncing someones product. I dont get it.

 

Ok, now i see a post saying they were gapped the night before. Both specs the same?

 

Same specs, same anti-sieze (tiny bit on the threads as usual)

stock - .044"

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Combustion Contraption &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Im not trying to nit pick, believe me, i have nothing to gain, but non-existant doesnt show up on a dyno, and in this case, the results are there.

I understand the NGKs were not gapped but you also stated that Rockets werent either. Gapping the plugs is 1 of only two things you have to do when installing plugs (the other being a dab of anti-seize) and you didnt do it, or even record the unmodded gap, and then post a dyno denouncing someones product. I dont get it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I am not denouncing Rocket's product, yet showing a reputable test done by an unbiased tester.
I don't sell cams/spark plugs nor am I a dealer for any company that produces cams/sparkplugs.

The difference in the runs is so insignifigant that the shop pitbull's fart could have caused the difference between the two runs.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mtber &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am not denouncing Rocket's product, yet showing a reputable test done by an unbiased tester. I don't sell cams/spark plugs nor am I a dealer for any company that produces cams/sparkplugs.</TD></TR></TABLE>



The previous couple posts cleared a few things up.

 

I am not really sure why people get these results. All the sophisticated users make more power. Case in point there was a go-kart user that made an extra 0.75hp on a 14hp motor. The test was performed on an engine dyno. Those good at math can calculate that this is a good gain. We sent the plugs to a road racer in GA and he reported similiar percentage gains.

Do 3 back to back runs on a dynojet and 90 percent of the time the numbers will vary by 3 or more hp.

If the **** didn't work we wouldn't even bother.

But I rather not have people here buy this stuff. Better to have the guys in France and Puerto Rico use it and kick ***.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Master of the Universe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am not really sure why people get these results. All the sophisticated users make more power. Case in point there was a go-kart user that made an extra 0.75hp on a 14hp motor. The test was performed on an engine dyno. Those good at math can calculate that this is a good gain. We sent the plugs to a road racer in GA and he reported similiar percentage gains.

Do 3 back to back runs on a dynojet and 90 percent of the time the numbers will vary by 3 or more hp.

If the **** didn't work we wouldn't even bother.

But I rather not have people here buy this stuff. Better to have the guys in France and Puerto Rico use it and kick ***.</TD></TR></TABLE>

The runs where done within 5 minutes of eachother.
The results are posted above... You choose for your self.

 

Your right.

DO NOT BUY ROCKET PLUGS.

DO NOT BUY ROCKET PLUGS.

DO NOT BUY ROCKET PLUGS.

He's been exposed again

H-T Engineering

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Master of the Universe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Your right.

DO NOT BUY ROCKET PLUGS.

DO NOT BUY ROCKET PLUGS.

DO NOT BUY ROCKET PLUGS.

He's been exposed again

H-T Engineering </TD></TR></TABLE>

Hit refresh. I have updated the image with all of the run times & data I have.

 

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Master of the Universe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am not really sure why people get these results. All the sophisticated users make more power. Case in point there was a go-kart user that made an extra 0.75hp on a 14hp motor. The test was performed on an engine dyno. Those good at math can calculate that this is a good gain. We sent the plugs to a road racer in GA and he reported similiar percentage gains.

Do 3 back to back runs on a dynojet and 90 percent of the time the numbers will vary by 3 or more hp.

If the **** didn't work we wouldn't even bother.

But I rather not have people here buy this stuff. Better to have the guys in France and Puerto Rico use it and kick ***.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Concerning your go-kart claims:
.75 peak whp or across the board ?
Where are the dyno charts to prove it ?
Were the competition plugs gapped the same ?
What time lapse was there between runs ?
Was the setup carbed or fuel injected ?
Were the timing values the same on all the runs ?

We are talking about 4 cylinder honda motors, not go-kart motors.
The evidence I saw on the dyno was enough for me to consider the plugs a waste of time & money.

 

from the dyno i see a gain all around with the rocket plugs.
**** i used to get the double laser platnum plugs and those are expensive

 

Dynojet Research Inc.
Run Name: RunFile_015.drf
Run Title:
Run Notes:
Run Date: 3/24/2007 11:30:48 AM

RunFile_015.drf: 86.53°F 30.37in-Hg Humidity:18% SAE:0.97 Average Gear Ratio:105.43

s RPM x1000 hp ft-lbs
0.32 4.00 N/A N/A
0.48 4.10 89.59 114.77
0.63 4.20 92.63 115.83
0.77 4.30 96.30 117.62
0.91 4.40 101.33 120.94
1.05 4.50 104.65 122.14
1.19 4.60 103.78 118.50
1.34 4.70 101.43 113.35
1.48 4.80 100.42 109.88
1.63 4.90 102.84 110.23
1.79 5.00 104.99 110.28
1.95 5.10 106.48 109.65
2.10 5.20 108.77 109.86
2.24 5.30 111.56 110.55
2.40 5.40 114.32 111.19
2.54 5.50 117.06 111.78
2.68 5.60 121.77 114.20
2.83 5.70 127.40 117.39
2.97 5.80 130.06 117.77
3.11 5.90 133.37 118.73
3.25 6.00 136.23 119.25
3.39 6.10 138.83 119.53
3.54 6.20 140.95 119.40
3.68 6.30 142.12 118.48
3.82 6.40 144.01 118.18
3.96 6.50 145.61 117.66
4.10 6.60 147.70 117.54
4.24 6.70 148.46 116.38
4.37 6.80 151.26 116.82
4.53 6.90 159.21 121.18
4.66 7.00 163.06 122.34
4.79 7.10 168.21 124.43
4.93 7.20 171.42 125.04
5.06 7.30 174.23 125.36
5.19 7.40 177.89 126.25
5.33 7.50 181.76 127.28
5.46 7.60 184.33 127.39
5.58 7.70 186.66 127.32
5.73 7.80 187.52 126.27
5.86 7.90 187.76 124.83
6.00 8.00 188.82 123.96
6.13 8.10 190.85 123.75
6.27 8.20 192.56 123.34
6.41 8.30 193.58 122.50
6.55 8.40 193.50 120.99
6.70 8.50 191.69 118.45
6.84 8.60 191.32 116.84
7.00 8.70 190.03 114.72
7.15 8.80 188.63 112.58
7.30 8.90 186.75 110.21
--------- --------- --------- ---------
MAX: 7.30 8.90 193.58 127.39
MIN: 0.32 4.00 89.59 109.65

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dynojet Research Inc.
Run Name: RunFile_016.drf
Run Title:
Run Notes:
Run Date: 3/24/2007 11:33:52 AM

RunFile_016.drf: 86.94°F 30.36in-Hg Humidity:18% SAE:0.98 Average Gear Ratio:105.42

s RPM x1000 hp ft-lbs
0.32 4.40 N/A N/A
0.60 4.50 105.18 122.76
0.74 4.60 104.24 119.02
0.89 4.70 101.58 113.52
1.04 4.80 100.06 109.49
1.18 4.90 101.93 109.25
1.34 5.00 105.70 111.03
1.49 5.10 108.13 111.35
1.65 5.20 110.83 111.94
1.79 5.30 111.65 110.64
1.93 5.40 116.12 112.94
2.08 5.50 120.37 114.95
2.23 5.60 124.39 116.66
2.37 5.70 127.50 117.48
2.51 5.80 130.41 118.09
2.65 5.90 133.96 119.24
2.79 6.00 137.34 120.22
2.93 6.10 139.36 119.99
3.07 6.20 140.67 119.17
3.21 6.30 142.27 118.61
3.35 6.40 144.45 118.54
3.49 6.50 146.03 118.00
3.64 6.60 147.94 117.72
3.78 6.70 149.57 117.25
3.92 6.80 151.24 116.81
4.05 6.90 157.77 120.08
4.19 7.00 165.22 123.97
4.32 7.10 169.30 125.24
4.46 7.20 173.00 126.20
4.59 7.30 176.71 127.14
4.72 7.40 179.22 127.20
4.85 7.50 183.18 128.27
4.98 7.60 185.81 128.41
5.12 7.70 187.45 127.86
5.25 7.80 189.04 127.29
5.39 7.90 189.39 125.91
5.52 8.00 190.81 125.27
5.65 8.10 191.89 124.43
5.79 8.20 193.67 124.05
5.93 8.30 194.23 122.91
6.07 8.40 194.13 121.38
6.21 8.50 193.69 119.68
6.36 8.60 192.21 117.39
6.51 8.70 191.85 115.82
6.67 8.80 190.22 113.53
6.82 8.90 188.08 110.99
6.97 9.00 186.67 108.93
--------- --------- --------- ---------
MAX: 6.97 9.00 194.23 128.41
MIN: 0.32 4.40 100.06 108.93

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Echo7847 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Same specs, same anti-sieze (tiny bit on the threads as usual)

stock - .044"</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why gap pre gapped NGK spark plugs (-11 denotes 1.1mm gap)?

 

my boy ran the same NGK's in his gsr build. he made 3-4whp across the board, and at peak. all the tuner did was reduce the gap from .044 to .032. gotta love cheap *** pulgs

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Rollo Lawson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">my boy ran the same NGK's in his gsr build. he made 3-4whp across the board, and at peak. all the tuner did was reduce the gap from .044 to .032. gotta love cheap *** pulgs</TD></TR></TABLE>

this a N/A setup or turbo..?

usally with turbo builds you reduce the gap to prevent spark blow-out.