My head was milled after getting a valve job and I put it back on. I just tried to adjust my timing and it is way off.
I put the dizzy fully retarded (pulled towards the bumper) and the timing is still too advanced.
Example: Arrow on lower cover is the ^ . it is before the three lines on the crank pulley

^ ||| | <-- This is the single line on the crank pulley.

Did I miss a tooth on the crank pulley ?

My car seems to run ok. There is no bogging when accelerating.

Also, I took off the valve cover and lined up the the cams to TDC and checked the arrow on the lower cover. The arrow is pointing at the red line in middle of the three lines |||

Is the lower cover mark supposed to be there, or pointing at the single line | ?

 

It's suppose to be in the middle of those 3 lines when car is warmed up...at operating temp.

 

Yes.. I know, but the arrow isn't lining up there when the engine in running.

My question is, when the engine is off and the cams are lined up, is the lower cover arrow supposed to point to the middle of the three lines on the cam pulley or the single line?

 

if the timing was way off you would have pistons hitting valves and detonation and your life would suck....**** would be blowing up. It sounds like your timing is ok, get a timing light and see how it all looks, but as long as the cams are lined up and the crank is where it sounds like it is your ok...

you gotta keep in mind the cams turn once for 2 turns of the crank so it would have to be off ALOT to even be a tooth off on the cam gears man. I think your ok, if somethign was majorly wrong with your engine you would know it. Get everything 100% right and do a leakdownand compression test and see how it all looks and get backto us.

 

when engine is off the lines are suppose to be at the single line. that is your true
tdc mark. red is 15 degrees advanced. your cams should line up level with the head at this point.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by totsie7944 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">get a timing light and see how it all looks</TD></TR></TABLE>

Used it (see first post in thread). The timing belt arrow is to the side of the three lines.

When I did a compression test I got over 250+ psi on all cylinders. Didn't do a leakdown though.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by totsie7944 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you gotta keep in mind the cams turn once for 2 turns of the crank so it would have to be off ALOT to even be a tooth off on the cam gears man. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I think I may be off a tooth at the crank.. I need to verify. If someone knows or can check the lower cover arrow when the cams pulleys are lined up with the engine off, please let me know where the lower cover arrow is pointing.

 

Damn. Did more and more searching and found an answer.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1900500
Both cam gears need to be in the "up" position and there are marks "slits" 90 degress from each side of the up arrow on the cam gear teeth. The slits need to be lined up with each other and the crank at TDC (white mark lined up with timing mark on timing cover</TD></TR></TABLE>

I am off by 15 degrees! Crap. Its going to be a long weekend this Saturday.
That means I'll have to redo my valve adjustment after I get the crank lined up properly.

Any "quick" way of readjusting the belt ?

Here's what I'm thinking:
1) take of valve cover
2) line up cam gears so No.1 cylinder is at TDC
3) take off top timing belt cover
4) loosen tensioner.
5) Try and slip off t-belt from cams
6) Rotate crank 15 degrees until the white single mark lines up to lower arrow on t-belt cover
7) Split on t-belt onto cams
8) readjust tension on t-belt
9) Do valve adjustment
10) Make sure crank spins freely.
11) Put back valve cover and t-belt cover.

Does this sound feasable ? Or will I need to go throught the full HELMS instructions to readjust the timing belt ?

 

i had this issue...

thin HG with decked head..

get your timming as close as possible, when tightening the tensioner make sure you give it an extra boost u dont want the belt slappin around or u will skip(had that issue with the cams im runnin)

what you need to do is get adjustable cam gears, because since the space between the cams and the crank is less the T belt is "too long" it wassng made for that

way i did my timming was get the crank mark lined up, put the belt on the exhaust cam(get the marks as close as possible) and then the intake cam(if the exhaust was retarded retard the intake too, if it was advanced, advance intake same amount)

now thats how i did it it might not be the correct way but itw orked for me... with the adjustable cam gears when i had the car tuned i was able to get them set to where they were setup best...

 

first off bro you are FINE...haha your never going to get it perfect, you'd have to be off ALOT more than that on the crank pulley to blow **** up...i just rebuild my whole engine so I am fresh at this right now.

Do what you said, take off valve cover, top timing belt cover, loosen tensioner.

Get the cam gears lined up in the "UP" position so the marks are side by side on the gears, get the crank (turning counterclockwise) lined up at TDC, anywhere in between the 3 lines and last line is fine bro.

Ok Im dead serious, and many will vouche for this statement, get a coat hanger, needle nose plyers, grab the end (wire hanger) and bend it over (you want like 1/2cm worth or less bent over, just grab the very tip of the end withthe needle nose and bend 180 degrees over...)

get the tensioner spring caught on the hanger and rip the dam thing out and throw it away. Theres a hole that you will then be able to put the hanger through and tension the timing belt MUCH BETTER with use of your muscles.

put the timing belt back on and have someone push on the intake side of it to keep the slack tight and teeth all lined up (specially in the exhaust side where it will get tight as soon as you turn the crank counterclockwise). Get the hanger caught in the little hole on the tensioner and pull that dam thing tight! While your pulling the timing belt tight, have someone else grab the 14mm wrench and tightin the tensioner up. once its tight start feeling around the belt, you want it tight, but not soo tight it will be whining while the motor is running. check the deflection, and make sure that theres no slack up or down. Your stronger than the spring was so that belt should be good and tight.

turn the crank twice and then look at the timing again, it will havemoved some, but as long as your in between those lines your fine man. Like I said you gotta be off alot to blow **** up at the crank.

Good luck man

 

Thanks for everyone's help! It was a beautiful day out today, so I'm happy about that. For once, I wasn't frozen while working on my car.

I ended up doing it the long way (removing p/s belt, a/c belt, alt. belt, etc.. )
But it was the best way to do it.
I checked the crank shaft mark against the oil pump and it was off by a tooth!
Damn..

I put everything back on and triple checked everything. Redid the valve lash clearances and buttoned everything back up. Took it for a test drive to warm up the engine and then set the timing. I was able to set it to the red mark this time without a problem.

I did not have an exhaust leak after all. The timing was so far advanced before (30 degrees) that it almost sounded like I had an open header when I put a load on the engine.

Its sounds beautifully in tune now!

I'm not sure if I want to put the header bracket back on though. I've read that people have run fine without the bracket,so maybe I'll leave it off.

FBP 2000 ITR #135 is fully back in service now

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by totsie7944 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ok Im dead serious, and many will vouche for this statement, get a coat hanger, needle nose plyers, grab the end (wire hanger) and bend it over (you want like 1/2cm worth or less bent over, just grab the very tip of the end withthe needle nose and bend 180 degrees over...)

get the tensioner spring caught on the hanger and rip the dam thing out and throw it away. Theres a hole that you will then be able to put the hanger through and tension the timing belt MUCH BETTER with use of your muscles.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Uh.. Yeah.. When I checked the timing belt, it had too much slack, it could flap around it if wanted to. I didn't throw out the tensioner spring though. I did the coat hanger thing and had someone pull hard on it while I tightened the tensioner bolt. The tension is much better now and I won't have to worry about it flapping around.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by arren123 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Uh.. Yeah.. When I checked the timing belt, it had too much slack, it could flap around it if wanted to. I didn't throw out the tensioner spring though. I did the coat hanger thing and had someone pull hard on it while I tightened the tensioner bolt. The tension is much better now and I won't have to worry about it flapping around.</TD></TR></TABLE>

good work man...glad I could offer some helpful advice, and Im glad tohear you got everything running right and the engine is running smoothly!

 

Yeah.. Except now I'm noticing a whine that sounds like its coming from the transmission. Its very very faint compared to the normal loud noises of the car.
It almost sound like the noise that you hear when going in reverse, but I'm hearing it when accelerating in 1st and 2nd, and possibly 3rd gear. It seems to go away when I press on the clutch.

Again, its a very faint noise right now.. I just hope nothing else goes wrong with the car. I don't think i can take much more of this.

 

To get it perfect though you still are going to need adjustable cam gears because your head is milled.

 

I found out that it was only milled around 0.003-0.005. So it should be negligable.

 

sounds like your throw out bearing thats what started to happend on my talon