ok if u run faster than a 11.4 you need a cage.. can it be a 8point cage... or does it have to be 10 point . im asking cause i see alot of 10 pt cages in cars on here..
i cant find the rules so comeone educate me.. id rather go 8 pt cause i dont wanna cut into the dash and crap.. well anyone?

 

ttt

 

A 5 point roll bar s legal down to 10.00 as long as the car has unaltered firewall, floor, and body from firewall rearward (wheeltubs permitted).

If a roll cage is needed (10-14point) most hondas are not going to get away with an 8 point because the two bars that go rearward have to be 30" long or less. (setup B1)

So, most people run a 10-point cage which can have the bars longer than 30" but you must run at least 4 and they have to be 1 3/8" (setup B2). With 1 1/4" bars you must run at least 6 bars (setup B3).


All this is found in the rulebook here: http://www.nhrasportcompact.com

 

Considering the NHRA rulebook is based upon RWD vehicles, the FWD (hardtop) couterparts vary slightly in how the rules are outlined.

A Roll bar is required from 10.49 to 10.00. Ok.

A roll cage (10point+) is required from 9.99 OR 135MPH; whichever comes first. Turbo FWD vehicles (at least honda's for that matter) reach 135MPH at roughly 10.9-11.0. This essentially renders a roll bar useless for a turbo FWD vehicle IMO based on the fact that it will only be within regulation when running roughly 11.0 to 11.5. I feel this is too small a timeframe to warrant use of a rollbar in such said vehicle.

All motor cars on the other hand are a differant ball game. These vehicles reach 135 at roughly 10.0 so a roll bar is all that is technically required as I dont see many N/A vehicles going that fast as is. In the other hand when an all motor car is dipping down in the 10's I would suggest a roll cage solely for chassis rigidity.

What do you feel your chassis needs?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bigTom &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A roll cage (10point+) </TD></TR></TABLE>


NO, a roll cage is 8+ points. Read the rulebook, it's all there. The rulebook doesn't differ at all. It clearly outlines the rules for all classes.


Also, assuming that a sub 11 sec turbo FWD will go faster than 135 is just ignorant. I've seen many run low 10's in the 120's. A decent suspension setup will achieve that along with a non dyno queen turbo.

The problem is that so many people think they xx amount of horsepower. Many of these cars don't even see full boost in 1st or even 2nd gear. That is what results in high traps and high times. The first 1/8 is worthless.





Modified by F20Cteg at 7:14 AM 1/28/2007

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by F20Cteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


NO, a roll cage is 8+ points. Read the rulebook, it's all there. The rulebook doesn't differ at all. It clearly outlines the rules for all classes.

Modified by F20Cteg at 7:14 AM 1/28/2007</TD></TR></TABLE>

I know the NHRA rulebook like the back of my hand. I was making a generalized statement in regard to what is required at what speeds. The bars in question ("d" bars) are required when the main hoop points are welded to plates on the floor. Didn't think there would be somebody to make a stink over it. FYI a roll bar can also be considered a 8 point with those d-bars installed at that point for arguments sake.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by F20Cteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Also, assuming that a sub 11 sec turbo FWD will go faster than 135 is just ignorant. I've seen many run low 10's in the 120's. A decent suspension setup will achieve that along with a non dyno queen turbo.


Modified by F20Cteg at 7:14 AM 1/28/2007</TD></TR></TABLE>


Re-read my statement. At this point in time turbo FWD vehicles run roughly 135 @ 11.0. Do you own a turbo FWD vehicle and what does it run? My shop and I have built numerous 10 sec. street cars (yes, driven on the street) and they all fall within my categorization as well as many other examples posted here on h-tech itself falling within those #'s. I don't doubt what you have seen but once again I was making a generalized statement for the general public. Each and every chassis I build is built to what is needed and/or customer requirements.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by F20Cteg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

The problem is that so many people think they xx amount of horsepower. Many of these cars don't even see full boost in 1st or even 2nd gear. That is what results in high traps and high times. The first 1/8 is worthless.

Modified by F20Cteg at 7:14 AM 1/28/2007</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you don't see your full pre-set boost in 1st and 2nd gear you are doing something wrong. Just because many cars do not see boost does not mean others havent figure it out. I disagree; the 1st 1/8th is the most important. Anybody can make HP; thats not the problem with these cars, traction down low is the problem IMO.

 

well i know the tracks arent too strickt around here.. but i ran a 11.7 at 119 with the old setup wich was a ebay 57trim turbo with a small 1k powerband.. the new setup is gonna be a gt3076R with a topmount so i know im gonna have a much wider powerband maybe get me down to a high 10.. atleast with a 8 point i can add o make it a 10 later??? what do you guys think.. its a d- series so its never gonna run a 9 lol

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bigTom &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I disagree; the 1st 1/8th is the most important. Anybody can make HP; thats not the problem with these cars, traction down low is the problem IMO.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm not saying the first 1/8 is worthless, I'm saying that with those setups mentioned above make the first 1/8 worthless. That is why it is so important. That is where FWDs make their time.

11.0 @ 135 is either inexperienced driver, too big of a turbo, or poor suspension/tire setup. No disrespect to any cars you've built. The average? is just that, average, meaning higher and lower. Honestly these days, it's fairly cheap to build a car, but it takes that extra knowledge and testing experience to make it efficient.

Why do you think it is that all the nitrous turbo FWD don't really increase their traps, but lower their times significantly? It is becuase they are making progress in the first 1/8, a lot of progress.

Also, ya roll bar can be whatever point you want as long as it doesn't meet the minumun criteria for a roll cage.