Isn't a little backpressure in an N/A vehicle better than none? If so, running an exhaust with a 3'' tip isn't actually all that beneficial, right? Well, would keeping/putting the silencer in the exhaust create more backpressure, thus more power than running without it?

 

If you dont have enough back Pressure, Aka ( Too big of pipe) you dont gain anything, you infact lose performance

Mufflers DO NOTHING, When you go to meineke or whatever and ask for a catback exhaust, it does nothing, dosnt make your car faster, dosnt give it anything but an annoying sound

The only exhaust you get performance from are actual Full Exhaust systems from name brand companies

 

im gunna have to agree if u want some real power gains gotta go from the headers all the way back

 

From what I've read and experienced, it isn't back pressure you want. In reality, that is what you don't want. Think about something: why do we upgrade to 4-2-1 headers? it's because that style of header "pulls", via a created vacuum, the ajoining exhaust from the other comustion chamber....back pressue STOPS or at least limits this process which results in HP gains or is severe cases, less HP.

What we want is velometric effficency. velocity is created when the exhaust size is matched to the exhaust volume. Too big hurts low end power but might help high end vise versa......this stuff is science....professional racers don't go on eBay and buy the lowerst priced components, they sit down with computer programs and graph, calculate, and come up with exhaust systems matched to their specific needs...

 

Running a silencer on your fart can wont give you any power, at all.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by standbackimapro &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you dont have enough back Pressure, Aka ( Too big of pipe) you dont gain anything, you infact lose performance

Mufflers DO NOTHING, When you go to meineke or whatever and ask for a catback exhaust, it does nothing, dosnt make your car faster, dosnt give it anything but an annoying sound

The only exhaust you get performance from are actual Full Exhaust systems from name brand companies

</TD></TR></TABLE>

bullshyt, any exhaust modification that allows your engines exhaust to flow better will improve performance, even if its too little to notice.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pos_cd5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

bullshyt, any exhaust modification that allows your engines exhaust to flow better will improve performance, even if its too little to notice.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So your telling me if i rip off the header of my car, after the valves are burnt to ****, that im gonna notice a performance gain " Because it Flows better"

Maybe after you graduate highschool, get your ASE X1 Certification, then you can tell me somthing about exhausts

Dont bother with an exhaust unless your ready to spend some serious mufflers, dont go to meineke and have them weld on a tip

because its the stupid thing ive ever seen in my life

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by standbackimapro &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So your telling me if i rip off the header of my car, after the valves are burnt to ****, that im gonna notice a performance gain " Because it Flows better"

Maybe after you graduate highschool, get your ASE X1 Certification, then you can tell me somthing about exhausts

Dont bother with an exhaust unless your ready to spend some serious mufflers, dont go to meineke and have them weld on a tip

because its the stupid thing ive ever seen in my life</TD></TR></TABLE>

i know a tip isnt going to give you any gains, and running open headers will make you drop power. but im disagreeing with the statement that you made that the only way to make power from exhasut is to go with a name brand cat. back. which is false. yes, a quality high performance muffler is key to gain power, but you dont need a expensive name brand cat back. i've seen amny applications where people used a name brand hi-per. muffler with mild steel piping fabbed up by a local muffler shop that isnt mandrel bent because they couoldnt afford it and it still made power. sure crush bent mild steel piping isnt going to be as good as mandrel bent SS but with bigger piping then stock with a higher flowing muffler you'll still see gains.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1990hondaHF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">From what I've read and experienced, it isn't back pressure you want. In reality, that is what you don't want.</TD></TR></TABLE>

While I do understand why you say that, it's not correct. If all you care about is top end power and you totally disregard everything on the low end, than fine, keep saying that. The truth of the matter is that NA motors <U>DO</U> need a certain amount of backpressure to make low-end torque.

Don't believe me? Take a look at the V6 Accords. They lose low-end power with most cat-back exhausts. They lose a LOT of low-end power with high-flow cats or cat-deletes. This is just an example.

The simple fact is that NA motors DO need backpressure... Honda motors are already known as torqueless motors. How much worse do you want to make it?

 

you are correct. too much backpressure isnt good. however n/a cars do need some. and no a muffler will not give you any gains....a catback with proper sized tubing will give you gains...name brand or not

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by philadd &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
While I do understand why you say that, it's not correct..........
The simple fact is that NA motors DO need backpressure... </TD></TR></TABLE>

http://miata.net/garage/KnowYourCar/S4_Back.html
http://www.cobbtuning.com/tech....html
http://www.team-integra.net/se...ID=48
http://www.bigcitythunder.com/...t.pdf

Wrong, period. Read the science. It sn't backpressure that causes HP/torque. What people think is that after they bolt on a large exhaust, and there is a torque loss, it is because there is no backpressure, WRONG. The reason there is a loss is linked to the loss of velocity that is further linked to the scavaging affect of the the header system. Backpressue need is a common misconception started inocently by uneducated people, not bad people. Most if not all of the V8 guys have left the old school of thought....maybe it's time we do too.

 

So will the silencer ultimately hurt performance?

 

From what I've read, anything that slows the velocity of the exhaust flow will hurt performance. Lower velocity = less scavaging effect of your header = burnt exhaust fumes "linger" in the combustion chamber longer then a non-tuned "backpressure is better" system.. When you have a tuned header/exhaust, the exhaust pulses compliment each other creating a vacumm behind each other, thereby, removing more spent(useless) exhaust gas....or something like that....personaly I would replace it with a straight through NON lovered resonator...

 

I've read through all four of your links. In fact, I didn't really read anything that I disagreed with. You see, I keep saying LOW-end power... Most of your links are focused on mid- to high-end power, where I completely agree that backpressure is bad. Your last link mentions:

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bigcitythunder.com &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It is true that some engines are mechanically tuned to "X" amount of backpressure and can show a loss of low-end torque when that backpressure is reduced. It is also true that the same engine that lost low-end torque with reduced back-pressure can be mechanically re-tuned to show an increase of low-end torque with the same reduction of back-pressure. More importantly, maximum mid-to-high RPM power will be achieved with the lowest possible backpressure. Period!</TD></TR></TABLE>

This essentially summarizes what I've been saying. Now, if you can show me an easy way to mechanically re-tune the engine for the reduction of backpressure, then I'll back off and say that I'm 100% wrong. But... if you tell me that I need to go get some custom cams made, where R&D and/or trial and error is important, well then I guess it wouldn't be an "easy way".

Or, alternatively, if you can point out in one of the links where it talks about low-end power instead of mid- to high-end power... I simply might have overlooked it.

(Please keep in mind I am trying to debate this in the most polite and good-mannered way that I can over the internet. I have no problem being proven wrong.)