Why does Tein insist on using such stiff spring rates! I honestly don't get it. A stiffer spring rate isn't necessarily going to make your car handle any better. I want to get my RA's re-valved or try even softer spring rates. Tein basically told me the shock was designed around the spring rates it came with. If it's more expensive to revalve them I have a set of moton's I want to try out.

 

possibly because they are JDM and the last few times I went to Japan, their roads are generally smoother than anything you'd find in North America.

high spring rates do not necessarily mean a harsh or poor ride, it's the damping characteristics (valving) that you mentioned that is responsible mainly for that.

I, by all means am NO expert, but after driving and owning a variety of dampers, certain Showas have demonstrated this even with spring rates as high as 18/16 on the street.

 

Yeah, I can agree with you on that however, even on smooth pavement valving is still set too stiff. There is no compliance. The increased rebound just makes the car very twitchy and a harsh ride condition.

 

if you dont like a harsh ride then why did you buy a set of coilovers with stiff springs in the first place........... dont blame tein for the product that is doing what its inteded to do, blame yourself for buying it.

 

Tein is infamous for using stiffer spring rates than their dampers can handle. I have ol' skool HR's at 8kF and 6kR and they suck *** for that reason.

Looking into the GC/Koni set-up

 

you bought tein ra's that were designed for the track and ur complaining about it being to stiff for the street??? why don't u go try type flex or a more streetable setup instead of complaining about track coilovers

 

If you want to get rid of them... holla at me! :D

 

Super Streets would be perfect for you

 

iirc tein makes type flex n up for our caRs...

 

my showas do good with 18/16 k spring rate, the ride is even better than the RA which is 12/10 i think.

tein is famous in fast rebound

 

okay this is one of the reasons I never post on this site anymore, not flaming on the local's who have been here, you guys are good guys! HypeR Speed, how do you know what the car is used for? don't just assume that the car is used for street use like your's. The car only see's track miles if any and if you even had a clue what Sebring is like to drive, you would understand that the valving and stiff spring rates are a ridiculous setup for the track. Oh and 410REPN again, I'll just put you in the same boat as HypeR speed on this one.

 

Jonathan, I know what your talking about. Sebring is a very rough track. T17 is notorious for this reason. You should come out Sept 17th and feel how the PIC's at 12k, 10k feel. See if it feels any better to you.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">okay this is one of the reasons I never post on this site anymore, not flaming on the local's who have been here, you guys are good guys! HypeR Speed, how do you know what the car is used for? don't just assume that the car is used for street use like your's. The car only see's track miles if any and if you even had a clue what Sebring is like to drive, you would understand that the valving and stiff spring rates are a ridiculous setup for the track. Oh and 410REPN again, I'll just put you in the same boat as HypeR speed on this one.</TD></TR></TABLE>

and i will put you in the same boat as well, why did you buy such stiff suspension if your going to whine and complain about it

"sorry to the locals" gimme a break

 

maybe cuz I can afford a Type R and have nice suspension to whine about...

 

I think what you guys don't realize, and all jumped on the bandwagon about is the fact that he pretty much only tracks his car. Being that they have such a short rebound stroke, lowering the car more makes the ride even worse. On a track like Sebring that is rough as hell, this becomes a problem.

Again, Jonathan... if you want, come out to sebring next month and see how my car feels to you.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">maybe cuz I can afford a Type R and have nice suspension to whine about... </TD></TR></TABLE>
oh my lordy, how on earth can you possibly afford thee payments on a $15k car, that is astronomical!

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dave_B &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think what you guys don't realize, and all jumped on the bandwagon about is the fact that he pretty much only tracks his car. Being that they have such a short rebound stroke, lowering the car more makes the ride even worse. On a track like Sebring that is rough as hell, this becomes a problem.

Again, Jonathan... if you want, come out to sebring next month and see how my car feels to you.</TD></TR></TABLE>

it doesn't really matter what he uses his car for and where he drives it. if he was smart he would have researched(tein does list all specs on their website) what he was buying before he bought it and bought the best suspension for his application and needs. instead he asks why his spring rates are so high...hmmmm i wonder

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 410REPN &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
it doesn't really matter what he uses his car for and where he drives it. if he was smart he would have researched(tein does list all specs on their website) what he was buying before he bought it and bought the best suspension for his application and needs. instead he asks why his spring rates are so high...hmmmm i wonder </TD></TR></TABLE>

Seriously dude, I don't think you know him, his background or anything else. I think he's got way more R&D, track time and research than you and I combined.

Just because it lists the spring rates doesn't mean ****. Read back what I said. It's not the spring rates that are the problem. It's the dampening. Why do you ask that he mentioned spring rates? Probably because most on here don't understand the dynamics of suspension.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why does Tein insist on using such stiff spring rates! I honestly don't get it. A stiffer spring rate isn't necessarily going to make your car handle any better. </TD></TR></TABLE>
What spring rates are we talking about here? I have Showas in my car w/ 14K F / 16K R and it doesn't bounce that much. I'm mostly at Summit Point, which is not exactly the smoothest track in the world.

When you talked with Tein, did they suggest precise adjustments considering the spring rates you're using? Have you adjusted the shocks much?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...I have a set of moton's I want to try out. </TD></TR></TABLE>
That seems a little extreme for most purposes, but it's your money.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by white rocket &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Looking into the GC/Koni set-up </TD></TR></TABLE>
If your car's mostly on the street, that could very well be perfect for you. Remember that Koni Yellow are not meant for the heavy spring rates that we are talking about here, though.

And if you're lowering your car very much make sure you get the extended top hats.

The combination of high spring rates and reduced travel is death to Konis.

Ask me how I know.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 410REPN &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if he [were] smart he would have researched...what he was buying before he bought it....</TD></TR></TABLE>
Some of your comments border on flaming and they are being reported. Please calm down a little bit.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">maybe cuz I can afford a Type R and have nice suspension to whine about... </TD></TR></TABLE>
Well. If you have a set of Motons in reserve, then you have too much money.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by frozenb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">my showas do good with 18/16 k spring rate....</TD></TR></TABLE>
My Showas also do well when driving to the track, and some of these country roads on the way to Summit Point are hardly what you'd call smooth. I went through several changes before I broke down and got the Showa.

The same basic setup is sold in the USDM as both Mugen and Spoon brand names, and they're easy to find. Not the cheapest thing in the wordl, but easy to find.

How much camber do you have up front to compensate for that 18K spring rate up there? Goodness, you must have like 3.25 degrees or something!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Well. If you have a set of Motons in reserve, then you have too much money. </TD></TR></TABLE>

They are completely rebuilt, they have just been sitting around from when we ran a car in the motorola cup a long time ago.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well. If you have a set of Motons in reserve, then you have too much money.


My Showas also do well when driving to the track, and some of these country roads on the way to Summit Point are hardly what you'd call smooth. I went through several changes before I broke down and got the Showa.

The same basic setup is sold in the USDM as both Mugen and Spoon brand names, and they're easy to find. Not the cheapest thing in the wordl, but easy to find.

How much camber do you have up front to compensate for that 18K spring rate up there? Goodness, you must have like 3.25 degrees or something!</TD></TR></TABLE>

I m having around 3 degree negative camber . I use 16k in the front and 18k in the rear. for sure it's not a comfort ride, but it worth any penny especially when on track.
I live in Toronto which we never had smooth road. just don't low the car too low and u won't bottom out. a short body shocks is built for this....too bad i still bottom out my spoon few times and it's hurt me....i m on the heightest adjustment on the shock..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by frozenb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I use 16k in the front and 18k in the rear.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Somehow I got the impression you had the 18K in the front. That's why I was asking how much camber you'd need to compensate.

 

Here's the problem:

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM Factor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> The car only see's track miles if any and if you even had a clue what Sebring is like to drive, you would understand that the valving and stiff spring rates are a ridiculous setup for the [that] track. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, Sebring is notoriously bumpy.
That's also why teams make shock/damper adjustments and replace/swap springs as necessary!