what is the highest compression you can run safely with pump gas?

 

 

yes we have 93 octane here. What are good cams to go with 12.5:1 compression?

 

i'm running about 12.5 to 1 at the moment on a type r with gsr cams and it still detonates every now and again.. and i believe my timing is at like -2 degrees..

 

i ran 13.0:1 in my old b20/vtec in my R, not det. problems, but i also had buddy club spec 4's to help relieve cylinder pressure. that is gonna be your biggest concern is cam choice for your high compression motor

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by emotionisdead &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i ran 13.0:1 in my old b20/vtec in my R, not det. problems, but i also had buddy club spec 4's to help relieve cylinder pressure. that is gonna be your biggest concern is cam choice for your high compression motor </TD></TR></TABLE>are those the best cams for high compression?

 

What are you doing with the motor? You're asking about specific parts...thats not going to cut it, man...you have to pick parts like you would draft players for a team...is this part going to compliment my team or hinder it? Will I be able to massage it to fit or will this just be a waste of time?

Certain parts are designed for certain applications... Like the M24 cams...they're not High compression cams...they're best suited for 11.5 cR in a 2 liter.

Your other thread about the valves leads me to this conclusion about your questions...you really should ask yourself what your plans are for the motor.

 

my plans are to get the most power out of a n/a motor bored out to 2.0 with high compression. If you could help me out that would be great. I am not all that knowledgable with this stuff.

 

There is alot of info, but read on...it will help you start a direction and give you more focus to your questions...

MOST IMPORTANT PLACE to start is to find a competent builder...No V8 guys...SERIOUSLY...Ask me how I know.


Well, you raise a problem. You shouldn't bore out a B18C block to 84mm (enough to get you in the 2L range). You will either need to get a b20 block (cheapest) or get your block sleeved.

I say, because you are new to motor building, stay w/ the 1.8. It gives plenty of power with the right combination of parts.

Consider raising your compression ratio w/ some JDM ITR pistons. This will yield a 11.5 CR ratio with a 2 layer head gasket, and be cheaper on the o'll pocket book. Then, get your head ported. You'll need to beef up the bottom end. Minimally, you'll need to install ARP 9mm rod bolts.

The most street friendly cams seem to be the Jun III, Toda B, or M22XX cams, while delivering a powerful punch. You can go with BLOX B cams or Skunk 2 cams, as those also deliver a good kick. I would steer you towards the M22XX cams by Rocket Motorsports as that's what I will be looking into. You'll need the necessary valve springs and retainers to accommodate the extra lift and added RPM needed to get the most out of the cams. Also, you'll need to move down in the heat range of your spark plugs...NGK #7 is what most use w/ a compression of around 11.5 to 12 points.

With the added compression, and the fact that you'll probably be revving...alot...You'll need an adequate PVC system as stock wont cut it. Endyn has what you need...The endyn catch can is a great system.

The intake manifold will play a key role in power and torque production. Endyn's new manifold also has some good theories surrounding it. You could go the way of Individual Throttle Bodies, such as myself, but this is a opinion of mine that torque production is more important than all out power. Choose wisely or experiment your self...it would be a good learning experience.

Go to http://www.theoldone.com for endyn parts...and to get learned on some things that will help you decide what you want from your motor...and give you an idea on what will be involved.

Next and equally important as cam selection, is the header. Perhaps, more important then anything else you'll bolt to your motor, this is where I would invest the majority of your budget. A properly tuned header will do absolutely wonders for your motor. You'll need to supplement the header w/ an adequate cat and exhaust system. A strong, power producing header will be either a custom Burns header, Hytech header, SMSP header or an RMF header. There are knock off counterparts on the market, but you really do get what you pay for...quality means everything when it comes to a header.

Tuning: This is the MOST IMPORTANT PART of any build. A piggy back unit such as a APEX VAFC will not cut it. You need a stand-alone. Find a renowned tuner in your area, not some hick whom thinks that he's a tuner because he can adjust the air/fuel mixture on some '55 Chevy. What ever that tuner suggests is what you should go with. Hondata, AEM, CROME, and Uberdata are some of the more popular EMS units/programs on the market.

You'll need a fuel system up to the task of supporting your needs. A walboro 255 will do the trick and I suggest RC 310cc injectors or something with greater flow.

Finally, bottom up your drivetrain to support your torque production. A light flywheel and a strong clutch will be the ticket. Fidanza Flywheels are a popular flywheel (I have one installed in my Integra) and weigh just 7.5 lbs. I am currently running an Exedy stage 1 clutch. This should support 170-190 Ft lbs of torque. Anything more, and I would look into a stronger clutch. Centerforce Dual-friction is a GREAT clutch...I've run one before and a friend of mine ran this clutch on a turbo build and an ALLMotor build...the same clutch. So that gives you an idea on how stout the Centerforce unit is.

Get some good tires, you'll need them.


Modified by Circuit Star-29 at 12:24 AM 4/16/2006


Modified by Circuit Star-29 at 12:35 AM 4/16/2006

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Fayzeless &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> What are good cams to go with 12.5:1 compression?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Rocket Motorsports M24X's. Don't forget that you will need to beef up the whole valve train.

To utilize the higher compression, good head work is always benificial. There is a lot of untapped power in a B series head.

 

Im currently running Toda B with 11.5 CR.. the block is gonna overhaul next month(planned) and i also wondered if I should go for B16B pistons..

 

PCT pistons are a common way of bumping the CR up...Just make sure that you clay the motor before final assembly...

That method can aslo be found on http://www.c-speedracing.com/h...y.php

 

hey thanks for all that info! that was really cool that you took your time to tell me all that. I appreciate that bro. Also, I have eagle H beam rods that fit a stock b18 block. Will those do, and will they fit on a b20?





Modified by Fayzeless at 4:06 PM 4/16/2006

 

If the rods are for a b18C, then, no, they will not fit a ls/b20 crank. But that is a good start. Seriously, try out a 1.8L and see how you like it...with the right combination of parts it will scream.

Having a direction rather than questions is what I hope to give you...

 

Having a direction rather than questions is what I hope to give you... [/QUOTE] yes you have givin me direction and i appreciate that. I picked up some jun 3 camshafts now too. what pistons and compression still boggles me though.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Fayzeless &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Having a direction rather than questions is what I hope to give you... </TD></TR></TABLE> yes you have givin me direction and i appreciate that. I picked up some jun 3 camshafts now too. what pistons and compression still boggles me though.[/QUOTE]

.....those cams would be fine on 91 to 93 octane. A local buddy of mine ran them for years and years at 200whp with itr motor and ctr pistons.



Just get some good supporting parts like cam gears, i/h/e and TUNING.

Oh yeah: CLAY YOUR MOTOR.

 

good info..

 

do you think skunk pro series stage 2 would be better? or maybe stage 1?