Note: There are two questions, and one request within this post.


Reason for Post: I know rear sub frame tear is a popular topic forum conversation for 96-00 Civics, but I was curious how many people in the Houston area have actually experienced their sub frame tearing/ ripping ?

Please try to be objective, and honest, some anecdotal input would be beneficial. I do realize that statistically this is a poor way to run a survey.

Question 1:
How many people on H-T.com have larger sway bars? What have your experiences been with rear sub frame strain?

Question 2:
Have some members on H-T.com experienced rear sub frame failure with larger sway bars.

If you have had that experience, could you tell me what you had done to your car [suspension wise], also were your bushings good, and did you have any prior rear collision damage.

I've searched for a while [couple of weeks], but I haven't much data on what facilitated these failures.

I do realize that the metal is thinner then the Type R's rear sub frame; also it seems that people who have run higher spring rates have not had issues. But for daily driven cars, that do auto crossing or spirited driving, I don't have much information on that.

Request: If you have a link that has good information, could you please send it my way.

Your help is greatly appreciated.

 

I havent experienced it myself, i have seen however, plenty of threads with different cars that have had that happen. Many of them were running softish spring rates, off the top of my head, stock springs @ 80lb/in rear, and ProKit at 190 lb/in rear.

I was running, up until about a week ago, a light rear swaybar, a gsr 14mm actually. That is fra lower than I would have to worry about any damage. I am presently waiting on my function7 endlinks to install my Blox 21mm and ASR setup.

 

I've been using the 22mm ITR rear bar with the Beaks kit, Skunk2 coilovers & KYB AGX shocks. I don't consider my rear spring rate, (335lb) to be all that stiff...but I check my subframe regularly...and have NO sign of tearout. I drive the car pretty hard and have used this setup at two solo events. I'm crossing my fingers that it holds up until next month when I can finally order my ASR brace.

 

ooooh ASR very nice.

i have experienced sub frame damage.

-2000 civic coupe.
-skunk2-23mm antiroll bar
-tein super street dampers
-bushings perfect
-no damage to the car
-car was never tracked only daily driven, spirited driving.

what kind of info do you need? i don't have links but i have info.
at the time i didnt even know it was possible. i went in to change out the teins for some zeals and found the skunk bar was pretty much just hanging there with only one side connected. i jumped on here and did some research and found that a larger bar with lighter rear rates with no support will often cause the rip. i think what really killed it was those shitty type of curbs that are found in newer subdivisions that are huge designed for water runoff purposes. i would be three wheeling everytime i went up one. which means i was transferring TWICE the amount of rear weight on that subframe/suspension. it was only a matter of time before it failed. long story short, I never put a bar back on and never fixed it. just seemed like so much hassle.

honestly for complete peace of mind i would strongly advise going with the A-Spec Racing subrframe brace that Gabe is talking about. they arent cheap unless you already have a bar for it. 180 forjust the brace. i planned on fixing my subframe and buying one but i wrecked the car and now my new whip has built in support from the factory


Modified by 1slowcivic at 4:44 PM 4/19/2006


Modified by 1slowcivic at 4:44 PM 4/19/2006


Modified by 1slowcivic at 4:45 PM 4/19/2006

 

ASR!!!!! No worries, peace of mind, go carve the **** outta roads. Tried, trusted, and true


Modified by R-Lug at 11:45 PM 4/19/2006

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1slowcivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> i would be three wheeling everytime i went up one. which means i was transferring TWICE the amount of rear weight on that subframe/suspension.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You were running an extreme bar with very low springrates.

My car three wheeled when on stock and Pro-Kit suspension at autocrosses without a bar. You stick a bar on there, and all that weight transfer is concentrated on the paper thin subframe.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AutoXer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You were running an extreme bar with very low springrates.

My car three wheeled when on stock and Pro-Kit suspension at autocrosses without a bar. You stick a bar on there, and all that weight transfer is concentrated on the paper thin subframe.</TD></TR></TABLE>

yes i made that point for the thread starter so he understands why my subframe failure occured. like i said before i had no understanding of how it all worked at the time, i just threw it on there.

 

Anyone ever experienced this with a EG/EJ? Even with a beaks kit...?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM_Ej &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Anyone ever experienced this with a EG/EJ? Even with a beaks kit...?</TD></TR></TABLE>

EGs (and DCs) have a different design that doesn't seem to have the same problem as the EKs. There are lots of people running beaks on EGs with no problems at all.

 

I run a Progress 24mm adj. sway bar with my Tein SS and I never had any problem. I installed the bar like they said in the instructions and I also welded the brakets to the subframe to add some reinforcement.

The rear springs are 337lbs if I remember and its on my EJ1.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yellowturbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I run a Progress 24mm adj. sway bar ... its on my EJ1.</TD></TR></TABLE><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nonsense &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">EGs (and DCs) have a different design that doesn't seem to have the same problem as the EKs.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The Progress bar uses a different mounting location IIRC that incorporates the LCA bolt and doesnt have nearly the same problem with tearout as using the stock mounting location, even on EK

 

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1543919&page=2

If you read that thread, the force of the sway bar is pulling down on the subframe. I have constructed two hypothesis.
1) The bolt from the sway bar bracket (with a kit or not) will tear a hole in the subframe.
or
2) The subframe will tear completely from the car due to the force pulling straight downward.

Its all in the thread mention above with nice pictures.

 

i remember reading about this a while back. i just went with the comptech and i've never had a problem. i drive the car daily too and had the comptech piece for a couple years