A buddy and I took my F22B1 Accord engine apart a few weeks ago, but I've run into some money problems. So I won't have the money to purchase a JDM F22B, H23, or H22 like I wanted to. I need to put the engine back together for now. What recommendations do you guys have when putting everything back together? I have all the parts still, just a matter of putting them back where they belong Thanks for any help or advice!

EDIT: this is the first engine that I've ever attempted to put together ...

95AccordVTEC

 

do you know exactly which bearings were in each location and which side they came from? (ie: top/bottom halves)

did you mark the pistons as to which cylinder they came out of?

did you remove the crank from the block or just pull the pistons/rods?

do you own a factory shop manual? (<u>not</u> a crappy haynes/chiltons manual)

do you own a micrometer and/or have access to plastigauge?

do you have a rod bolt stretch gauge or <u>at the very least</u> a high quality torque wrench?

if the answer to most of the questions above is no, you may have some difficulty. if the answer is yes to most, read the assembly instructions very carefully, be very deliberate, measure everything accurately, and you should be OK to go.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notoriousB &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">do you have a rod bolt stretch gauge</TD></TR></TABLE>

Could you explain this a little more. I do have stuff of my own, but I also have access to many different guages and measuring equipment at work for the things I don't have. I will be building my motor and I've been researching a bunch of things and that was something I read a few times but I'm not clear on how it checks for that.

Thanks

 

sure. here is a picuture of a RBSG:



basically you take an initial measurement, set the gauge on both ends of the rod bold and pre-tension it to 0. (the rod bolt will have a dimple on each side for the gauge to sit in) Then, using an open end wrench, you tighten the bolt and watch the gauge (this is tricky and requires some "feel" - I did my first one about 3 times before I got the feel for doing this). You tighten the bolt until the gauge reads the recommended stretch value (which is application dependent but usually is about .004 - .006 - your rods will come with a spec sheet for the application). That's it!

 

so there really isn't a torque value, just when it stretches to the amount specified thats it?

So why does the Helm manual list a torque spec for the connecting rod nut? Is that incase you don't have a rod bolt stretch guage?

I'm assuming the rod bolt stretch guage is the recommended method of tightening the rod bolt/nut?

 

you hit the nail right on the head.

There is a torque value, but measuring a bolt's stretch is a MUCH more accurate way to gauge the actual forces exerted on the fastener.

If you don't have a stretch gauge you can get away w/ a torque wrench, however every torque wrench reads a little different, and if yours isn't recently calibrated there is a strong chance that it may be off a little bit (or even a lot).

Over time without calibration torque wrenches lose their accuracy, especially if handled roughly or not turned back to 0 when put back in the toolbox every time.

in automotive applications most of the time the opposite end of a bolt is not accessible for a stretch reading, so you have to rely on the torque wrench. where the bottom end is something you don't want problems with and the measurements are critical it is always best to measure every fastener as accurately as possible.

Another note: if you are building with aftermarket components, DO NOT use the torque values specified in a helms or a haynes manual. (especially not a haynes!) Use the values provided with each aftermarket component rather than the book values, as the manufacturer knows the best values for their part.

 

ok, that makes sence.

I have a good torque wrench but it hasn't been calibrated since it was bought. I am carefully with it and only use it for tightening, heard of some using it to loosen. But I was planning on getting it calibrated before I start putting my motor together. Where would I look to for calibrating my torque wrench? I know you won't know specific places in my area, but what should I look for?

I saw on Summit they carry the ARP guage for $138. Is that about the price they are going to run? Who are some good manufactures of that style guage and where can the be bought? I assume the ARP guage would be a good one? I know about companies that make normal dial guages and that, but I've never seen this style guage so thats why I ask, don't want to buy some cheapy brand you know.

yeah, I noticed aftermarket companies list there own torque specs. I figured I would use those, but thanks for reaffirming that for me.

 

I would look for "measurement houses" or "equipment calibration" places. Sorry I know that's pretty vague, you could stop by a local machine shop and ask them who does their calibrations. All machine shops regularly have their tools calibrated.

In my area a place called "hayes instruments" does some excellent calibration work on mechanical as well as electronic measuring devices.

the ARP gauge is good quality. I personally used a proform stretch gauge I got for like $45. it wasn't the best and was rather difficult to get the feel of, but it did work and worked well once I got the feel of using it. some gauges will sit right on the fastener and you don't even have to hold them at all when using them, which makes measurement much easier. the proform one was not like that, I had to hold it while measuring which was challenging.

The stretch gauge is basically just a dial indicator on a special bracket, so any reputable dial indicator manufacturer should offer a good stretch gauge.

 

ok, I'll have to look into that, thanks. I design cutters and inserts for a machine shop that makes carbide indexable milling cutters and inserts for companies like Ford, GM, Chrysler, Honda, Toyota, Nissan and other various companies. They send their dial indicators, micrometers, calipers, ect out to be calibrated, but I don't know if the company they use does torque wrenchs, I'll have to ask.

I'll keep that little tip in mind when I'm looking for a stretch guage.

Thanks for the explaination and help.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notoriousB &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">do you know exactly which bearings were in each location and which side they came from? (ie: top/bottom halves)

did you mark the pistons as to which cylinder they came out of?

did you remove the crank from the block or just pull the pistons/rods?

do you own a factory shop manual? (<u>not</u> a crappy haynes/chiltons manual)

do you own a micrometer and/or have access to plastigauge?

do you have a rod bolt stretch gauge or <u>at the very least</u> a high quality torque wrench?

if the answer to most of the questions above is no, you may have some difficulty. if the answer is yes to most, read the assembly instructions very carefully, be very deliberate, measure everything accurately, and you should be OK to go.</TD></TR></TABLE>
the bearing were never removed from the block. they are still in their original places

no the pistons/rods were not marked when the engine was disassembled. I didn't plan on having to use the engine later on ... figured I would just tinker with it. I should be able to match up which piston/rod came out of which cylinder due to the wear patterns on the wall and pistons

yes the crank was removed from the block

yes I own a factory service manual and I love it

no I dont have a micrometer or plastigauge, but I could probably buy them or borrow them

no I dont have a rod bolt stretch gauge, but I do own a high quality torque wrench

hopefully that information helps. I'll probably just end up buying the tools I dont already have. I've got a decent collection of tools now for working on cars, now I just need more knowledge to do so ....


Modified by 95AccordVtec at 10:48 PM 2/23/2006

 

sounds like you're in pretty good shape then. read the block assembly section in the FSM once or twice and then have at it.

Also I was just thinking - each piston/rod assembly should be marked with the cylinder # it came out of on both the rod cap and the corresponding rod end. match the numbers to each other, both facing the same side, and you're all set.

Make sure the arrow on the piston surface faces the #1 cylinder, and the rings are positioned per the FSM and install.

Have a go at it man just take your time and check all your clearances. Might want to throw a new oil pump, water pump and timing below on it while it's apart.

 

quick question...

When install new aftermarket rings on aftermarket pistons, should the pistons/rings come with install instructions or do you use the same install procedure thats in the FSM?

Not at that point yet, just wondering for future knowledge.

 

for rings it is the same installation process that is illustrated in the FSM. The ring gaps should be within the factory specs; some people prefer to run a slightly looser ring gap on higher horsepower applications to allow for more thermal expansion.

 

good to know

Thanks