Suspension setup opinions.......
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Suspension setup opinions.......
To begin with, I have a 99 Teg (GS Sedan).........car is used as a daily driver, with some spirited driving, but it is not autox'd. The goal of this is to make the car a). look better and b). handle better (i.e. be more fun to drive).
Planning on going with:
Springs: Tein H Tech
Shocks/Struts: Neuspeed/Koni Yellows (SP3's)
Rims/Tires: 17" ADR Sokudo 8's (205/40/17) wrapped in Kumho Ecsta 711's.
I know this is not the "best" setup possible, but I am able to get the above on a pretty modest budget.
Overall, what do you guys think?
Planning on going with:
Springs: Tein H Tech
Shocks/Struts: Neuspeed/Koni Yellows (SP3's)
Rims/Tires: 17" ADR Sokudo 8's (205/40/17) wrapped in Kumho Ecsta 711's.
I know this is not the "best" setup possible, but I am able to get the above on a pretty modest budget.
Overall, what do you guys think?
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From: The Hudson
Re: Suspension setup opinions....... (pnthr30)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pnthr30 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
handle better (i.e. be more fun to drive).
Springs: Tein H Tech
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Those two are mutually exlusive. I'd look into Eibach or H&R.
handle better (i.e. be more fun to drive).
Springs: Tein H Tech
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Those two are mutually exlusive. I'd look into Eibach or H&R.
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From: Toronto
Tein H-tech, meh..you'd be better of with ITR springs.
Instead of the shortened shock body of the SP3's, why not just get Koni Yellows and a spring like H&R Sports, which lower 1.75/1.5"
ITR will lower about 0.75" and with the spring perches of the yellows, I believe you can get another 0.25" to give you 1" total. ITR springs are 250/250 rates, so not firm by any means, but better then H-Tech by a mile
oh, and throw those Kumho 711's in the garbage and get a good tire. Suspension means crap with junk rubber, Azenis RT-615 on stock suspension would likely handle better then all this with those tires.
Instead of the shortened shock body of the SP3's, why not just get Koni Yellows and a spring like H&R Sports, which lower 1.75/1.5"
ITR will lower about 0.75" and with the spring perches of the yellows, I believe you can get another 0.25" to give you 1" total. ITR springs are 250/250 rates, so not firm by any means, but better then H-Tech by a mile
oh, and throw those Kumho 711's in the garbage and get a good tire. Suspension means crap with junk rubber, Azenis RT-615 on stock suspension would likely handle better then all this with those tires.
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Re: (alwaysoverkill)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Tein H-tech, meh..you'd be better of with ITR springs.
Instead of the shortened shock body of the SP3's, why not just get Koni Yellows and a spring like H&R Sports, which lower 1.75/1.5"
ITR will lower about 0.75" and with the spring perches of the yellows, I believe you can get another 0.25" to give you 1" total. ITR springs are 250/250 rates, so not firm by any means, but better then H-Tech by a mile
oh, and throw those Kumho 711's in the garbage and get a good tire. Suspension means crap with junk rubber, Azenis RT-615 on stock suspension would likely handle better then all this with those tires.</TD></TR></TABLE>I agree. Type-R springs and Koni Yellows. BTW this is coming from me, the owner of Tein suspension. The H-tech springs are not that good. For a simple, and effective setup, go with Type-R and koni.
Instead of the shortened shock body of the SP3's, why not just get Koni Yellows and a spring like H&R Sports, which lower 1.75/1.5"
ITR will lower about 0.75" and with the spring perches of the yellows, I believe you can get another 0.25" to give you 1" total. ITR springs are 250/250 rates, so not firm by any means, but better then H-Tech by a mile
oh, and throw those Kumho 711's in the garbage and get a good tire. Suspension means crap with junk rubber, Azenis RT-615 on stock suspension would likely handle better then all this with those tires.</TD></TR></TABLE>I agree. Type-R springs and Koni Yellows. BTW this is coming from me, the owner of Tein suspension. The H-tech springs are not that good. For a simple, and effective setup, go with Type-R and koni.
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From: The Hudson
Re: (alwaysoverkill)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Instead of the shortened shock body of the SP3's,</TD></TR></TABLE>
The SP3's are koni yellows with extra adjusments for the collare on the shock body; which can be better for height adjustment if you're using springs rather than the shock collar.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ITR will lower about 0.75" and with the spring perches of the yellows, I believe you can get another 0.25" to give you 1" total.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I beleive that the lower perch on the Konis is an inch lower than the stock position to begin with.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">oh, and throw those Kumho 711's in the garbage and get a good tire. Suspension means crap with junk rubber, Azenis RT-615 on stock suspension would likely handle better then all this with those tires.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The Kumo's aren't that bad. I know a few guys who race with them and have pretty good results. Azenis are overkill for the street. I have a set for the track, and run Yoko ES 100s for the street, and when I do run Azenis on the street, I can barely tell the difference between the two (and I have run the Yokos on track when I was in a pinch). You just don't reach the ultimate traction of a tire driving around.
I've actually seen some bad things happen on track when there's too much rubber without enough suspension control (super sticky tires, stock or near stock suspension). Mostly with hatches or higher CG cars.
The SP3's are koni yellows with extra adjusments for the collare on the shock body; which can be better for height adjustment if you're using springs rather than the shock collar.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ITR will lower about 0.75" and with the spring perches of the yellows, I believe you can get another 0.25" to give you 1" total.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I beleive that the lower perch on the Konis is an inch lower than the stock position to begin with.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">oh, and throw those Kumho 711's in the garbage and get a good tire. Suspension means crap with junk rubber, Azenis RT-615 on stock suspension would likely handle better then all this with those tires.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The Kumo's aren't that bad. I know a few guys who race with them and have pretty good results. Azenis are overkill for the street. I have a set for the track, and run Yoko ES 100s for the street, and when I do run Azenis on the street, I can barely tell the difference between the two (and I have run the Yokos on track when I was in a pinch). You just don't reach the ultimate traction of a tire driving around.
I've actually seen some bad things happen on track when there's too much rubber without enough suspension control (super sticky tires, stock or near stock suspension). Mostly with hatches or higher CG cars.
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From: I am Tyson
Re: Suspension setup opinions....... (pnthr30)
arent tein h.tech supposed to be super soft, softer than stock rates? very bad pairing with those yellows. why even bother? its going to give you a bad ride.
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Re: (alwaysoverkill)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by alwaysoverkill »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> ITR springs are 250/250 rates, so not firm by any means, but better then H-Tech by a mile</TD></TR></TABLE>
The H-Tech spring rates are 300/260........is that not slightly firmer than the ITR rates?
http://www.tein.com/ti/h96.html
Stock spring rates on the G3 teg are 212/117. The rates of the Pro-Kit (progressive springs) are approximately 10-15% stiffer than stock (equates to a spring rate of approximately 245/135) . The spring rates on the H&R OE's is 15-20% stiffer than stock (equates to a spring rate of approximately 255/140).
I can see that you guys are not big fans of the H-Techs, but I don't really understand why. Can someone give me a better explanation? I am not trying to be an ***, I am just curious.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tyson »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">arent tein h.tech supposed to be super soft, softer than stock rates? very bad pairing with those yellows. why even bother? its going to give you a bad ride.</TD></TR></TABLE>
It appears to me the spring rates are not all that soft. Why is it going to give me a bad ride?
Sorry for all the questions, guys........just trying to learn a bit here.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tornadom »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I agree. Type-R springs and Koni Yellows. BTW this is coming from me, the owner of Tein suspension. The H-tech springs are not that good. For a simple, and effective setup, go with Type-R and koni.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Since you have Tein's, can you elaborate on whey they aren't that good?
What are your opinions on Comptech Sport Springs?
Rate: F-335 R-135-210
Drop: F-1.25 R-1.25
F-linear R- progressive (of course)
Modified by pnthr30 at 3:58 PM 2/10/2006
The H-Tech spring rates are 300/260........is that not slightly firmer than the ITR rates?
http://www.tein.com/ti/h96.html
Stock spring rates on the G3 teg are 212/117. The rates of the Pro-Kit (progressive springs) are approximately 10-15% stiffer than stock (equates to a spring rate of approximately 245/135) . The spring rates on the H&R OE's is 15-20% stiffer than stock (equates to a spring rate of approximately 255/140).
I can see that you guys are not big fans of the H-Techs, but I don't really understand why. Can someone give me a better explanation? I am not trying to be an ***, I am just curious.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tyson »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">arent tein h.tech supposed to be super soft, softer than stock rates? very bad pairing with those yellows. why even bother? its going to give you a bad ride.</TD></TR></TABLE>
It appears to me the spring rates are not all that soft. Why is it going to give me a bad ride?
Sorry for all the questions, guys........just trying to learn a bit here.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tornadom »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I agree. Type-R springs and Koni Yellows. BTW this is coming from me, the owner of Tein suspension. The H-tech springs are not that good. For a simple, and effective setup, go with Type-R and koni.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Since you have Tein's, can you elaborate on whey they aren't that good?
What are your opinions on Comptech Sport Springs?
Rate: F-335 R-135-210
Drop: F-1.25 R-1.25
F-linear R- progressive (of course)
Modified by pnthr30 at 3:58 PM 2/10/2006
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From: Toronto
have you seen how much they lower...1.75" front, 0.9" rear, thats going to look stupid.
While the rates are better then I thought they were,that is a huge amount of height difference
H&R sports are 1.75/1.5" and have good rates.
Your pairing these springs with a quality shock, so a spring like H&R sport will match it will. Going to low will be alot of hassle and make the ride bouncy, so Eiback Pro-kit, Sportlines, H&R Sport, ITR are all good
While the rates are better then I thought they were,that is a huge amount of height difference
H&R sports are 1.75/1.5" and have good rates.
Your pairing these springs with a quality shock, so a spring like H&R sport will match it will. Going to low will be alot of hassle and make the ride bouncy, so Eiback Pro-kit, Sportlines, H&R Sport, ITR are all good
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Re: (pnthr30)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pnthr30 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
It appears to me the spring rates are not all that soft. Why is it going to give me a bad ride?
Modified by pnthr30 at 3:58 PM 2/10/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>
It might be because the springs would be overdamped when paired with the Koni Yellows. Ideally, you want your springs to be well matched to the dampers. In cases where they are severely mismatched, you will be over/underdamped and that leads to poor ride quality. Springs are only half the equation.
It appears to me the spring rates are not all that soft. Why is it going to give me a bad ride?
Modified by pnthr30 at 3:58 PM 2/10/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>
It might be because the springs would be overdamped when paired with the Koni Yellows. Ideally, you want your springs to be well matched to the dampers. In cases where they are severely mismatched, you will be over/underdamped and that leads to poor ride quality. Springs are only half the equation.
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Re: (PIC Performance)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PIC Performance »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
It might be because the springs would be overdamped when paired with the Koni Yellows. Ideally, you want your springs to be well matched to the dampers. In cases where they are severely mismatched, you will be over/underdamped and that leads to poor ride quality. Springs are only half the equation.</TD></TR></TABLE>
So the Comptech Sport springs, which are nearly identical to the Eibach Pro-Kit, would be a better match?
It might be because the springs would be overdamped when paired with the Koni Yellows. Ideally, you want your springs to be well matched to the dampers. In cases where they are severely mismatched, you will be over/underdamped and that leads to poor ride quality. Springs are only half the equation.</TD></TR></TABLE>
So the Comptech Sport springs, which are nearly identical to the Eibach Pro-Kit, would be a better match?
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From: Northern, CA
Re: (pnthr30)
I don not have Tein H-tech. I have Tein RS coil-overs, custom valved and re-sprung to 10k front, and 12k rear. I was simply stating that I am not a brand *****. I still think ITR springs, and Konis would yield a better ride quality.
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From: I am Tyson
Re: (pnthr30)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pnthr30 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It appears to me the spring rates are not all that soft. Why is it going to give me a bad ride?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
koni yellows are over damped for those spring rates. and with only adjustable rebound damping, youll end up suspension jacking. ive used koni yellows in the rear with stock springs. it wasnt good.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
koni yellows are over damped for those spring rates. and with only adjustable rebound damping, youll end up suspension jacking. ive used koni yellows in the rear with stock springs. it wasnt good.
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