Alright, My setup is a h22a head and h22a4 block sleeved to 89mm, pistons and rods and no balance shaft turboed using Hondata. I recently overheated my car and took it to the machine shop to have them do all the work. While it was apart I had them p@p the head and they bored it and threw in some oversized custom springs valves and retainers and refinished it cause it warped a bit. They also refinished the block, and cylinders. They pistons were torn up so I got new pistons and rings. Kept the rods cause they were fine. Got new custom rod bearings and main bearings. They refinished the crank too.
Now my question is about the crank. It is an h23 crank. I have head that they can hold the stress and I have head that they can't. I have heard I can and can't rev past a certain rpm. io heard I can't boost a certain amount. But what is the deal seriously? I redid all this stuff to make it dependable along with other stuff and get some serious hp/tq, including a new turbo setup. I got it done professionaly at a machine shop balanced and blue printed. Now will the crank be an issue? How high can I rev? How much boost can I run? Thanks.

 

As for my opinion, I would NOT put an H23 crank in and expect to rev past stock redline reliably. I would stick with an H22 crank, especially since you are boosted. The increase in displacement isn't worth the high possibility of spinning a bearing. The rebuild is too expensive, IMO. That's one less thing that can go wrong if you stick with the H22 crank.

 

Since you're boosting why not keep the H22 crank and up the boost a few pounds to get more power?

 

There's absolutely no reason to go more stroke and compromise your ability to rev higher, if you're going turbo.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h22Hatchy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Alright, My setup is a h22a head and h22a4 block sleeved to 89mm, pistons and rods and no balance shaft turboed using Hondata. I recently overheated my car and took it to the machine shop to have them do all the work. While it was apart I had them p@p the head and they bored it and threw in some oversized custom springs valves and retainers and refinished it cause it warped a bit. They also refinished the block, and cylinders. They pistons were torn up so I got new pistons and rings. Kept the rods cause they were fine. Got new custom rod bearings and main bearings. They refinished the crank too.
Now my question is about the crank. It is an h23 crank. I have head that they can hold the stress and I have head that they can't. I have heard I can and can't rev past a certain rpm. io heard I can't boost a certain amount. But what is the deal seriously? I redid all this stuff to make it dependable along with other stuff and get some serious hp/tq, including a new turbo setup. I got it done professionaly at a machine shop balanced and blue printed. Now will the crank be an issue? How high can I rev? How much boost can I run? Thanks. </TD></TR></TABLE>

The H23 crank will hold whatever you throw at it.. It is balanced from the factory, although probably not as well as the H22 crank(drill vs shaved counterweights), so you could have the machine shop balance it again for you..

The only other thing coming into play is the r/s ratio.. I wouldnt plan on revving any higher than 8,000 rpms with the H23 crank, just to be safe.. just run a TAD looser clearances on the crank mains and run 40-50wt oil (I run 5w40)

The stock H23 rev limit is 7,200 rpms, although the "red-line" on the tach shows 6,500 and it appears to stop their visually, however datalogging proves otherwise..

Sounds like you should have the torque curve of an H23, and the head flow of an H22 :D

 

Thanks for the info. Im not planning on reving to 8,000. I wanted to at least be able to rev to 7,000 though. I heard that I shouldnt rev past like 6,500. And for the crank it is already installed and the motor is assembled.
What about boost? How much recommended boost. I heard not to boost over 20psi. Is this tru?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h22Hatchy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for the info. Im not planning on reving to 8,000. I wanted to at least be able to rev to 7,000 though. I heard that I shouldnt rev past like 6,500. And for the crank it is already installed and the motor is assembled.
What about boost? How much recommended boost. I heard not to boost over 20psi. Is this tru?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well since the factory rev limit is 7,200, whoever told you that is full of BS.. but i wouldn't rev the **** out of it all the time.. do you know what they have the bearing clearances at?

As for boost, as long as your tune is good (conservative AFR/Timing) then you should be good to go.. There really isn't a limit on psi, just set a goal and tune for it.. If you feel iffy about it, don't do it..

I would go for 300 whp on a street tune, not hard on a stockish motor with a good setup..

 

go with the 95mm

 

Tru. Yaa I am probly just gonna rev to about 7,500. I figure no real need to go higher, especially if I want it to last. I don't know what they have the bearing clearance set at.
For power wise I plan on going for pretty high numders. I made more than 250 whp on my old setup before I made all the upgrades on a mostly stock motor with a crappy turbo setup.

 

Well lets hope you don't spin a main bearing then. I hope the extra 100 cc's is worth it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The_Head &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well lets hope you don't spin a main bearing then. I hope the extra 100 cc's is worth it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

seriously, an extra psi on the h22 crank is much safer and you can drag the torque out longer. the h22 will have a flater torque curve due to the better r/s ratio. the h22 head is well suited to flow for boost. just stick with the h22 and don't risk spining a bearing.

edit: W00t w00t 3k posts biotches!

 

Running the h23 crank is not that big of a deal. I ran it turbocharged for 5 years at over 350whp daily. I took mine to 8200 (8500 in 1st at track). If it is balanced...you will be fine at that.
My concern with your setup is the bore. If you are running 89mm turbocharged there is very little meat between the cylinders and the sleeves will be running a little thin (na is a different story). It is just a dicey setup for that reason. You can easily get away with running a h23 crank with a h22 head or the h23 head and reving it to 8k.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by prelittlelude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">seriously, an extra psi on the h22 crank is much safer and you can drag the torque out longer. the h22 will have a flater torque curve due to the better r/s ratio. the h22 head is well suited to flow for boost. just stick with the h22 and don't risk spining a bearing.

edit: W00t w00t 3k posts biotches!</TD></TR></TABLE>

H23 torque curve will be much better.. trust me

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GaRn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">H23 torque curve will be much better.. trust me</TD></TR></TABLE>

Noo, you trust him. He knows what he's talking about.

You think F1 cars run super low stroke, large bore FI engines for no reason? It's about area under the curve. When the curve is longer (rev higher), you're going to make more power/tq overall. You really want more tq, turn up the boost. Unless, you're a commercial diesel vehicle, you don't want high stroke with FI.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vinuneuro &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Noo, you trust him. He knows what he's talking about.

You think F1 cars run super low stroke, large bore FI engines for no reason? It's about area under the curve. When the curve is longer (rev higher), you're going to make more power/tq overall. You really want more tq, turn up the boost. Unless, you're a commercial diesel vehicle, you don't want high stroke with FI.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yea, I don't know what I am talking about

Show an H22 that has a flatter torque curve than my H23.. 3.8 psi.



more stroke = more torque down low.. I don't want a damn mountain shaped torque curve..

This is a STREET car, not a race/drag car.. comparing an F1 car to a street car is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard on here..

 

See there is always 2 different arguments. Half the people say one thing the others disagree. Don't rev high,.... Rev high. Stay at low boost,... Boost the hell out of it. Xes said he was runnen with it for 5 years turboed reving to 8200, daily. Then some of u say Ill spin a bearing.
The motor is already assembled like I already said, so I am gonna stick with the h23 crank. I just wanna know what it will be safe to rev to, and I wanna make lottss of power so I wanna know whats the most I should boost. I want good power down low and also increasing up high too.
That is a pretty flat torque curve. Could that possibly have to do with not having vtec though?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h22Hatchy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
That is a pretty flat torque curve. Could that possibly have to do with not having vtec though?</TD></TR></TABLE>

More than likely not, VTEC would allow good torque and better top end technically..

As far as how much boost you should push, like I mentioned, I wouldn't shoot for a specific amount of boost, but instead, shoot for a certain power..

You said you made 250 whp on your last setup, then I would shoot for 300-350 whp for the street.. that is plenty of power on the street anyways.. and if you wanna go to the strip/track, then up the boost and tune for that as well..

It's been proven lately that the stock bottom end can hold up pretty good as long as the tune is conservative and pretty good(stock h22's at 450-530whp) .. In the past everyone would say "All the stock block can hold is 7 psi" or whatever.. that idea has been shoved in the bottom of the closet IMO..

Go for it

I think you will be one of the first H22 w/H23 crank stock blocks to try this that I know of or have seen posted, so be a pioneer and don't listen to everyone that is bashing the idea that HAVE NO EXPERIENCE with it..

 

I used to have an H23VTEC so I do have experience with it.

I made power than more than that NA. and your dynograph is from 4000-6000 rpms. It's easy to get a flat torque curve for 2000 rpms.

To the thread originator, you already had your mind made up, it seems like you wasted our time. Seems to me you were just looking to the Internet for acceptance. If you go for years with no problems then congratulations. If you spin a bearing or throw a rod, dont make a thread crying about it. The fact is, an H23A1 crank wasn't designed for VTEC and high RPMS. Yeah, you're always going to have people pushing the envelope and getting away with it, but whatever you do with an H23A1 crank, you can do more with an H22A crank and for longer and for less risk. It's just 100 cc's that's nothing with were talking boost.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The_Head &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I used to have an H23VTEC so I do have experience with it.

I made power than more than that NA. and your dynograph is from 4000-6000 rpms. It's easy to get a flat torque curve for 2000 rpms.

To the thread originator, you already had your mind made up, it seems like you wasted our time. Seems to me you were just looking to the Internet for acceptance. If you go for years with no problems then congratulations. If you spin a bearing or throw a rod, dont make a thread crying about it. The fact is, an H23A1 crank wasn't designed for VTEC and high RPMS. Yeah, you're always going to have people pushing the envelope and getting away with it, but whatever you do with an H23A1 crank, you can do more with an H22A crank and for longer and for less risk. It's just 100 cc's that's nothing with were talking boost.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree with this man.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The_Head &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I used to have an H23VTEC so I do have experience with it.

I made power than more than that NA. and your dynograph is from 4000-6000 rpms. It's easy to get a flat torque curve for 2000 rpms.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Did you spin a main bearing?

Yea, its pretty easy to make 200+ whp on an H22 with I/H/E if you want to spend $1000 on a header..

Can you read? that was at 3.8 psi, without alcohol injection and timing that I now have..

The dyno I was at did the runs, so he started late/let off early.. its common knowledge higher stroke = more lower end torque

 

Nope, I did not spin a main, but others have.

and the reason I attacked your dyno chart was you were proclaiming how flat the torque curve was, which it was, its a nice graph. but its only a 2000 rpm powerband that is displayed. You were trying to put a spin on it and I just called you on it, that's all.

I wasn't disagreeing with you that a longer stroke gets you more low end. A smaller turbine/compressor combination could do the same as well. If one did the research they could properly size a turbo for adequate low end and good top end.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by The_Head &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Nope, I did not spin a main, but others have.

and the reason I attacked your dyno chart was you were proclaiming how flat the torque curve was, which it was, its a nice graph. but its only a 2000 rpm powerband that is displayed. You were trying to put a spin on it and I just called you on it, that's all.

I wasn't disagreeing with you that a longer stroke gets you more low end. A smaller turbine/compressor combination could do the same as well. If one did the research they could properly size a turbo for adequate low end and good top end.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I wasn't tryin to make it seem like somethin it wasnt, cuz anyone with a middle school math background can read a graph and knows how one can distort it and make it seem like whatever they want, but you can tell the torque curve would have been good by looking at it.. full boost is at 2900 rpms or so.. I need to get it redynoed at 9 psi now...

I just like off boost driveability on a street car..

 

H23 crank is Cast while the h22 crank is forged.

 

[QUOTE=The_Head]

To the thread originator, you already had your mind made up, it seems like you wasted our time. Seems to me you were just looking to the Internet for acceptance. If you go for years with no problems then congratulations. If you spin a bearing or throw a rod, dont make a thread crying about it.QUOTE]

I wasnt looking for acceptance and I didn't have my mind made up. If u feel I wasted your time then my apologys, and I guess go have your time wasted elsewhere. I said it clearly. The crank is already in the motor and the motor is completely put together. After all that, I am not going to have it taken apart and put an h22 crank in it and put it all together again and waste more time and money. Thats why my question was simple. I wanted to know from people who have more knowledge on the issue what rpm range I can go to safely and to what boost level so that I do not spin a bearing or break something.
Basically, I'm getting that the boost level doen't matter, just aim for a goal on power, which makes sense. For rpm it seems like it is still wishy washy cause u guys are still arguing about it. I didn't know that the stock rpm redline on the h23 was 7,200. I thought it was less, because with my jdm h22a my stock rev limit was about 7,200. I was hopeing to rev high since I got all the head work done, but reving to 7,200 is fine concidering thats what I was at before and I guess it will obviously be safer.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jdmcivicferio &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">H23 crank is Cast while the h22 crank is forged.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats just completely wrong, that how misinformation spreads..

H23 cranks are forged.