Well after two years of my car being down and saving money I go to put the short block together and we got problems. Please help and give input if you have any advice.
Here is my setup:
B18c1 block had it decked and honed by Jim Orl, fla
Cp 11:1 w/ eagle rods pistons brand new rods: ebay had jim recondition
Polished Type R crank new just polished
GSR head full package from Endyn only milled .010 "should have plenty of room"
head was my stock virgin head
All ARP hardware studs not bolts
Everything was balanced and checked (pin heights pistons etc. by me but I am amatuer)
Here is my problem I put the bottom in togehter got the pistons installed and when rotating over I see the pistons are coming above the deck by .015-.020 (I am guessing on height above deck) I set my head on block with no headgasket and I am hitting. So I set a mugen headgasket on with the head not torqued and I am still hitting. Dont know if the dome is hitting or the upper part above the skirts (need to clay head) Cp pistons have a real aggressive dome but I should have room correct? I set stock 3 layer headgasket on not torqed and does not hit but its not torqued down ethier. So where do I start? I suppose I need a large pair of calipers and measure cylinder wall height and make sure not too much matierial was removed when decked? Ck rod length (This is the only other thing used besides block) Any ideas please help I am open to any ideas just please dont bash this is my first complete build..
thanks alex

 

You need .035-.040 between the head and piston, as this is a GSR head, if the pistons are .020 proud, you will need a .060 head gasket.

 

How much did they take off the block when they "decked" it?

 

clay the motor......

 

thanks for all the input, I need to mic the height above the deck. The compression height on cp is 1.195 and on 81.5 bore endyn they are 1.185. So that difference should make it safe with stock head gasket but then I have to pull everything back apart again. So what I might do is just get a cometic .040 gasket. What do you guys think? I just dont want to lose compression but the car isnt for strait line its for road track so I shouldnt care about ultimate high compression but I would like to see some numbers.. and with pistons above deck it should make up for the thicker gasket correct? anyways thanks for everything.


Modified by wreckedagain at 11:54 AM 12/9/2005

 

also, he never told me how much he took off the deck I have tried calling but havent come up with anything yet. Maybe, and I am not bad mouthing Jim by any means he maybe had a bad pass and then had to redo it taking more off than planned

 

Go read post #2 again, .035-.040 piston to head.

 

very true very true, sorry for being ignorant

 

well I was way off the pistons stick out .047-.050 Know what should I do??

 

get some clay, plastigage or solder and determine what part of the piston is contacting the head. if its only the quench pads and not the domes, consider milling the quench pad portion of the pistons down, provided there is enough thickness to the crown. any machine shop with a dividing head or piston fixture should be able to do this. be sure to make all pistons weigh the same to a gram before reassembly. youre gonna wanna check piston to valve clearance as well. and id go to the high side (.040) of what don recommended for the sake of caution. the length of the skirts, rod to stroke ratio and piston to wall clearance all have an effect on how much the pistons will rock as they pass TDC. physically measure this clearance with solder or plastigage, not a calculator.

 

try using two stock head gasket it should work...a buddy of mine had the same problem....only his was ctr pistons.... one gasket didn't clear it but two did.... ran good and strong....13.02 @ 104mph 184whp 131lbs trq.

 

Contact Cometic, they make gaskets in almost every thickness.

 

cool, cool i appreciate all the input, but I am still extreemly worried or puzzeled why am I .047 above deck. I check my deck height which was 8.340 (I think that I measured it correctly)which is pretty damn close to spec. I am going to go check a buddy's virgin block to see what I come up with. I checked part numbers and I have part# sc7136 which is the 11:1 piston for a c5 which the compression height is about .010 more than a gsr a c5 calls for height of 1.195 I orderd gsr but whatever. The rods length check out to spec. As of right know everything is disassembled again I suppose I will reassemble and clay the pistons to see where there are hitting. Then I will reorder pistons depending on the outcome. Probably the endyn mid compression It has a pin height of 1.181 (I believe there site doesnt state height) but with that difference and a thicker gasket evrything should spec out, but man what a pain in the *** I just want to drive the damn thing...

 

most blocks and heads from honda have ***** in the deck a set distance from the surface, sort of like a wear indicator on slicks, for determining how much they have been milled. see how that virgin block compares.

 

cool thanks I never knew that. I feel Like a post ***** I have been a member since '01 and I have posted more in 3 days than the last 4 years

 

The 1.195 pin to deck is for the B16b "R" engine. 1.181 is for a LS, "R" , GSR. CP, Wiseco, etc . all make these pistons. Still should not be .047 above the deck, .o14 maybe. The piston you have is for a Civic Type R. Not what you are building.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by wreckedagain &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">cool thanks I never knew that. I feel Like a post ***** I have been a member since '01 and I have posted more in 3 days than the last 4 years </TD></TR></TABLE>

"Better to be thought a fool and remain silent than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt."

Or in this case, "A wise man speaks because he has something to say: a fool because he has to say something."

You only speak when you have something to say

Good luck with your issues.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DonF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The 1.195 pin to deck is for the B16b "R" engine. 1.181 is for a LS, "R" , GSR. CP, Wiseco, etc . all make these pistons. Still should not be .047 above the deck, .o14 maybe. The piston you have is for a Civic Type R. Not what you are building. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I agree that these are not the correct pistons but CP said that that part number is for a c5 but it still doesnt explain why they are .047 I am going to Jax beach too check out a virgin block. I hope that this is the case It will make this all come together maybe I wasnt measureing the block correctly. If that is the case I will get another block anyone have ball park on what they are going for. Stupid question I will just search...
thanks

 

Even with a "virgin" block the pistons will be proud.

 

stop thinking and stressing so much and just listen to don f. everything he has said has
been dead on. follow directions then MEASURE then be worry free.

 

The GSR rods are .039" longer than the LS rods. They would fit on the LS crank, but would have about .075" side clearance at the crank. This is way too much side clearance ( should be approx. .010"). Check this side clearance to see if you have the correct rods in it.

 

thanks for all the info