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http://www.scca.com/_FileLibra...k.pdf

 

OK you autocross guys...what's the party line on the new Si and how it will do in G Stock? One of these is on my short list of things to replace the Excursion with when I eventually cave and sell it.

 

If it will have a TSB for slotting the struts or crash-bolts like the EP Bus, then it's got half a chance.

After that it really boils down to whether or not you can stuff some big tires up front. Basically, you have to make it do everything a Mini can't, and it has to do it all flawlessly. If it the car doesn't do well in steady-state and corner-exit (is the LSD decent?) then I don't think it will be able to beat the Mini.

 

Any info on the gearing? IE: speed in 1st and 2nd? Are they 7" wide wheels at least? Any firm numbers on weight? At least Honda has not gone with run-flat tires yet so there is the weight of the spare, jack, and tools to take out, unlike the MCS. I have not seen any pics of the exhaust but I'm betting it is not the boat anchor the Mini setup is. I assume there will be a few lbs in the wheels too. How hard is it to get to the front sway bar on this chassis? Lots of newer front drivers with MacStruts bury the bar and basically need the whole front suspension dropped to get at them.

I think it will be good if the SI can really run against the MCS and open the class up a bit. Here's hoping for an interesting year.

 

My take on the 06 Civic Si just from looking at the numbers and comparing it to the MCS is that it might do well on some courses but I think the MCS will still take the win.

MCS:
-lighter @ 2500-2600lbs according to the internet and several people on SCCAFORUMS.
-better available torque
-shorter wheelbase
-now with LSD

06 Si:
-more stable due to the longer wheelbase
-17x7" wheels should be able to squeeze on 235-245 wide tires
-gearing? Might be better - who knows
-weighs in around 2800-2900lbs

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CivicSiRacer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
-gearing? Might be better - who knows
</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

With the Si going to GS, is the regular coupe heading to HS? With 140hp, 2550 pounds it could be a contender to bump the lesser mini's out of dominance.

 

New Si weighs in around 2840 lbs on our scales (no weight reduction).

2nd gear is only good to about 57 mph. LSD works pretty well on corner exit (about as well as the old DC2 ITR). Wheels are 17x7. Shouldn't be hard to cram a 235 on there, but the clearances are tight up front.

Wonder how anyone would police for a Hondata flash if the obvious (rev limiter) wasn't in play? They have our Si right now and should have a flash soon.

C_A_T

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by C_A_T &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">2nd gear is only good to about 57 mph. LSD works pretty well on corner exit (about as well as the old DC2 ITR). </TD></TR></TABLE>

A friend of mine clocked the following in a pre-production Si...
1st gear cuts at 38mph
2nd gear cuts at 59 mph
3rd gear cuts at 82 mph

 

The 99-05 Civic Si have been bumped to HS for 2006. I think it should be a great contender against the base model Mini.

What does the base Mini weigh in competition form? I know my 00 Civic Si would be around 2600-2650? Stock is 2712lbs. Put on a lighter exhaust, ligher wheels, and Konis and that should be about 100-150lbs?

 

Speedo reads a little high....

C_A_T

 

Wouldn't the JCW options installed from the factory murder the cars in GS??

 

If i ran a Cooper S in GS, I would not be worried about the Si frankly.

 

You know, it's really hard to tell how a car is going to do until people start running them competivtively.

I recall that a few years ago alll the s2k owners were terrified that the STi was going to absolutely rape them in stock class........we saw what happened.

In any case, the car seems to be quite capable on paper.

As always, time will tell.

 

Did Honda release any official weights on the Si? I mean the fully loaded EX weighs in at 2701. I'm a little skeptical that the K20/6sp would gain some 120+lbs over that...

 

I buy it. The engine/tranny with LSD probably gets you halfway there, and then there's the wing, larger wheels and tires and whatever else comes on the Si (extra VTEC is heavy!).

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TeamSlowdotOrg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I buy it. The engine/tranny with LSD probably gets you halfway there, and then there's the wing, larger wheels and tires and whatever else comes on the Si (extra VTEC is heavy!). </TD></TR></TABLE>

Hmnn on the MCS the sunroof is optional, its standard on the Si

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jay J &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Hmnn on the MCS the sunroof is optional, its standard on the Si </TD></TR></TABLE>

Which is a big reason why the Si is off of my list of new cars. Not that I'm some kind of wonderboy driver, and its not so much an issue of weight, its an issue of just plain old not fitting in the car. Without a helmet my head brushes the ceiling in the EX with a sunroof, unless the Si seats are much shorter I cant do it, and I'm probably not the only one.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by skierd &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Which is a big reason why the Si is off of my list of new cars. Not that I'm some kind of wonderboy driver, and its not so much an issue of weight, its an issue of just plain old not fitting in the car. Without a helmet my head brushes the ceiling in the EX with a sunroof, unless the Si seats are much shorter I cant do it, and I'm probably not the only one. </TD></TR></TABLE>

You could join the no seat rails club

 

Believe it. The R-series 1.8 in the lesser Civics is a tiny engine, smaller than the D-series in fact. Add in a limited slip, beefier tranny, bigger wheels/tires, etc. and the weight gain is quite reasonable.

The positive news is that you can lose weight fast (although not legally for stock class autocrossing). We've already taken out over 100 lbs without losing any features or function.

C_A_T

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wouldn't the JCW options installed from the factory murder the cars in GS?? </TD></TR></TABLE>

I forget where I saw that the JCW package is not legal for GS. I remember reading somewhere that the JCW package is going to BS for 2006 to test the waters.

 

I have the new Civic Brochures right in front of me:

Curb weights for manual transmissions:

dx : 2593
lx : 2654
ex : 2701
si : 2877

Wheelbase is 104.3"

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jay J &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You could join the no seat rails club </TD></TR></TABLE>

not in stock

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CivicSiRacer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I forget where I saw that the JCW package is not legal for GS. I remember reading somewhere that the JCW package is going to BS for 2006 to test the waters.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Just the JCW MCS as a whole or any JCW option added,

Because the JCW package can be broken down into the Airbox addon (intake), brakes, the S/C upgrade, and shocks/springs...

 

I don't think you have a good understanding of how Stock class works. Check out the rulebook.

Option packages must be available from the factory, and they can't be changed piece by piece. The factory JCW Mini Cooper S is classed in B-Stock. Every other JCW package Mini is classed in street prepared and is not eligible for Stock, since before it became a factory option it was a dealer installed option package.