1. Will a 2nd gen Integra rear bar bolt on to an EF Civic/CRX?

2. If so, is it larger than the Civic/CRX bar.

I've been given various and conflicting answers to these questions.

 

The two mount in pretty different ways, and from looking at the design of an EF civic i would say no.

 

You need one of these:

If you are patient with your parts sourcing, i bet you could put something together on the cheap

 

I doubt it would be within my 2 digit budget.

I intend to run no front bar, so I won't need much in the rear. Might experiment with poly bushings on the stock bar. I think that would cost about $8.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I doubt it would be within my 2 digit budget.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

You could do it for under $100 -

Get some arms, cut and drill to fit - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...wItem

Some heim joints - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...wItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...wItem

Bushings - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...wItem

And the bar.... i didnt see any on a quick ebay search, but they've gotta be out there.

You get the idea

 

I'll keep that in mind, but not until after testing.

I just don't think a CRX is going to need much bar in an autocross setup. Too much and you'd likely be chasing the thing all over the course. Fun, but not fast.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by slammed_93_hatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The two mount in pretty different ways</TD></TR></TABLE>
You're probably thinking DC. The 2nd gen Integra is the DA/DB from 90-93, it is similar to the 88-91 ED(EF).


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">1. Will a 2nd gen Integra rear bar bolt on to an EF Civic/CRX?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">2. If so, is it larger than the Civic/CRX bar.</TD></TR></TABLE>
According to this person http://www.ef-honda.com/ben/ (click Tech-&gt;EF Hybrid Suspension) it depended on whether the rear bar came from a coupe (14.7mm) or sedan (15.9mm). I've seen the 14.7mm in the boneyard, but have never found a 4dr car. The current online parts listings seem to only show the 14.7 for the 90-93's regardless of trim level. Not sure if it was a specific year or sometime during the last 15yrs the replacement parts got consolidated.

At any rate, for the one that is bigger, it isn't that much bigger. Poly bushings or Heim jointing the endlink will proably net you as much or more than the 0.9mm bar diff. If you already have the Civic/CRX Si 15mm, I say save the 2 digit budget for

 

Front Bar is bigger but i dont think you have any interest in that.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by XrcR6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Poly bushings or Heim jointing the endlink will proably net you as much or more than the 0.9mm bar diff. If you already have the Civic/CRX Si 15mm, I say save the 2 digit budget for </TD></TR></TABLE>

This will likely be plan A.

I was hoping maybe there was an integra out there with an 18mm bar.

 

Scott,

This is kind of OT, but I've got an incomplete Energy Suspension bushing kit you can have. It's got all the control arm stuff still in it. I think the only things missing are sway-bar ends and shifter bushings. Everything that I use sphericals for is still there. Shoot me an email if you want it...

 

I have a few spare sets of those sway bar blades.. $5 a set if your interested

 

For not a lot more than $100 you can get a 19mm ADDCO bar for the rear. Check their catalog. BTW: great folks to deal with. That is what I'm using on the CRX Si. It has been suggested that I disconnect the front 'stock' bar and see how that feels-but have yet to try it. THe car rotates just fine with the suspension I have.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by XrcR6 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
According to this person http://www.ef-honda.com/ben/ (click Tech-&gt;EF Hybrid Suspension) it depended on whether the rear bar came from a coupe (14.7mm) or sedan (15.9mm). I've seen the 14.7mm in the boneyard, but have never found a 4dr car. The current online parts listings seem to only show the 14.7 for the 90-93's regardless of trim level. Not sure if it was a specific year or sometime during the last 15yrs the replacement parts got consolidated.

At any rate, for the one that is bigger, it isn't that much bigger. Poly bushings or Heim jointing the endlink will proably net you as much or more than the 0.9mm bar diff. If you already have the Civic/CRX Si 15mm, I say save the 2 digit budget for </TD></TR></TABLE>

i will concur with alan.

i believe i've seen the slightly bigger bar in the junkyard on the 4drs. but i think it was 15.4, but dont quote me. certainly nothing like 18mm.

even my mugen EF rear bar is 22mm.

 

You could cut the bar on the end of the straight part then put a thicker steel sleeve over the bar and weld the ends/bar together again. I'm sure it would fit your budget.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RineRacing &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You could cut the bar on the end of the straight part then put a thicker steel sleeve over the bar and weld the ends/bar together again. I'm sure it would fit your budget.</TD></TR></TABLE>

thats not a bad idea. you can get junkyard bars for cheap and just fab up different strength ones based on length of the added size.

 

This is also something I've considered, although I was thinking more in terms of welding some sort of half-round to the bar instead of cutting/rewelding the bar.

I think I'll try the $8 worth of bushings first and go from there.
Testing will answer the questions. I'm not as concerned with getting the car to rotate (after all, its a CRX) as I am with more rear bar helping to keep the inside front down. Open diff = Try to keep the inside front down.

 

One of my old schemes you could try:

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fireant &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">One of my old schemes you could try:
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Picture no worky.

edit: Worky now.

 

Looks like its worth a shot, even if it sucked you could just get another crx bar, no big loss. Exactly how curved TQ arms transmit force and affect the stiffness of the bar is beyond me.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fireant &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">One of my old schemes you could try:
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Very nice idea

 

I did this on my DA about a year ago. It was much more effective than my SusTec bar. Cost around $125 total (ITR bar, endlinks, hardware, etc.) and took about 4 hours to get everything fabbed up correctly. Never had and frame tear out problems, like people who use those shitass mounting "kits" that are obscenely overpriced.

The same principal design will easily transfer over to an EF.



In this pic, you can get an idea of how I shimmed the OEM ITR D-bracket in order to space it the proper distance so the endlinks function correctly. The shims are made of 1/4" aluminum plates (to cut some weight) sandwiched between 3/8" steel plates (for added strength).

Unfortunetly, I had to use a few washers to shim the lower part of the plate shims to make everything flush. Some sort of bushing or collar here would be advisable, and I may change that around in the future.
I then drilled the holes through the subframe, using the D-brackets as a guide.



A profile shot of how well everything lines up. The top bolts go all the way through the subframe, and are reinforced on the opposite side with another 1 1/2" x 4" steel plate of 3/8" thickness (the barely visible blue plate near the exhaust pipe). This is, I think, the key to this install.

The bottom bolt could go all the through, but I chose to simply use a large, heavy on the inside of the subframe. I had to grind away the threaded hole for the ABS line bracket to get the lower bolt to sit flush inside the subframe.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by USDMHF1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I did this on my DA about a year ago. It was much more effective than my SusTec bar. Cost around $125 total (ITR bar, endlinks, hardware, etc.) and took about 4 hours to get everything fabbed up correctly. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats not a bad setup, but since I can get a brand new 22mm ST adjustable rear bar that will bolt right up for $150 it doesn't make much sense to go through all that work to save 25 bucks IMO.
And I'm not sure that won't eventually tear out. Those mounts don't look especially confidence inspiring to me and that section of the subframe was never intended to mount a bar.

Doesn't matter though. At this point I don't have $125 available in the budget. If I do anything with the rear bar it needs to be sub $50 (sub $25 would be nice).

 

They only made a 19mm bar for my car, so this was a viable alternative for me. If you looked around on HT, you can surely find a used bar for under $80, plus $15 for additional parts to install it.

As far as strength, look at some of the issues people have had with the older Beaks of BSQ Install kits (which are made for cars that aren't built to mount a bar like the ITR). Lots of tear-out issues. They don't go all the way through the subframe like my setup, nor do they have a 1/8" steel plate to reinforce the mount. I daily drove that car all over the southwest US on all sorts of roads and took it to a handful of HPDE's with no ill effects to the subframe. It's hardly a weak design...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by USDMHF1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">They only made a 19mm bar for my car, so this was a viable alternative for me. If you looked around on HT, you can surely find a used bar for under $80, plus $15 for additional parts to install it.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

who made that 19mm bar? ST?

interesting. ST does make a 19mm (3/4") rear bar for the DA, which im assuming fits the same as the EF. and their version comes with only the bar and bushings, since i guess all Integras came with the appropriate hardware, no extra hardware needed for fitment.


Modified by Tyson at 2:51 PM 9/12/2005

 

I have seen EF/DA style rear bars mounted on the new chassis, IMO the EF setup is much stronger.