I've been running my prelude in STS for a few years now, and pretty much the whole time I've been on the old 215 Azenis. From what I've heard, tread squirm was never really a problem with those.

Now I have some of the new 615's, and I keep hearing that they should be shaved to reduce squirm. But when I ran them this weekend (they were brand new) they felt even sharper than the old ones. Part of that may be because they didn't give out due to the heat halfway through the runs.

So basically, what am I supposed to be feeling?

And these are 195-14's on a 3g prelude.

 

I always assumed tread squirm was slight side-to-side movement while cornering, kind of like wiggling. I honestly can't say I've ever felt it though, on any of the cars I've driven.

 

It feels like a little bit more delay between the time you turn the steering wheel and the car starts to change direction.


What pressures are you running and were you running on the old ones?

 

Ah, interesting. I have felt that before then.

 

Tread squirm feels just like an excuse.

If tire squirm is getting in the way of your driving then you aren't the one driving the car; the car is driving you.

 

Jeremy,

I'm not sure I understand your comment completely. But if you are implying that tire squirm don't contribute to slower lap times, you are dead wrong. It makes huge difference, in the tone of about 2 sec per lap in typical road course.

 

I ran the 215's at 37f/28r.

It should be noted that I still have 215's on the rear. I only have the 615's on the front.

For my first set of runs I ran the 615's at 40psi, and the turn it and response was super sharp, but traction seemed lacking. I lowered them down to 37, and grip increase noticably, and there was minimal loss in response (they still felt better than the 215's).

I would think that any sway you might feel would be from sidewall flex. I would think that would be far less stiff than any full depth tread would be.

 

The question was autocross related so I'm not about to debate track results with autocross results.

The point I was getting at is that drivers are all to quick to blame anything other than the driver for slow times. Tire squirm, greasy tires, etc... which are actual factors but I would say that 95% of the time it wasn't the real reason for slow lap times.

Short Story: At an autocross event a driver whom I was coaching claimed his tires were getting greasy after his second (slower) run. I told him the tires are only greasy because he thinks they are greasy. If he was to focus on his driving and worry less about his "greasy" tires he would be faster. His third lap was the fastest and magically the tires didn't feel greasy.

Shorter Story: Some guy puts 4 wheels off at a track day during the very first session. During the download meeting he claims he tires got "greasy". Fat chance; it was driver error.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BA5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I ran the 215's at 37f/28r.

It should be noted that I still have 215's on the rear. I only have the 615's on the front.

For my first set of runs I ran the 615's at 40psi, and the turn it and response was super sharp, but traction seemed lacking. I lowered them down to 37, and grip increase noticably, and there was minimal loss in response (they still felt better than the 215's).

I would think that any sway you might feel would be from sidewall flex. I would think that would be far less stiff than any full depth tread would be.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Unless you have replaced the suspension bushings, I would think you'd have more bushing play than tread squirm, preventing you from feeling the tread squirm, if there is any.

On a side note, I can't identify any squirm on my RT-615s at full tread, but I was comming from the crappy stock Michelin XGT V4. So between my limited experience and bad point of reference, my perspective is a bit off.

 

Jeremy,

Your examples are classic blame it on the equipments excuse. I see your point and too met many people like that. I have no doubt, they are not using the equipments to the max yet, and it is easiest to blame the equipments than to blame your own self.

On the other hand, there are also another set of people, that are faster than the above individuals, but still don't use the equipments to the max. Sure, they are faster, but not enough skills that can benefit from shaved tires.

I have no idea on the original poster skill level or experience. I am not willing to speculate. I'm just answering the fact that the difference of shaved tires and unshaved tires is significant. On the Auto-X or track as I have experience in both.

 

I didn't mean for this question to really have anything to do with skill level.

I was just curious what it felt like so that I could determine if it is happening on my car, and take the necessary steps to eliminate it...

Which admittedly would probably just be to wait until the tread wears down!

 

ive only felt tread squirm on deep tread snow tires, never noticed on allseason or high performance tires, definitly not on azenis

 

Like warm apple pie...



Jimmy's right though -- snow tires are the only tires I've ever heard of that do any noticable squirming.