Hey whats up, I used to be a member on here and forgot my username and stuff.... anyway I remember a dude named notoriusB that was a lot of help previously... Anyway I have a 2000 accord lx 5 speed that was boosted and then I blew the engine... suprise suprise.... Well i knew this was going to happen, so I had bought a brand new engine, sent it to golden eagle to get sleeved with the HD sleeves, I bought CP pistons and Crower rods as well. I currently am running a garrett t25 turbo... they say its good for like 20psi and I can get maybe 350hp out of it. I will try and push that for now... the only problem is that damn thing spools too fast.... What should i upgrade to? perhaps a t3? I'd like to go as large as possible without melting my valves or some dumb **** like that. I have the money to spend and I want to see if I can get this f23 as close to 500hp as possible. I know my block is good, it comes with a garantee for up to 1300hp or 70psi. I will be using uberdata with an obd1 conversion kit and a p28 ecu... i hear the aem ems and fcon suck ***** and make ur car run like **** from EVERYONE, oh and they are a bastard to tune. So the car will be ready by the 25th and I'm ready to waste some more cash on it! help me out here.
thanks guys

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Shwanky420 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">anyway I remember a dude named notoriusB that was a lot of help previously... </TD></TR></TABLE>
hey, how's it going?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Shwanky420 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'd like to go as large as possible without melting my valves or some dumb **** like that. I have the money to spend and I want to see if I can get this f23 as close to 500hp as possible.</TD></TR></TABLE>
you won't melt your valves due to any particular turbo size. if you want hardcore power, look into a garrett GT30 or a GT35 series or perhaps an SC52 or SC60 from precision. hope you've got deep pockets because those aren't cheap.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Shwanky420 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i hear the aem ems and fcon suck ***** and make ur car run like **** from EVERYONE, oh and they are a bastard to tune. </TD></TR></TABLE>
well whoever you heard that from is the ball sucker. AEM EMS sucks? not. who ever said that doesn't know what the **** they are talking about. and it's EASY to tune <u>if you know the system</u>!

 

you ur tha man, im stoked ur still on here dude, i think you are A. one of the only people that knows what they are talking about, and B. are the only other one ******* with an f23... (or I think you are anyway) Anyway... how far can I push this thing you think? That is without blowing the engine... The pistons and rods are supposed to be good.. as for the head i don't know, its stock, and the block is garanteed so i'm not too worried about that. But just for when i dump it off at the shop what should i try and pull? also... where can I find a turbo manifold to fit any of the turbos that you just mentioned? I pretty much wanted to go all the way with this thing.... Ill throw down whatever for a bigger turbo, as long as it works and dosent blow my **** up right off Also should i run an open dump tube once getting another turbo? I bought an 04 STI that is producing 502.4 WHP at 24psi on pump gas, it has an open dump and I love the sound of that thing, it screams. Itsa really fun car.. I dont care too much for subarus but this thing will do 90 - 140mph in like 5 seconds, I smoked 4 bikes on the turnpike yesturday... thing is nasty.

 

how much did you get those sleves for?

 

awwww I'm blushing. i just try not to give advice if I don't know what I'm talking about...

the only other person on here that i can think of that's gone this crazy w/ the F23 is turbowa, and he's gone crazier than me. hopefully he's finally having better luck than me with his car by now... clint where are ya man??

the block, pistons, and rods that you listed will all go pretty much to the max HP your other components will support.

i think your limiting factor will be the SOHC cylinder head. not that it will break, just it's airflow capabilities. i think the head will choke the motor before anything else happens.

you may want to look into a cam and a seriouos P&P job, and perhaps some upgraded valve springs so you can rev it a little higher. or if you want to go silly swap to an H22 head. there is a thread somewhere here with someone who did this. called it a g23 i think (not sure why, maybe h+1?) and it's in the 'lude forum.

what size injectors are you planning to run? injectors can be a huge limiting factor for a build like this.

I personally would be more concerned about the match of the turbo to the motor than the pure size of it, as having a motor that has a wide powerband will be much more fun on the street than one that makes gobs of power in only a 1500 rpm range, especially with our low revving engines.

manifolds for the F23 are difficult to find. SFP makes them, you could get a DRAG or f-max (now turbonetics) cast mani, I'm pretty sure the GT series has a t3 turbine flange, not sure about the SC series. cody at lovefab will make you one but you'll have to send him a motor so he can mock it up... there's not much F-series love in the aftermarket.

no new turbo will blow your **** up right off unless it's not tuned!

run whatever kind of dump tube you want. if you like it, run it. I personally will be getting mine routed back into the downpipe as soon as my car runs reliably. i liked it at first, but now i hate the sound.

with an STI like that why even bother with the accord?

what kind of bikes? i <u>never once</u> lost to a car when i had my zx9.

 

Perfect thread for me... B been reading your info for a while finally got off the ground myself.
I too am running the EMS and LOVE it. Its very user friendly and the amount of information out there on AEM's forums is crazy. Im r unning the drag kit I purchased off of b_ronn about 6 months ago.
I too wanted to touch base with you on how you went about building your block as I too am looking to do this over the winter.
We called today to see how much a gt35/40r would be to throw on my setup and it was $1100 bucks, so Im likely going to go with a larger t3/t4 for now.
with some solid tuning and the help of water injection Im going to go for the 400whp club around september hopefully then tone it back until I build the block and get a cam from web
Also plan on making a custom 3" exhaust and uintake manifold salvaging the stock donor manifold flange plate i got from the g23 guy... something pirate is his forum name I'll have to look which should really allow the motor to breathe...
anyway I know I babble but had to chime in since i saw the thread!!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Im r unning the drag kit I purchased off of b_ronn about 6 months ago. </TD></TR></TABLE>
ahhhh you're the one!

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I too wanted to touch base with you on how you went about building your block as I too am looking to do this over the winter. </TD></TR></TABLE>
ask and ye shall receive. visit my build thread on http://honduh.com (shameless plug: best 6th gen i4 accord site out there IMO)

be prepared to spend some time, the thread is currently 18 pages and growing with lots and lots of pictures:
http://www.honduh.com/showthread.php?t=565

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">We called today to see how much a gt35/40r would be to throw on my setup and it was $1100 bucks, so Im likely going to go with a larger t3/t4 for now.</TD></TR></TABLE>
this made me LOL! suprised at the cost I am not.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">with some solid tuning and the help of water injection Im going to go for the 400whp club around september hopefully then tone it back until I build the block and get a cam from web</TD></TR></TABLE>
on a stock block? i hope this car is expendable to you, your motor will not last at all, i guarantee it. h2o injection or not. how can I talk you out of this idea?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also plan on making a custom 3" exhaust and uintake manifold salvaging the stock donor manifold flange plate i got from the g23 guy... something pirate is his forum name I'll have to look which should really allow the motor to breathe...</TD></TR></TABLE>
pirate mcfred?

custom IM huh? lots of r&d in those honda intake manifolds, hope you plan to flow test yours vs. theirs, i wouldn't be shocked if the OEM mani outflowed a custom plenum...

anyhow, thanks for the props guys, LMK if I can be of any help.

 

Thanks for the thread!!!

I'll take your word for it about the motor...

What numbers were you pushing when you're motors blew and what were the causes?

mcfred I think thats his name. His motor and numbers surprised me

As far as the manifold, yep just something to get more air to the head. We have a flow bench and alot of other tools at my disposal at work. PLus the fact I can make as many as I want to find the best one haha ;o

 

Hey B,

Haven't had much internet access sence I switched jobs. But the moneys alot better. I finally got the car back from the tuner. Thats the good part the bad part is the brand new turbo with less then 100mi's on it took a big ****. Its sitting at persicion right now. I'm hopping that the'll warranty it. We'll see. Out side of that little delema it was running like a rapped ape till it let go. It started to hit the inside of the compressor housing and was spitting oil out the exhaust side. Like I said I have no luck.

For a turbo I would go with a GT35R if you have the money. If you want to save some get a SC61. This will spool al little later for you and the power won't fall off.

Hey B, Hows your car coming along is the motor in the car yet?

 

boosted 6th gens...nice!

btw, b is right. ems is awesome and anyone who says it sucks is a ball sucker indeed.

good luck with the build. btw, i hear good things about gt3071 turbo. go with 3" exhaust if you can. sleeved block with built internals' gonna be awesome. but yeah, flow capacity of the head would worry me as well.

and yeah, definitely check out b's build thread.

good luck.

 

So I can use an h22 head? Let me see what i can find.... If I could do this and still use the same pistons and rods that would be awesome. Otherwise you say a serious port and polish would do me good? i was thinking about that, I would also like to put in oversize valves but where do we find **** like that for the f23? thats the hugest pain in the ***...... The only reason why I am still messing around with my accord is because I have always loved hondas and who really does this **** to an accord?? I think its pretty unique... and unexpected. As for the STI... this is my daily driver.. I have beat on this thing like there is no end and it loves it... I also bought it completely built from a friend who ownes a dyno shop.. The thing is mint.. 16,000 miles on the car and 2000 on the engine. I cranked up the boost to 27 psi yesturday and we measured 80 feet of rubber. Previously i had hated subarus... they way they looked... the people that drove them... and the sound of the damn things, but i really enjoy this thing. It dyno'd at 580hp last night.. the thing is ****** riduculous, if u are in the area u should come up and drive this thing! As for the bikes.. Im assuming they were 600's or something? I got em from 80 to 150mph no prob. The car tops out at 186.7mph! Anyway cant forget this is a honda site.... To whoever asked, my sleeves where $950 through Golden Eagle. its standard price u might get $900 through Benson.... Oh and Notorious... how much can these accord trannys take? I've got a good clutch and flywheel... i think its good to like 500hp.... but i'm assuming the tranny is pretty weak?
Also to anyone who is going to attempt to turbocharge an f23 without forged internals..... GOOD LUCK! u can probly run 5-7psi on a t25 making 200whp reliably for a few thousand miles (if your easy on it!)

 

yeah i was the guy askin prices i am planning on building the f23 up and boosting

anyways i thought that id let you b and whoever else know that i found aftermarket f23 axles that i saw on sportcompactonly.com

hope that i was some help

 

1st motor was roughly 200/200 on the afc hack (which is why it blew) ringland failure
2nd was at 242/268 (hp/trq) with massive amounts of oil blowing out the breather. reason: too agressive tune, blown ringlands
3rd was using the same tune, only lasted 2 weeks. glad I got tuned.

sounds like a nice hook up you have there! wanna make me one while you're at it? LOL

man your luck is as bad or worse than mine!!!!! hopefully they replace it for free for you, that sucks. so it's all broken in and was running strong?

mine is installed, and runs strong as HELL!! only running about 8 psi right now but pulls like crazy. when it starts that is. now my brakes are not working all the time either. weirdest problem ever: they work, work, work, then BAM! right to the floor and no brakes! replaced master cylinder, I've bled it twice (about 1/2 a gallon of brake fluid thru it), and still they don't work. and it only starts when it wants to... making some progress on that I think.....

H22 head on F23:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1069869

p&p wouldn't hurt for sure! oversized valves? :shrugs shoulders: not sure, haven't looked into upgrading the head at all... I have a sneaking suspicion that the F23 and F22 heads are pretty much identical, but I have absolutely NO INFO to back that up. so don't quote me!

any pics/specs/dyno sheets from this STI? sounds like a beast. I'm not a fan of the STI styling either, and it's funny how they normally sound exactly like my car sounded when I had a blown cylinder! but they make some serious power!

not sure on the transmission strength, but the good thing is that the transmissions are pretty cheap and easy to come by. They should take some serious abuse tho! I'll let you know once I get my **** tuned properly, or perhaps turbowa will be able to tell us sometime also, as he'll probably be running more power than I.

agreed on the stock internals... they're a crapshoot. I haven't had any luck. but I like to push the envelope as well.

DEFINITELY some help! I will check that out. my passenger's side axle is throwing grease... it's only a matter of time before it lets go. at least those are easy to change.

edit: wooo those are not cheap huh? damn. maybe I'll just get the autozone lifetime replacement specials.

-B


Modified by notoriousB at 11:58 AM 7/21/2005

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notoriousB &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
1st motor was roughly 200/200 on the afc hack (which is why it blew) ringland failure
2nd was at 242/268 (hp/trq) with massive amounts of oil blowing out the breather. reason: too agressive tune, blown ringlands
3rd was using the same tune, only lasted 2 weeks. glad I got tuned.

-B</TD></TR></TABLE>


Were you getting knock like crazy? What boost were you running on the second tune where you got up to 242 hp? How did you timing and a/f maps/values look?

 

That is the best description of how an STI sounds ever!! i blew a cylinder in my accord and it did sound exactly like it... Yea i've definately got a **** load of dyno sheets... I would have to scan them and then figure out how to put them on here... they are pretty ****** nuts..... I've done like 30 pulls with this car. I've got up to 627.3 on race fuel.... kinda pushing the **** out of it, but took it like a champ! Also the drivability of this thing is ******* incredible... all but first gear is awesome and mad smooth, although thats probly cause of the $1500 double disc clutch

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Were you getting knock like crazy? What boost were you running on the second tune where you got up to 242 hp? How did you timing and a/f maps/values look?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I wasn't tuning it, so I don't know about the knock. My guess is yes, it probably was. Glad I paid $550 to have my car destroyed. I didn't even make it home from the dyno, I got stranded on the side of a busy highway for 3 HOURS in 7 (yes seven) degree weather. Then to boot the tune destroyed a second stock motor at only 10 psi in under two weeks.

boost was about 13 lbs.

afr is boost comp map, beautiful. timing map is nice but probably way too agressive.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Shwanky420 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That is the best description of how an STI sounds ever!! i blew a cylinder in my accord and it did sound exactly like it... Yea i've definately got a **** load of dyno sheets... I would have to scan them and then figure out how to put them on here... they are pretty ****** nuts..... I've done like 30 pulls with this car. I've got up to 627.3 on race fuel.... kinda pushing the **** out of it, but took it like a champ! Also the drivability of this thing is ******* incredible... all but first gear is awesome and mad smooth, although thats probly cause of the $1500 double disc clutch </TD></TR></TABLE>
yeah the boxer motor just sounds WRONG and broken but it's neat!

damn shwanky man you's a balla!! got any spare vehicles you could send my way? LOL

 

My guess is your timing map is bunk.. just street tuning mine the day we got it in we spent the majority of the time doing pull after pull just to dial in the timing. Our motor is really finnicky with the timing, it' doesnt like much at all.

 

Yea dude I gotta 05 IS 300, bone stock daily driver (well not lately) loaded 20k miles for 28,000

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RMRf23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My guess is your timing map is bunk.. just street tuning mine the day we got it in we spent the majority of the time doing pull after pull just to dial in the timing. Our motor is really finnicky with the timing, it' doesnt like much at all.</TD></TR></TABLE>
yep I know... apparently my motor was screwed to begin with or my tuner just got a little jiggy with it.

so you have the turbo installed already, sweet. you know there are some MD members on honduh.com that you may or may not know: jweller, iobidder, 98exl?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Shwanky420 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yea dude I gotta 05 IS 300, bone stock daily driver (well not lately) loaded 20k miles for 28,000 </TD></TR></TABLE>
oh is that it? I'm not a balla like you.... if you said 2800 then I might consider it!

 

Yea theres a meet here around Aug 14th where I'll finally get to meet the BWI guys.... it's been along time coming.... but I'm a stickler about my car being as close to perfect before any "pictures" are taken haha Im really looking forward to the 14th though!