i have a 93 jdm stock h22 in my 95 accord coupe lx and i am doing a turbo upgrade, i was thinking about getting je 9.5:1 compression pistons but they said i needed to sleeve my block, so im wondering if there is any other way to go, like arias pistons or something eles..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AccludePower &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have a 93 jdm stock h22 in my 95 accord coupe lx and i am doing a turbo upgrade, i was thinking about getting je 9.5:1 compression pistons but they said i needed to sleeve my block, so im wondering if there is any other way to go, like arias pistons or something eles..</TD></TR></TABLE>

Mahle make the only pistons that do not require re-sleeving. This is what they claim. I don't have any personal experience with them, so I would suggest calling them or doing some research before buying.

FYI - i would post this in the Prelude forum.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Escobar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Mahle make the only pistons that do not require re-sleeving. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I have heard this as well but I too have no experience with them.

IMO with the FRM stock sleeves you should re-sleeve it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notoriousB &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I have heard this as well but I too have no experience with them.

IMO with the FRM stock sleeves you should re-sleeve it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Agreed. But, not all of us have that kind of budget. FRM sleeves are very strong and that 93 H block is a closed deck design. Re-sleeving is really not needed unless you're planning on running high boost.

I suggest that you call Mahle and ask some questions.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Escobar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Agreed. But, not all of us have that kind of budget. FRM sleeves are very strong and that 93 H block is a closed deck design. Re-sleeving is really not needed unless you're planning on running high boost. </TD></TR></TABLE>

It has nothing to do with open or closed deck design...it has to do with the frm sleeves and forged pistons will not rub on one another in a good way...you will need to sleeve your block if you want to do this build correctly...if you do not, plan on tearing it down again in 3-6 months due to sleeve/piston damage...

 

The only way to add aftermarket pistons in H22A is to resleeve or thats what ive been told. Id resleeve the motor just to be on the safe side since you are going turbo.

 

Or skip the pistons for now. Put your turbo kit on as is. Don't get nuts with the boost. Save money to get your block sleeved. Buy pistons, rods, bearings, arp bolts through out. Do it all at once. And have yourself a 500hp ready shortblock. Keep your downtime to a minimum.

 

Erm, I'd keep the kit off, if you have it installed already, then dunno what to say. If you have the boost, I see it more and more often then not, that a person will want to "play with it" sometimes and end up messing stuff up. Save it all for the end. I run a 94 2 Door, running a H22A. I got a Turbo and Intercooler set up and getting my block resleeved and rebuilt soon by a member in the S2000 group. Just taking it slow and playing with my H22a with the cam/valve job I have done to it already (all motor currently)

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Escobar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Mahle make the only pistons that do not require re-sleeving. This is what they claim. I don't have any personal experience with them, so I would suggest calling them or doing some research before buying.

FYI - i would post this in the Prelude forum.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

yes, i remember reading on one of the rocket forums about a brand of piston that also claimed able to run in h22 w/o resleeving, and after a little time they took pictures of the internals, destroyed cylinders and pistons...
i forget the company though, just a heads up incase you try and use a forged piston that claims frm ok...

 

yea i kno somebody who boosted an h-motor, not a great idea, i've heard that the h-series motor isn't that good when it comes to boost, if i were you, i'd go all motor on this project, but then again its up to you, but if u opt to go boost, deffinetly re-sleeve, check darton, they might have something for the h, dont forget to get the block balanced and blueprinted, it would make the difference and u'd be on the safe side

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nick H &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

It has nothing to do with open or closed deck design...it has to do with the frm sleeves and forged pistons will not rub on one another in a good way...you will need to sleeve your block if you want to do this build correctly...if you do not, plan on tearing it down again in 3-6 months due to sleeve/piston damage...</TD></TR></TABLE>

You missed the point Nick. We're talking about Mahle pistons as a replacement piston that does not need re-sleeving in an H22. That is the way Mahle is advertising and promoting their piston. It has a special coated skirt that allows you to run the pistons in H22 sleeves without re-sleeving. With any other forged piston, you need to resleeve. They offer a dished turbo piston for the H22.

Mahle is one of the original piston manufacturers in Germany. They inherited they're technology from F1 racing. Check them out http://www.mahle.com.
They have over 38,000 employees in 70 different countries.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by urfunny &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i've heard that the h-series motor isn't that good when it comes to boost</TD></TR></TABLE>
you heard wrong. the stock internals in an H22 aren't that good for boost. a sleeved, boosted h-series motor will be a monster!

 

Basicly I'm just reiterating what has already been said. You can't run forged pistons with FRM sleeves. Supposedly Mahle makes pistons that are compatible with the sleeves but I haven't heard of any expierences with them. I'd be wary of buying pistons from Mahle though because of this thread Earl made. And I think we all know Earl as a reputable engine builder. Although I believe Mahle is known for making good pistons for Porsches. Anyways, here's the thread:

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=991635

If you scroll down to the bottom you'll see someone else had the same problem with Mahle pistons.

 

That thread doesn't say anything of reverence. Did you even read it ??

The guy got pistons that we're boxed wrong or returned in the wrong box. Happens all the time.

If Mahle has 38,000 employees - they must be doing something write.

 

Does Darton even make sleeves for the h?

 

uh, YES. as do Golden Eagle, Benson (uses Darton I think), AEBS (are they still around), LA Sleeve, and I'm sure others as well...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Escobar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That thread doesn't say anything of reverence. Did you even read it ??

The guy got pistons that we're boxed wrong or returned in the wrong box. Happens all the time.

If Mahle has 38,000 employees - they must be doing something write.</TD></TR></TABLE>


They never came to the conclusion they were boxed wrong, sounds like you need to read the thread. Do you even know who Earl is? If it was just a wrong box problem I doubt he would have bothered posting it. But the fact JDogg also had the same problem makes you wonder. I think the number of employees hardly has anything to do with quality control. I just typed "Mahle" into the search box and clicked archived and found some other threads with negative comments about Mahle here you go. I only read through the top two threads.

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1201303

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Drag_On &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Only thing I've heard is what Earl has to say. He's had some bad things to say about them in other threads as well..

Its a catch 22 because its the only piston we can run in the stock sleeve..</TD></TR></TABLE>

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Innovation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The problem with Mahle pistons though, they valve reliefs arent cut right and some of the other final machining is off a bit. They are working on improving that (so I hear) butas of now, they are not a drop in no mod install by any means.</TD></TR></TABLE>

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1243826

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vti2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">We have teste the Mahle pistons on a b16 turbo hier in Germany, we had problems with it, one time brocke the ringlands an the other melt a piston.
We trade it for some CP, and the car is running licke a champ.
This pistons are good for some Fast Granturismo German car but for honda engines they don´t have enought experience with it.
Good luck </TD></TR></TABLE>

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Napoleon Dynamite &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Earl and other engine builders on this board said they were having quality issues with Mahle pistons. That means a lot more to me than thinking people hate them just because they're not CP's.</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

man let me tell you something i have a 95 lx sedan with a h22swap. je pistons crower rods t03/04e turbonetics turbo kit im running 12 psi and doing low 13s on the track never resleeved but i did port and polish and titanium springs and retainers so it all depends on what you really want man

 

If you are going to build a turbo motor and going to replace the pistons I would go on and sleeve it. So you can run more boost.. The motor being stock can hold little boost allready and with the sleeves that these motors have in them I would go and a get it bomb proofed by sleeving it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AccidentproWn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think the number of employees hardly has anything to do with quality control.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

You don't become that big with low quality control. Business 101.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Escobar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You don't become that big with low quality control. Business 101. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Apparently they have. Or at least they can't make Honda pistons very well it seems. 38,000 employee's yet they seem to mess up a lot of H22 pistons

I wonder how big SSautochrome is. I mean they keep coming out with new ****, someones obviously buying it.

 

Maybe someone should call them and mention this "apparent" problem with their H pistons and see what they have to say.

Maybe it was USER error.