I sold my 03 Evo and am aquiring a 96 hatch with a b16 swap this week. Dont ask why I sold it, there were various reasons why I had to get rid of it.

Anyways, I have no idea what is "good" suspension wise for an auto-x setup. I need opinions on spring/strut or coilover setup, swaybar(s), body bracing. I want to do an LSD, which brand? What is best for a wheel and tire setup that is still streetable, I dont want to get a dedicated wheel and tire setup quite yet. I was thinking some RA-1s, 615s, or RS-2s, what are people running?. I am looking to get the widest tire I can under the stock fenders. What is best wheel diameter, 15, 16, 17?

Forgot to mention... By the time I'm done with what I have planned for power, I will have to run in streetmod. My options are pretty open suspension and wheel/tire wise.

Help me out guys.

 

Konis of some variety with a basic coilover sleeve kit from someplace like Grond Control is the most common setup. Spring rates vary - usually higher in the rear - depends how firm you want it (assuming it's also a daily driver).

Sway bar - stock front and a 21mm or larger rear (Mugen, ITR, etc).

Wheels - not sure for street mod - most of the CSP/DSP/FSP guys run 13x8 with the widest Hoosier or Kumho they can fit. A 15x8 would probably work well in your application. I wouldn't go larger unless you know you have a good tire size (probably too tall).

LSD - Quaiffe, Kaaz, Cusco all work well. Or on a budget, use the ITR unit (not sure if it fits all the B-series cases or not, somebody here will know). OPM Motorsports can also build you one - some of the ITC/ITA guys use their piece and like it.

Bracing, etc - for autocross, it's just extra weight for the most part.

Just saw your tier/wheel will do doube duty, so scratch the 8" width - it sticks out from the fender a bit. 7" will fit.

 

First off, welcome. Let's get the boilerplate stuff out of the way... First, these questions have been covered very thoroughly already, so spend some time (actually a lot of time) searching through the existing posts. Second, if you are not already an experienced autocrosser, your money will be much better spent on getting experience behind the wheel than in modifying your car. So if you're just getting started, just go drive.

That being said, the typical autocross setup for Hondas involves shocks, springs, swaybars, and tires.

Koni yellows are a very popular shock choice.

Springs are typically in the 400-500 lb/in range, with the rears typically being 50-100 lb/in higher than the front.

Some people leave the stock front swaybar, while some either remove it or get a smaller one. You definitely want a bigger rear bar, in the 22mm range. Popular choices are stock Integra Type R (which requires a reinforcement kit), Comptech sway bar/tie bar combo, Suspension Techniques sway bar/tie bar combo, and this thing: https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1257726.

Since you're in SM, you'll be wanting R compound tires, probably in 225 x 14 or 15.

 

Thanks for the help. I have been autocrossing for about a year now. I am in no way an expierienced driver, but I'm not bad. I understand that I shoudl work on myself first. I will be modifying the car though, so I need a direction to go in.

I am in no way new to automotive forums, so I do fully understand the search function. I tried for a few minutes, but didn't find exactly what I was looking for, so I took the easy/lazy route and just posted.

Again, thanks for the welcome and the help.

 

Oh yeah, you'll also probably want front camber adjustment. The two most common approaches are eccentric upper arm bushings or replacement upper arms with moveable balljoints. For the second type, you'll hear Skunk2 arms mentioned a lot. You can get away without a rear camber adjuster, but they're available if you decide you need it.

Speaking of alignment, a decent starting point is zero to 1/8" toe out and -2.5 degrees camber in front, zero toe and -1.5 camber in the rear.

 

Rodney? Where's Rodney?

 

You already have to run in SM.

 

I hadnt looked at the rule book, but thats what I figured with the swap. I knew after the turbo setup that I would surely be in SM, so I didnt pay much attention what class it would be in before that.

I'm not putting the turbo setup on the car because I think it will help me in autox. I know it will probably hurt me, even at a low boost setting. I'm just so used to an Evo that ran a 12.2@ 113, that I have to do something for fun factor on the street. I like the power.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HeardEveryWord &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I was thinking some RA-1s, 615s, or RS-2s, what are people running?. </TD></TR></TABLE>

None of those. You really have two choices, Kumho V710 or Hoosier A3S05. Sure you could use something else but when you're already bringing a knife to a gun fight you can't be settling on "lesser" tires.

 

I understand that those tire choices wouldn't be nationaly competitive. Fortunately, in detroit region, we run TSM (street tire street modified). The class is HUGE, it usually has the best turnout, with the exception of STS.

I want to have a tire that is "good" for race purposes, and is still streetable.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HeardEveryWord &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I understand that those tire choices wouldn't be nationaly competitive. Fortunately, in detroit region, we run TSM (street tire street modified). The class is HUGE, it usually has the best turnout, with the exception of STS.

I want to have a tire that is "good" for race purposes, and is still streetable. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, RA-1s are not street tires - they are Toyo's DOT race tire.

For a street tier class, it's hard to beat Azenis. Some of the high dollar street tires might do better, but given the cost, Azenis is a very popular choice.

Some of the new Hankooks might be ok too. I don't know much about them.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">For a street tier class, it's hard to beat Azenis. Some of the high dollar street tires might do better, but given the cost, Azenis is a very popular choice.

Some of the new Hankooks might be ok too. I don't know much about them.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Also, the Kuhmo MX shaved to 4/32. Cheaper than Azenis and about the same price as Hankooks. I think most of the cars running 'kooks shave them as well.

 

go to redshiftmotorsports.com RedShiftChris (who is on this board) is the man when it comes to STS and SM Hondas. He has great info about how to do an STS hatch for cheap on the site. Also he is a fellow autocrosser.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Well, RA-1s are not street tires - they are Toyo's DOT race tire.</TD></TR></TABLE>

IMO, Toyo RA-1's are a great choice as street tire! (unless you mean "street" as in class- I don't know nuthin about AX anymore- those days are gooooone.....) But, to the original poster, RA-1's are very daily driveable. Believe it or not, they last a long time, and of course work awesome at Track Events. (unshaved of course)

As it has been said before, I don't think the RA-1's were meant to be AX tires. Better look into something else if you wanna be competetive.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Agent Smith &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Springs are typically in the 400-500 lb/in range, with the rears typically being 50-100 lb/in higher than the front.

</TD></TR></TABLE>
rears stronger than fronts? Oops, I just put my coilovers on backwards I guess. The fronts are 550 and rears 450. I figured the extra weight in front was to compensate for the engine. Am I wrong? I don't get it. I know the stiffer rear susp. helps your understeer but I would've never thought stronger in the back. All the cars I've seen have stronger spring rates in the front.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by D.CACO &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">IMO, Toyo RA-1's are a great choice as street tire! (unless you mean "street" as in class- I don't know nuthin about AX anymore- those days are gooooone.....) But, to the original poster, RA-1's are very daily driveable. Believe it or not, they last a long time, and of course work awesome at Track Events. (unshaved of course)

As it has been said before, I don't think the RA-1's were meant to be AX tires. Better look into something else if you wanna be competetive.</TD></TR></TABLE>

He said he'll be running a "Street Tire" class, so the RA-1 is a no go. But, you are correct that of the DOT R-compound tires, it's one of the most streetable (maybe the only one now - not sure if the new Kumho R tires are streetable).

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nsane1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
rears stronger than fronts? Oops, I just put my coilovers on backwards I guess. The fronts are 550 and rears 450. I figured the extra weight in front was to compensate for the engine. Am I wrong? I don't get it. I know the stiffer rear susp. helps your understeer but I would've never thought stronger in the back. All the cars I've seen have stronger spring rates in the front.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You put them on right. It's a US vs. Japan thing. A lot of people like stronger springs in back to get rotation (and fix toe under braking, and probably other reasons).

For street tire, consider the Hankook Z212 (RS2). But Azenis are probably going to be the mor popular/faster choice based on an "rumored" upcoming Grassroots Motorsports article.

Another autocross compound you might consider is the Hankook Z214 in their autocross compound. They come in autocross, track, and endurance compounds, so if you choose this route make sure you get the right one. Hard to find, but http://www.frisbyracetire/ is a distributor, with warehouses in Gurnee IL and Las Vegas.

-Chris

 

so which way is the stiffer in the rear the Japanese or American?

 

For a street car, which is designed to understeer (because it is safer), the springs are higher rate in the front. This is for handling as well as the extra wieght of the motor, because stock springrates are fairly low.

When you're getting into high rates, the extra weight isn't as much of a concern as the handling of the car. The higher rear rates will cause the car to rotate easier when on course, while lower rates in the rear will cause understeer (push or plow). It's really a preference, as with all suspension setups, as to how you want the car to behave.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nsane1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so which way is the stiffer in the rear the Japanese or American?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Search is down (?) but google found this thread.

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=933103

Stiffer front is JDM-tite yo, stiffer rear is the US trend, for FWD racecars.

-Chris

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Chris F &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=933103

Stiffer front is JDM-tite yo, stiffer rear is the US trend, for FWD racecars.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Good thread. I don't plan on staggering my tires or throwing 255s on anytime soon, so I think I'll stick with my stiff rear springs