I installed my omnipowers..

pre installment, I thought I'd twist in the entire bottom collar to shorten the strut to the max, and leave the rest as/is and install the set.

In doing so I lowered it WAY too much, so I adjusted the collar first a bit.. Then it was still too low and so I raised the lower spring perch. I untightend the top nut first, then raised the spring perch or at least a friend did.. he did say that @ some point it got heavy to adjust (i think because of the preload).. after that i tightend the top nut again (and I think here is where i went wrong).

I drove my car for a bit, and I noticed that on the highway its really bouncy on the shallow sway of the road.. it doesnt really stop.. I think because of too much preload on the back of the car..since the front i only touched the lower collar.

rest of the system:

Full-race tractionbar
some benen bars.

any truth to my assumption?

 

IIRC, you should not use the spring perch to adjust height. In most cases, you can achieve more than enough range of adjustment with the adjustable lower mount alone. I think you are right, though. The spring is preloaded too much. I *think* the spring should be 7" fully extended. I've found that on my car, and a few others, that having the springs compressed maybe 1/8" at most is fine, I've never went much more than that. Just enough to make sure there is no play in the spring.

 

Changed the preload.. still same issues..

Perhaps its because i lowered the front more than the back?

 

that shouldn't be the problem... as long as there's no strange differences in preloads, height shouldn't have too much to do with it (as long as it's not too extreme... any differences too big will give some sort of strange effect I guess)

try it like I did... take OEM and put them side to side: make the omnipowers X cm shorter than the OEM ones...

then install and it should be fine...

 

this might be a little off topic but would there be a difference in performance if lets say the 2 front shocks arent thesame height? because when i installed, we set both at the same height but one side was higher than the other? so, we adjusted till it was same all the way around.

 

on the omi's the damper length is nonproportional to the spring perch and outer sleeve thread extention.

Meaning simply; how far you extend the outer sleeve, will have no effect on the characteristics of the damper itself.
However, playing with the preload, or differing the length of the coil winding, wich does effect dampening characteristics, and especially messing with the left/right variances will upset the balance of the car.

In Dirk's case, I think the preload is just a part of the problem. I think we might have to try lowering the car a little in the back. Doing the same in the front seemed to have an effect on car balance. Shifting weight is a known problem with the EG hatchies because of the flat ***.

(you know, like a cheap white chick)

I think messing with the top hat locking thread and spring perch to adjust the preload was a BAD idea. (told ya to leave the nut alone) Turn the top hat nut to full lock, THEN lower the spring perch to remove the spring preload. Via the way you did it now, you seem to have inadvertently affected the dampening stroke of the piston.

BAD BAD idea.

 

preload on linear rate springs has no effect on handling....i still understand why people assume it does.

 

I think this design of damper not only affects the preload of the spring, but in doing so, you also influence the damper stroke. I'm not quite positive yet, but I assume this can't have a good result.

Lineair springs under preload will exaggerate the natural force they "push back" with with the initial load. You're basically shifting the load curve upwards. Not like a progressive spring.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SETI20 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think this design of damper not only affects the preload of the spring, but in doing so, you also influence the damper stroke. I'm not quite positive yet, but I assume this can't have a good result.

Lineair springs under preload will exaggerate the natural force they "push back" with with the initial load. You're basically shifting the load curve upwards. Not like a progressive spring.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Sorry, preload has no effect on how a linear-rate spring reacts to load, or how the car handles.

 

Basically you're precompressing the spring. I understand that with the weight of the car, you will exceed the amount of force you're putting on the spring with preloading.

What about the unloading of the spring on the rebound stroke?

 

Also, preloading the spring a certain amount will affect the dampening stroke. So that will most certainly affect the dampening. Wich is what I was pointing out in my previous post.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SETI20 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, preloading the spring a certain amount will affect the dampening stroke. So that will most certainly affect the dampening. Wich is what I was pointing out in my previous post.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You're assuming that the damping rate varies through the stroke of the shock, which in pretty much all cases isn't and shouldn't be true. Unless you're bottoming out the shock, in which case you have larger issues than bouncy ride.

Unloading the spring under re-bound again has no effect on anything, the ONLY thing preload is doing is keeping the spring on both perches and preventing rattling under full droop. That is all.

 

What would the effect of too much preload be?
You're effectively denying the spring it's full extention. And when I look at the springrate diagrams, you DO see an increase in force as the pressure/compression increases.

That's what lead to my conclusion that the load curve would be shifted upwards of the scale.

 

Bounce, bounce.. reinstalled the back, according to Omnipower installation guide.. lowered the back a bit more.. its somewhat better, but still on the really small sway of the road its not as tight as i thought it would be.. its actually pretty f*cking annoying..

Even my Skunk2 14/12 on Koni Yellow drove better then this. WAY better.

 

Well...it's a street setup. Bouncy is considered comfy. It reacts to small bumps. I agree with you that it's annoying.


Should I go ahead and order you the sport set...?

 

I agree with what SETI20 has said...perhaps we are just using the wrong terms here....

but back when we got the Apex-i N1s also with 3 position collars, we immediately put them on (teenage enthusiasm) and realized it was GANGBANGED low....The N1s were delivered with the lowest collar wound all the way to the top (I assume to make the damper short as possible = smaller boxes = lower overall shipping costs).

So we proceeded to crank the living **** outta the perch at the bottom of the spring to raise the car and I don't know how we did it (teenage ignorance + teenage raw POWAAa) but the car's height came up to an acceptable level.

But holy ****, did it ever ride terribly....it was a coma inducing stiff legged bounce like a pogo stick in your ***....It wasn't until somebody who had experience with the N1s told us to adjust the height INDEPENDENTLY - using only the lowest perch - and consequently we removed almost all the preload, did the ride quality and height finally meet our expectations.

coles notes:

With major preload (even on the damper's softest setting) = Pogo stick bumride

With height adjusted via lower perch and almost zero preload = acceptable ride + "infinite" height adjustability

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RagingAngel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I agree with what SETI20 has said...perhaps we are just using the wrong terms here....

but back when we got the Apex-i N1s also with 3 position collars, we immediately put them on (teenage enthusiasm) and realized it was GANGBANGED low....The N1s were delivered with the lowest collar wound all the way to the top (I assume to make the damper short as possible = smaller boxes = lower overall shipping costs).

So we proceeded to crank the living **** outta the perch at the bottom of the spring to raise the car and I don't know how we did it (teenage ignorance + teenage raw POWAAa) but the car's height came up to an acceptable level.

But holy ****, did it ever ride terribly....it was a coma inducing stiff legged bounce like a pogo stick in your ***....It wasn't until somebody who had experience with the N1s told us to adjust the height INDEPENDENTLY - using only the lowest perch - and consequently we removed almost all the preload, did the ride quality and height finally meet our expectations.

coles notes:

With major preload (even on the damper's softest setting) = Pogo stick bumride

With height adjusted via lower perch and almost zero preload = acceptable ride + "infinite" height adjustability</TD></TR></TABLE>

Now there is a strange one, no preload = good.. while omnipower says, short shocks NEED preload.

So what you are saying is, we need to put even less preload on the suspension & try again. (BTW SETI helped install the stuf)

 

You don't even have any preload as it is now.
I'm suspecting one of a few things:

a) Omnipower's struts and springs are proportioned wrong.
b) This is the inherent consequence of a fairly soft setup. (You're used to jaw breaking,kidney failing harsh)
c) the bushings are letting go on you
d) We incorrectly loaded the suspention.

 

mmm not sure what the hell you guys are doing up there in Fryslan... But what I did with the Teins is simple: Lock up the spring... barely... just so it won't be loose when I jack the car up...

Then I just turned the lower part of the shock, to make the shock itself shorter... I understood from Dirk, that the omnipowers have the same second height adjustability? So then why the hell haven't you done that?

And yes, beeing used to a stupidly harsh ride makes these street setups feel bouncy a bit... I'm still getting used to it myself... The CRX was WAY more predictable in certain corners... The civic just has this slide-grip-slide-grip feeling to it... (although the lack of the rear sway is most likely to be the cause of that)... but the following effect is that the car bounds and rebounds too much...

ah hell... if that was Dirk's only problem he'd be good... take the damned things apart and reinstall... if the omnis have that same shock-length adjustability I described, than make use of it...

 

Been there, done that.

Who do you think you're dealing with here you odd little brabo man.

 

with you and Dirk... that's why...

you guys'd rather have a gut-spilling harsh ride than doing stuff the 'normal' way... LOL

not unlike myself

but if you've done all of that... mmm... and the ride still sucks... either you suck for thinking it, or the ride actually sucks, which would make the omni setup not all that great a setup...?

 

Or its :

b) This is the inherent consequence of a fairly soft setup. (You're used to jaw breaking,kidney failing harsh)
c) the bushings are letting go on you
d) We incorrectly loaded the suspention.

now stfu or i'm charging for that last rim

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bart-EK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Lock up the spring... barely... just so it won't be loose when I jack the car up...

Then I just turned the lower part of the shock, to make the shock itself shorter... I understood from Dirk, that the omnipowers have the same second height adjustability? </TD></TR></TABLE>

This is exactly how I feel threaded coilovers should be set INITIALLY....then as you progress on to experimenting what works best for you and your application....you start adding more or less preload/height.....etc...etc....

 

I am really puzzled concerning a setup like this.
If the manufacturer states that you need to lock the perch, preload it, and then proceed to lower the car using the outer collar, and specifically state that the perches are NOT meant to lower the car...

Then what is the use of threading it? If the set is supposed to be model specific, why not sell them preloaded. You're not supposed to touch anything anyway. Why add 3 inches of threads on the shock body?

 

hey i just installed the omnipower coilovers and i hear sounds from the rear kinda like "clunk clunk" kinda sounds like its bottoming out or something.

anyone know what the problem might be?