Can I install 4 or 5 point harnesses without a harness bar and still be safe?

 

http://www.ompusa.com/harness_notes.htm

If you mount at more than a 45 degree angle, the chance of the belt folding the seat - and your spine - in half is pretty high in a collision. And if you strap in with 4 or more points, you can't duck in a rollover, so you'd better have a rollbar...which just so happens to double as a harness mounting bar. if yer gonna do it, do it right, we don't want anyone here to end up on a darwin award list "killed by his own seat belt install"

 

I've been meaning to sign up for that one!

 

haha only you ed

 

Can't you say the same with the 3 point harnesses too? They can be equally as deadly.

-Dozed - who has not found a way to duck with his 3 points.

 

uhmm.. lean towards the inside of the vehicle

 

People say duck, but that's not really the issue. If you're rolling over, you won't convince me that you'll have the presence of mind to "duck." However, your body's ability to be thrown or pushed toward the center of the car if the roof caves in will save your life. Unless your 3 pt belt consists of a horizontal lap belt and a vertical 3rd belt that goes right in between your eyes, you'll be able to move forward and toward the center of the car, even if you don't want to.

 

You obviously haven't strapped in w/a race harness before, have you?! Try it before you close the door! That's fun!

The 3 point belts were designed for cars w/o roll protection. They hold you in place pretty well but allow you some flexibility. Race harnesses allow no flexibility, so roll protection is required to keep your head in place.

 

ITR#231: I agree that most people (if anyone) would actually duck.. I was just telling him which direction to "duck" towards to see why they are safer without rollover protection compared to a 5 point setup with no roll bar/cage

 

Childs play. Start engine, put car in first gear, engage first gear, floor it, catch door before it slams shut, shut door, proceed to pit lane to enter track.

 

Been there...had to do that

 

I've tried that. I seriously cannot lean towards the center while being strapped on.

I mean, just think of it...they're much like 4 point harnesses, except the shoulder belts merge into one.

 

No, they are nothing like 4, 5 or 6 point harnesses. I'm not sure if you've ever sat/driven a car with a 4point or more harness, but if you have, I can't believe you'd make such a statement. It's incredibly easy to move around with the stock belt.

 

Haha...oh, I forgot to mention that I was using 3 point SCHROTH harnesses.

 

Seriously Chris, why do you want to do this? it's mad dangerous.

 

Don't laugh we had a guy in the Porsche 911 that almost did just that at Sears Point a couple of years ago.

Long story short. A bad (stupid) seat mounting sheared when he backed into the tires outside T2 at about 25 MPH. The seat came loose, and he hit his head on the back of the cage, got slack in the belts, which enabled him to hit the steering wheel too. He is now unconsceince, and pointing down hill. He rolls counter course into traffic (you should see the incar video from the other cars, Mr Toad would be jelous!), across the track to the paved access road outside T1. Then down a dirt path next to the fence line, and finally comes to rest pointing downhill into the tires outside T1.

BTW did I mention he caught the grass on fire?

We put out the fire and put up the guy in the ambulance. Dispite his stupidity he only had mild concussion and the car had a small dent in the rear valence.

Moral of the story:
$$ <> intelligence.

 

Another moral .... you can never spend too much on safty gear.

If you are fast enough to need 5pts, you are fast eneough to need a roll bar/cage.

 

yeah but check his sig...he has no interest in racing. I think the harness is for show.

 

Oh .. well in that case .. better order up some Monkey Bars as well.