can you guys point me in the right direction of online aerodynamic information

i know the basics

i have also found extensive info on the aerodynamic aspects of f1 cars.

i think something that discusses jgtc aerodynamics would probably be best

general info is nice but if i could find something that explains the best angles for diffusers and spoilers and so forth(generally speaking) that would be great.

i have tried searching but i usually just come up with f1 stuff.

the goal is to apply this stuff to an s2000

so if you have any specific info on the s2000's aerodynamic shortcomings and what not, please share.

thank you all

 

Without looking, I'm sure there are places that discuss aero for particular applications, such as the JGTC.

However, they would probably be discussion more of how their aero works within their rules. So, if you want to understand their aero packages, you must first understand how their stuff affects the way the car handles, how it affects speeds, etc.

Try google searching for Aerodynamics and like topics.

I hope that helps, but I'm not doing all the searching around for ya.

cheers

 

give http://www.kingmotorsports.com/ a call.....

all Mugen areo products are wind tunnel tested...... they should be able to give you some insight on aerodynamics.....

good luck....

 

- find or create a front splitter.
- cut the bumper in half or else channel the air through the bumper with vents travelling through a diffuser.
- the limitation will be a) smoothing out the air over the cabin which can be accomplished with a mugen hardtop or mooncraft hardtop and b) the windshield will provide the most drag on the car.
- seal up the bottom, but do it properly, providing proper ventilation to critical points.
- find or have a rear spoiler made, which is just above the cabin. you can experiment with a touch of oil, to see how effective it is.

but if you are doing this for the street, it will not make too much sense.

 

for the record i've google the bejesus out of this thing trying many search possibilities but i have had no luck. i was just wondering if you guys knew, off hand, were to find such info.

and also, i should clarify and say that i am looking for a tech report kind of thing, not an open forum

can anyone recommend a good book?

mr bagel, what do you mean about eperimenting with a touch of oil? please elaborate


and also i know that all racing series have restrictions and so forth, however in spite of those restictions, jgtc cars accomplish some amazing tasks, so i figure that they would be a good place to start.

i believe that the mugen aero parts "should" be the best because they are just about the only ones to windtunnel test, but some other designs "look" to be better.

i am just afraid to drop a few zillion dollars on marketing hipe and not get the results. therefore, i feel that if my understanding of these principals is strong, i should be able to spot a fake.

i have thought of doing alot of it my self. i have a dremel tool and an imagination, so who knows what can happen.

some ideas that i have been kicking around are: making a front splitter, making a complete undertray to smooth out the bottom of the car, cutting slits in the factory hood to allow air to escape, cutting a pattern from the rear bumper to allow for air to escape, similar to the spoon rear bumper and the j's rear bumper, possibly cutting vents behind the front fender to allow air to flow out when turning, and of course fabricating a rear diffuser.

i would make all of the parts, such as the rear diffuser and undertray, out of plexiglass from home depot, and if i feel that they are too heavy i can have them duplicated in carbon fiber. i can try to duplicate the hood and rear bumper by cutting the factory stuff and having it repainted.

i am not cheap, i just feel that this home made stuff would serve me just as well as aftermarket, and it would cost considerably less than going with the real deal.

please note that i undertsand that paint is not cheap, but i considered that a neccesity for any carbon fiber parts, i dont want a car that looks like it has carbon fiber parts. so i could buy the expensive after market stuff and have it painted or cut the factory parts and have them repainted.

thank you all for your responses. please keep them coming

 

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/ start here. read read read. then pick up some of the books he recommends. some are very expensive, others give a nice intro. check into the amazon reviews for how 'intro' or 'experienced' some of the material is.

even with the site above, and working with diffusers, it is more than just tooling, but there are some calculations that need to be made depending on the angle of the diffuser.

while I know you might be tooling around for experimentation purposes, best of luck. I just hope you can get out to the track (road course) and experiment with some of these ideas, but do make sure they are secure.

put a drop of oil, or a line of oil on the edge of a wing - not a spoiler (sorry about the correction there). you'll be able to see how much, if any at all, of the oil is travelling under or over the wing itself.

most designs out there are fluff, created by fast & furious enthuasists. others, which have racing teams and such, use each others' parts to get the most out of the cars they race under the restrictions and guidelines provided for a particular racing series.

diffuclt to spot fakes. I've even had an amuse copy and an authentic amuse right in front of me - bare. the lines are difficult and you have to work with them on a daily basis to even spot fakes. sometimes fakes, in an aerodynamic advantage piont of view will be overlooked due to other advantages the car might have or might not have.

get sheets of plastic for cheap dollars. work with those. work with mcmaster type of materials as well if you cannot find a local source. work out the designs in cardboard first, then cut away. with cardboard, you'll be able to measure and also experiment and mark the right holes. just put the car up on jackstands and have at it. make sure you get proper flow to and from the transmission.

as for the hood idea - look at the thoughts of hcash (harry cash) on s2ki.com. I believe he had larry up at bodywerks in chicago do the mod.[/quote]

want to experiement with wings and the rear bumper? buy spares from wrecked cars or parting out cars. doesn't matter color or condition, especially if you are taking em out to the track.

also, when and if you do take them out to the track, it is very important that 'seat of your pants' / aka - the butt dyno, does not count. track times, or speeds count. and to ensure credibility, logging everything from tires/tire pressures, etc. should be well noted with each date. the more data you have to go by, the more variances you will see. this includes temp, track temp, wind, etc.

 

thanks, any other suggestions fellas?

 

mugen SS is very aerodynamic...

amuse is selling their jgtc body kit that they use for the speed trial car, but im not sure if any are around. you would have to call amuse direct...

the s2000 from the factory is very aerodynamic, but certain parts can make this better. im looking into the top secret rear diffusor right now to help the air flow...

 

i allways hear that the s is not very aerodynamic. isnt the fact that its topspeed is drag limited a good indication of such?

i'm not arguing with you, i am litterally asking

 

the main piece that hurts our car is the windshield. has anyone been able to to find drag coefficients for our car? i looked and googled but found nothing. was trying to compare stock to mugen, etc...

 

Mugen does list the coefficeient of drag for thier kit on an s2000?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr.E.G. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Mugen does list the coefficeient of drag for thier kit on an s2000?</TD></TR></TABLE>

no, i have looked

 

mugen adds to aerodynamcis because most of the aero products were created in the wind tunnel...

their bumpers all have diffusors on them so they can dispurse the air...

 

we know that but i am looking for #'s. like cold hard facts

 

i would like to believe that the mugen stuff works, but who knows. thier kit doesnt come with a rear diffuser, that really compares to some of the other kits. i just cant see paying a lot without some proof.

if nothing else j's racing and the like race enough with their products that there is a lot of real world experience in the works

 

lets say you do the works. do these mods only help with handling or do they also help with acceleration.

question of the day:

if you have a bone stock s2000 that runs a 13.9, what can you expect to see after installing a host of aerodynamic parts?

obviously i dont want to do any of this stuff for drag racing, but i am just trying to see how much of a difference it will make in acceleration

 

i cant beleive u r gonna put home made parts on an s2000. but hey, what ever floats ur boat

 

i thought aero would help alot more on a RR car than a stock drag one. i doubt you will see any difference on a stock car

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr.E.G. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if you have a bone stock s2000 that runs a 13.9, what can you expect to see after installing a host of aerodynamic parts?

obviously i dont want to do any of this stuff for drag racing, but i am just trying to see how much of a difference it will make in acceleration</TD></TR></TABLE>
accelleration, not really. it will help the flow of air, and who knows, you might knock a few tenths off, but I seriously doubt it. wings, spoilers and such, create downforce. diffusers and undertrays prevent anti-lift characteristics. the latter can help with flowing air, but the former will prevent you from going as fast in a 1/4 mile. typically, downforce is done to prevent 'floaty' feelings at certain mph and also to hold you down in the corners.

 

i wasnt sure if it would help acceleration or not. i was just curious

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by sqeezincheeser &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i cant beleive u r gonna put home made parts on an s2000. but hey, what ever floats ur boat</TD></TR></TABLE>

as far as stuff that you cant see like an undertray... yes i have no problem with that.