I did a topic search and even went to Real Time Racing's website, but I still could use some more info.


What are some good things I can do to make my GSR handle? I'm leaning toward SCCA Solo II, but this car is driven daily... around 200 miles a week.

Besides struts/coilovers, what would be the next step?

I spent all day looking at traction bars, camber kits, strut braces, sway bars, etc.

Is there anyone here that has an outstanding GSR in autocross trim?

Any suggestions?

 

A bigger rear sway bar and better tires to start. Do a search, or keep an eye on the RR/AX board for plenty of info specific to GSR. There are several ppl who autocross GSRs.

But the best thing is to get out there and begin autocrossing, even stock. You also should check how certain mods will put you in different classes, so there are limitations. You will need to check the SCCA rule book.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sharad &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What are some good things I can do to make my GSR handle? I'm leaning toward SCCA Solo II, but this car is driven daily... around 200 miles a week.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Work on the driver. Evolution autocross school is a great investment.

My car handled like **** until I learned how to drive it.

 

it depends on what solo II class you want to be in. if you want to stay in GS, then you're pretty much limited to tires, shocks, alignment changes, and a front bar.

if you want to do STS, you can add aftermarket springs/coilovers. the ground control/koni setup is a common one that you'll hear about over and over on this board. you can also swap the rear bar, which will make a difference. just make sure to reinforce the subframe to avoid tearout issues. as long as you don't go crazy with the spring rates or lower the car drastically, it will still be very streetable with these mods.

there are other things you can do in these classes as well as higher prep classes, but i won't pretend to remember them all. if you don't already have a solo II rulebook, definitely pick one up.

hth,
jeff

 

Jeff,

THANK YOU for not automatically assuming I was a 16 year old kid who's never driven a car before!!!

Your response was what I was looking for. I'll look up the rules for STS. I know I'm not gonna run G Stock. I already ordered the Edelbrock/Eibach coilovers because I'm an Edelbrock dealer so it made sense... I suspect that all four tie bars, a set of traction bars, and the Energy Suspension mount inserts would give me the handling I'm looking for. (along with the bigger rear sway bar) My dilemma is I can only do a little bit at a time, so I basically wanted to determine what order of installation would be most effective for these mods.

The main complaints I have are the wheel hop and the push. I'm hoping the struts will help the hopping problem, but I don't know about the push. I've heard elsewhere about the "tear out issues" with the rear subframe. What's the best way to handle that? Seam weld it? Gussets? I sure could use some suggestions with pictures. I bet the rear sway bar will give me the steering I want, I just don't want to mess anything up. I'll be trading this car in for something else within a year or two.

Let me know what you think, and I'll get my hands on a Solo II book asap.


Targa250R, congratulations on learning how to drive your car.


[EDIT] Due to trial user status:

I don't know how best to tackle the push problem in my GSR because I'm just not a FWD type of guy. Probably 98% of my experience is with RWD cars. My ideal roadrace platform would be a C5 and my ideal autocross platform would be a Miata (or S2000) . Unfortunately with a 17 month old, neither of those cars were in the running for a daily driver.

The point is, I know enough to know how my inputs are affecting the handling. I just don't know what these GSRs like for chassis mods. In fact, I got the car to oversteer today with no hand brake, but that's not the point. The point is the car handles like a pig and I thought someone here might have some suggestions.

If Vitt and Targa want to assume that I don't know how to drive this car, assume away. I'd just rather have someone with actual chassis setup suggestions to contribute to this thread. If I wanted to get into a pissing contest, I could do that on the local boards. H-T is supposed to be where the experts are... Surely Jeff's not the only person on this board that knows how to balance out a GSR.


Modified by Sharad at 12:01 PM 3/30/2005

 

With all due respect, you have all that experience listed in your sig, and you still don't know what will help the problem with the push?

And, at your advanced stage, you should also know that the ideal set up largely depends on the drivers. Even RTR cars are set up different depending on the driver's preferences. So what is the point of reaching a general consensus? You want other ppl to tell you what your ideal set up should be?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My car handled like **** until I learned how to drive it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

There's more to this statement than most people can comprehend. Therefore your sarcasm is unwarranted.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sharad &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Jeff,

THANK YOU for not automatically assuming I was a 16 year old kid who's never driven a car before!!!

Your response was what I was looking for. I'll look up the rules for STS. I know I'm not gonna run G Stock. I already ordered the Edelbrock/Eibach coilovers because I'm an Edelbrock dealer so it made sense... I suspect that all four tie bars, a set of traction bars, and the Energy Suspension mount inserts would give me the handling I'm looking for. (along with the bigger rear sway bar) My dilemma is I can only do a little bit at a time, so I basically wanted to determine what order of installation would be most effective for these mods.

The main complaints I have are the wheel hop and the push. I'm hoping the struts will help the hopping problem, but I don't know about the push. I've heard elsewhere about the "tear out issues" with the rear subframe. What's the best way to handle that? Seam weld it? Gussets? I sure could use some suggestions with pictures. I bet the rear sway bar will give me the steering I want, I just don't want to mess anything up. I'll be trading this car in for something else within a year or two.

Let me know what you think, and I'll get my hands on a Solo II book asap.


Targa250R, congratulations on learning how to drive your car.


[EDIT] Due to trial user status:

I don't know how best to tackle the push problem in my GSR because I'm just not a FWD type of guy. Probably 98% of my experience is with RWD cars. My ideal roadrace platform would be a C5 and my ideal autocross platform would be a Miata (or S2000) . Unfortunately with a 17 month old, neither of those cars were in the running for a daily driver.

The point is, I know enough to know how my inputs are affecting the handling. I just don't know what these GSRs like for chassis mods. In fact, I got the car to oversteer today with no hand brake, but that's not the point. The point is the car handles like a pig and I thought someone here might have some suggestions.

If Vitt and Targa want to assume that I don't know how to drive this car, assume away. I'd just rather have someone with actual chassis setup suggestions to contribute to this thread. If I wanted to get into a pissing contest, I could do that on the local boards. H-T is supposed to be where the experts are... Surely Jeff's not the only person on this board that knows how to balance out a GSR.


Modified by Sharad at 12:01 PM 3/30/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>

dealing with the car only:

the push is going to be corrected by the right rear sway bar, the right spring rates (think 400F/500R or something along those lines), the dampers to handle those springs, the right tires, the right camber settings, and appropriate tire pressures.

you can address push in a number of ways, however the most common methods are with a sway bar and spring rates.

you don't need all that tie bar/strut bar/any bar crap unless you feel like you absolutely NEED to burn money on it. I've never been a believer in the 1000 different "barZ" on the market.

your priorities should be:
1) tires
2) shocks/coilovers or springs; or a full coilover kit. they need to have the proper spring rates for your style of driving.
3) negative camber (whether you get it naturally by lowering or need a kit to get to -2.5 deg or more in front)
4) rear sway bar

everything else is pretty much irrelevant or insignificant compared to the above when it comes to suspension modification.

 

Making your car "handle" is a very relative term. From the progression of this topic it appears that you want to build the car to handle well in STS.

Step 1: Read the STS rules (available at http://www.scca.org )
Step 2: Read the STS rules
Step 3: Generally speaking a good starting point would be 400f/600r with good shocks and at least a 22mm rear swaybar. This is assuming you already have some good tires on the car.

The tear out issues on the rear subframe is due to people mounting thicker rear swaybars without reinforcing the mount points. BSQ, Beaks or Comptech all have solutions to this problem.

Other notes:
Traction bars - Illegal for STS
Tie bars - minor (if any) improvement. Should be low on your list of things to buy.
ES inserts - should be low on your list of things to buy.

 

See, by consensus, this is what I was talking about:

Vitt1 - A bigger rear sway bar and better tires to start.

Jeff R - you can add aftermarket springs/coilovers. the ground control/koni setup is a common one ... you can also swap the rear bar ... just make sure to reinforce the subframe to avoid tearout issues. as long as you don't go crazy with the spring rates or lower the car drastically, it will still be very streetable with these mods.

Bad-monkey -

1) tires
2) shocks/coilovers or springs; or a full coilover kit. they need to have the proper spring rates for your style of driving.
3) negative camber (whether you get it naturally by lowering or need a kit to get to -2.5 deg or more in front)
4) rear sway bar

RineRacing - Generally speaking a good starting point would be 400f/600r with good shocks and at least a 22mm rear swaybar. The tear out issues on the rear subframe is due to people mounting thicker rear swaybars without reinforcing the mount points. BSQ, Beaks or Comptech all have solutions to this problem.

Other notes:
Traction bars - Illegal for STS
Tie bars - minor (if any) improvement. Should be low on your list of things to buy.
ES inserts - should be low on your list of things to buy.


Now that's what I call a general consensus. A bunch of experienced people basically saying the same thing.

As such, I'll try to sell the new 195/55-15s that came with the car to get some decent autocross tires. I'd guess they may last me till the end of the year? Next, I'll check the spring rates on my coilovers when they arrive on Friday. If they're not at least 400f/500r, I'll order new springs. After that, I'll get the sway bar along with whatever reinforcements I need for the subframe.

I'm guessing from what these people have said that these mods will make me MUCH happier with the balance of the car.

Thanks to those that contributed these comments.


I'll continue to look back in this post to see if anyone else has a contribution to this discussion.

Thanks again Honda Tech!!


Mmmmm, Comptech!




Modified by Sharad at 5:15 PM 3/30/2005