I know the older chassis (eg) had a problem with big rear bars and tear outs, but is this still the case on newer cars, like the 99-00 Si?
Just wondering if it is possible to go with an ITR setup with no bracing.

thanks

 

I don't recall any of our customers with newer Si type cars having that problem. It's usually the econo-box models that aren't as stout.

 

This was on a '97 Civic DX hatch, owned by a local driver. ITR 22mm rear bar with Beaks reinforcement kit. Not sure of the spring rates he was using in the rear, but it was at least 250 lbs-in because he's on GCs.

Original thread: https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1108514

Don't know if this helps any or not.

 

That's exactly what happened on my dad's swapped 97 hatch with Tein S-techs and ITR rear sway bar, along with the beaks kit. He had it repaired and reinforced, so well see how it goes. I think higher spring rates would eliviate a lot of stress on the area.

 

does the ITR that you guys are taking the swaybar from have its own reinforcement?

 

Yes, there have been quite a few people with tear outs over the years. That is the reason these guys made this kit!

http://www.a-spec-racing.com/products.php

Owner Charleston had a pretty bad tear out and decided to make up a real subframe brace that prevented the tear out. Lots of pics and such on that site, and the best brace I have seen to date. YOu can also get a 32mm hollow bar for the rear that really gives some great rotation.

 

no, i mean, does the ITR itself has reinforcement already built in, or are subframes being torn out of stock ITR's as well?

 

The ITR comes with the bar that many people have torn out their subframe with. Three posters in this thread alone ran the ITR bar on a non reinforced, Civics and it tore out. Obviously it wont tear out on an ITR with the ITR bar, and in fact I've never heard of this subframe tearing problem on an ITR.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tyson &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">no, i mean, does the ITR itself has reinforcement already built in, or are subframes being torn out of stock ITR's as well?</TD></TR></TABLE>

The ITR has thicker subframe material all together, plus a lower tie bar which should spread some of the load out as well.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pmachan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I know the older chassis (eg) had a problem with big rear bars and tear outs, but is this still the case on newer cars, like the 99-00 Si?
Just wondering if it is possible to go with an ITR setup with no bracing.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, the newer ones still have the problem. I've seen some posts with the ITR and Beaks kit tearing. Because of that, I opted for the Comptech adjustable with lower tie. Haven't had a problem yet, and haven't heard of any either. It's pricey, but I don't have to worry about tearout.

The ITR had a completely different subframe than the civics and integras which is why they can get away with it.

 

Thanks for the replies, the A-spec kit looks nice.

 

Comptech makes a similar set-up, but it's more expensive.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by prkiller &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yes, there have been quite a few people with tear outs over the years. That is the reason these guys made this kit!

http://www.a-spec-racing.com/products.php

Owner Charleston had a pretty bad tear out and decided to make up a real subframe brace that prevented the tear out. Lots of pics and such on that site, and the best brace I have seen to date. YOu can also get a 32mm hollow bar for the rear that really gives some great rotation. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Sweet Product it's bookmarked now to see what the EG kit looks like.

 

I love my A-spec kit...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jon V &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I love my A-spec kit...

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Wow!

It's so stiff that he lifts a wheel sitting still!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C5-EH2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wow!

It's so stiff that he lifts a wheel sitting still!

</TD></TR></TABLE>
32mm hollow race bar, daily driven
I have to admit, the front wheels were up on jack stands... but that rear wheel did lift while the other one was still on the ground...

Next time I put my car on the ramps & jack stands, I will take a good picture for you guys. It will be a little while though since my car is sitting on the bottom of my driveway with a blown motor...

 

Will any of these kits allow you to install a rear anti-roll bar on a 95 Civ EX Coupe that doesn't come with a stock one?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FormulaIntegra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Will any of these kits allow you to install a rear anti-roll bar on a 95 Civ EX Coupe that doesn't come with a stock one?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes. All of that generation Civic have the holes and stuff drilled. Just make sure whatever kit you get has the complete set of hardware and doesn't expect you to reuse stock fasteners.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Yes. All of that generation Civic have the holes and stuff drilled. Just make sure whatever kit you get has the complete set of hardware and doesn't expect you to reuse stock fasteners.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You might also have to get new rear lower control arms. some of the models didn't have LCA's with th mounting holes for the endlinks...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jon V &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You might also have to get new rear lower control arms. some of the models didn't have LCA's with th mounting holes for the endlinks...</TD></TR></TABLE>

IIRC, the EX did have the holes. And if not, why not just drill the holes and use a washer instead of going to the trouble of replacing control arms? Also, replacing the control arms would be illegal for many autocross classes, if that is a concern.

 

I had a ST rear sway bar and lower tie bar that I made with some H&R ITR springs and never had any problems on my 97 CX econobox hatch and I was not running one of those really nice comptech bars or anything like it
I think the major problems is when people are not running tie bars and stiff springs rates in conjunction with the bars to spread out the stress as stated above
oh and BEAKS makes a really kool lower tie bar that is light weight and really beefy looking pretty cheap too

also Suspention Techniques has sway bars for models that dont have the holes drilled from the factory

 

I've run the beaks and 22mm bar on my eg hatch for road/track/autoX with 0 issues... BUT my springrates were 500lbs in the rear with the 22... and with my newer 23mm I am running 14k (~700lbs).

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">IIRC, the EX did have the holes. And if not, why not just drill the holes and use a washer instead of going to the trouble of replacing control arms? Also, replacing the control arms would be illegal for many autocross classes, if that is a concern.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not if you replace them with other OEM factory honda LCA's ones that came predrilled...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

IIRC, the EX did have the holes. And if not, why not just drill the holes and use a washer instead of going to the trouble of replacing control arms? Also, replacing the control arms would be illegal for many autocross classes, if that is a concern.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not a concern, as I don't plan on doing any AX. This is a track only ITA/H4 *****. I wonder if the ABS equipped EX coupe (which mine is not) has an anti-sway bar? If so, it'd be a straight add if I could find one. Although, in ITA rules, sway bars are open (add, remove, modify as you like), so I could pull one off any other Civic and install, right?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FormulaIntegra &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Although, in ITA rules, sway bars are open (add, remove, modify as you like), so I could pull one off any other Civic and install, right?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I believe you can. The only question I have with this product, again in regards to Improved Touring, is about the piece that is added that unifies (sp) the left and right mounts. Is that legal for IT?